Help! Nitrate Reading Off the Charts!

[aquafox]

I have a 220 gallon reef tank. Here are the readings from my most recent test:
PH 8.0
Ammonia 0
Nitrite 0
Nitrate Over 160!!!
Alkalinity High (my kit doesn't give numbers - just low, normal, high - this reading is low on the "high" scale)
My equipment consists of skimmer, uv sterilizer, phosban reactor, and sump with bio balls. I am blaming the bio balls as my nitrate culprit and have already removed half the balls....I am about to remove the other half. I also have put in about a pound of carbon to try to remove some of the nitrates. I know a water change is in order but on what scale and what else can I do?
I also should mention that I thought my test kit might be bad so I borrowed another kit from a friend and got the same reading on my nitrates. All tank inhabitants appear to be fine - fish, corals, anemones - but I don't know how long they can handle this.
Any help would be most appreiciated!

 

[milomlo]

Well I say do a water change. I am still new at this, but seems that you would have some ammonia if you trates are that high. Still could be a bad test. Like I said I am new though.
Maybe someone else will be along soon who can help you.

 

[grumpygils]

How long have you had the tank and any recent changes? WHat is the substrate?
gg

 

[aquafox]

The tank has been set up since July 04....live sand bottom, about 450 lbs live rock. No visible problems with any inhabitants - the only thing I seem to have problems keeping are leathers. I even recently had a bubble tip split. No recent changes whatsoever - they are on the same feeding schedule, same foods, no new equipment, same ro system....nothing new....I am baffled.....the only thing I can think is the bio balls....and this has convinced me that they need to go....

 

[coachklm]

you could add a couple mesh bags full of de-nitrate to your filter system (bioballs used to be.) cleared up my nitrate problem in less then 2 hrs. but mines only a 90g so..... thats just a suggestion. I use seachem de-nitrate.

Just my opinion though.

 

[aquafox]

I am definitely willing to give it a try.....I am trying to think if anywhere local to me will carry it. Our saltwater fish store selection is not the best. Think Petsmart may carry it? Thanks for the suggestion, btw.

 

[zsalinas]

Hey man my nitrates were off the charts too. I had the problem for a while I even had my LFS test it and they couldn't believe it. I did a 50% water change and bought one of the big mesh bags and put some "Kents nitrate sponge" in the bad and placed it in the sump. Mine is only a 72 gal so you might want to do a couple of those mesh bags or something. It says you only have to replace it every 3 to 6 months. It cleared my nitrate problem right up. That's what I'd do or at least just try the sponge. Let me know how it works

 

[aquafox]

Thanks again for the help! I am already on the hunt for that stuff...these places around here are useless! Petsmart can't even get anyone on the phone and the other place close to me didn't even know what it was! I called a place a little further away and they have one small bag....don't know how much it will help but anything is better than what I've got so I think I am about to head that way....let's hope this helps...and no more d*mn bio balls!!!

 

[grumpygils]

Any idea what caused that? My one tankis a nano reef and a bust like that could smoke me in a day?
gg

 

[zsalinas]

Aquafox did you have any luck finding some of the nitrate sponge? If so how did it work? Just curious how everything worked out for you?

 

[bob a.]

I would do two things right away, a water change, as much as you can. If you can make it in a plastic garbage can that should give you about 35 gals. Stop feeding as much. What is your cleanup crew like? Who is getting all the junk in the tank? With a 220 reef, with as much rock as you have, you dont need the bio balls at all. I would also go with a nitrate sponge. If you cant get it local, try going online. If Saltwaterfish doesnt have it, you will find it somewhere else. Run that for awhile too. Also, there is something called a Denitrator, its some sort of device that uses nitrifying bacteria to pull excess nitrates out of the water. It might be worth a shot. I am surprised that you could be running such a high level of nitrates and the ammonia and nitrites are 0. Another longer term solution would be a refugium. That will allow you to grow macro algae like cheato to suck up nutrients like nitrates and phospahtes and will help keep copeopods flourishing.

 

[unleashed]

1st thing i would do is get some prime this a water conditioner to remove chlorine and chlorimide.but what this also does is detoxifies amonias and nitrates.it wont lower them but it will make the water safe for your fish while bringing these levels down will not change readings until you get the levels down.I would also concider a new type of test kit most fish show signs of amonia and nitrate symtoms if you watch carefully at 20 .160 is like swimming in a dirty toilet ps prime can be safely used up to 5x normal dosage without ill effect on you tank

 

[amandal]

The bio balls are most likely the culprit, or atleast a huge part of the problem. They're a great help in getting a tank established, but once the tank is mature, they really aren't necessary anymore. I'm not sure that removing them all at once is the solution, though. I would remove half, do a few good water changes, then remove another half of what's left, etc. until they are gone completely. I don't think there is any specific proportion you need to go by to phase them out, but if you remove them all at once, you IMMEDIATELY put the full burden on the bacteria within the tank. A gradual change (even if it is a very quick gradual change) may be better. I'm not an expert, or anywhere close, but that's my two cents.

 

[unleashed]

bioballs are not the culprate in this instance but they are a contributor.they dont tell you when you purchase them they have to be cleaned also.bioballs are not maintanance free. after time of bioballs in the tank the debres get trapped in the crevases left unattended to they will release nitrates back into your tank.no amount of wahter changes will change that effect.every couple of months remove all of the bio balls from the sump best time to do this is during a water change.swoosh them around in old discarded tank water to losen and release the waste particles trapped in the balls then place them back into the media area where they belong. normal maintance is to clean half at a time but in your case do them all but dont use fresh clean water this will kill the benificial bacteria you worked hard to get to begin with.always use discarded tank water.I have bioballs on my tanks with no nitrate problems I do this every 2-3 mos.carbons will not remove nitrates

 

[aquafox]

Thanks for all the info.....I have actually been battling this issue for a couple weeks now. Let me see if I can cover some of the info requested above.....nitrite and ammonia readings are definitely "0" and continue to be. The two different tests I used showed the same reading. I also ran a nitrate test on my RO water....just to be sure I am not inadvertently adding nitrates that way....it showed "0". I have managed to locate a cheap brand of nitrate absorber locally. I put that in and it reduced the nitrate some but not drastically. I have ordered some SeaChem De-Nitrate and I am hoping it will be here any day now.
I have changed changed about 40 gallons of water over the last couple of days and I have added and redirected existing powerheads to make the water flow in the tank more directly through the rocks - hopefully for better filtration. I have gradually, over the last two weeks removed the bio balls from the sump and replaced with an additional 25-30 lbs of live rock. Obviously that is not nearly enough to fill the sump but it does give something for the water to flow over. I have cut back feeding to every other day - I was feeding daily before, alternating between frozen foods like brine, krill, and bloodworms, and dry food. The fish show absolutely NO signs of stress - they all look great (I have tangs, chromis, mandarin goby, wrasse, clowns, cardinals). I have a large collection of polyps, mushrooms, leathers, anemones and tube worms and the only thing that seems to be deteriorating at all are the leathers. Everything else looks great and is responding normally so far.
My clean up crew is most likely lacking somewhat at this point. I do an order about twice per year of snails and hermits to replenish any that have perished and I had actually procrastinated and was waiting till after Christmas to do my next replenish. Right now there are still quite a few turbos and nassarius snails as well as blue leg and zebra hermits. I've also got about 4 brittle stars. But in a tank the size of this one, I generally try to keep the population higher than it is. I was actually thinking of ordering more clean up crew but didn't think it was prudent until I pull this nitrate level lower. So far nothing I have done has had a significant impact. The reading on the test is still off the scale.

 

[bob a.]

Just reread this thread, couple of other suggestions. First, do you have any sort of mechanical filtration? Something like a sponge or better yet some floss that will collect bits of debris that float around in the tank? I like to run a small hang on filter with floss and chemi-pure on the fowlr tank and previously on the reef I used a square of filter floss on top of the wet dry box (before I removed it and swapped skimmers for a sump skimmer). It was amazing the amount of junk that floss would collect even after a week of use. To keep it from becoming a nitrate factory, I would change the floss out about once a week. The other suggestion would be to get one of the vaccuum siphon tubes and clean out the sand or gravel bed a bit. You may have a large accumulation of detrius that isnt going anywhere and this may be the only way to get rid of it. Normally I would leave the sand bed alone in a reef, but obviously something is happening and you need to deal with it.
Finally, I would do another water change of 40 or more gallons. For that size tank, its only 20% and you havent tickled it yet. Our reef, a 92 had high phosphate rates that we couldnt get down, when it sprang a leak, I decided that I was not going to use any old water, even though the LFS owner said I should use maybe 20% or more. After the change, everything flourished. I also started the sump/refugium at that point and put in a phosphate reactor to keep things under control. If I were in your shoes, I would look at buying one or two plastic garbage cans and start making up enough water to do a 50-60% change. The cans are pretty cheap at walmart or some other local store and you know how much you have invested in the tank. It would be alot of work, but I think it would turn the tide on this problem. Good Luck

 

[aquafox]

It's been a couple of weeks now and I still am having no luck. We did another water change two days ago, 70 gallons, and there is enough de-nitrate in there for a 300 gallon tank (has been for about a week now) and nothing has changed - the readings don't come down at all - not even immediately after the water change. I even filled one of my two phos ban reactors with de-nitrate to make sure the water was flowing through properly and NOTHING! I bought another test kit because I was starting to mis-trust mine - no worries there - the new test kit reads just the same - no ammonia, no nitrite - just nitrate readings off the chart - it goes to 200 and my reading appears to be higher. My tube anemone is starting to show the effects.....my green hard corals are now dying....so far, everyone else is normal.
To answer some of the questions on the above post, I put filter floss over the sump when I took the bio-balls out. You are completely correct - it gets real nasty real fast. I bought enough exra to do regular changes and have changed it once already and will probably do it again tomorrow. I have a large skimmer that seems to be working well, uv sterilizer, phosban reactor, the 30 gallon sump now filled with live rock, there is also a sponge filter at the end of the process so the water flows through the filter floss, over the live rock, and out the sponge. It is then sucked through the phos ban reactor filled with phos ban and the other filled with de-nitrate, then through the uv sterilizer and into the skimmer. I have three powerheads in the tank in addition to the return and the water always seems to be moving well both down low and up high. I am wondering though, in response to the above post, if you are correct and that there is stuff collected behind all my live rock that has not been cleaned up. I have two veritable mountains of live rock.....and they are against the back glass on the tank with powerheads directed down into them.....I am thinking just moving the rocks around should churn up the debris. This is actually making me wonder if I have too much rock....in that the piles are so giant that they are making pockets of debris....and of course, the nitrate levels are more than likely the culprits of why I lost most of my cleaning crew.....I still have quite a few snails left and a few crabs but I have noticed that my shrimp are mostly gone and my emerald and sally lightfoot crabs are too...
I think the next step is to get out my tubs, siphon some tank water out and move quite a few of the rocks out to get the tank churned up. Does anyone have any idea how long my corals will be safe without light? I have mostly mushrooms and polyps. I also have multiple bubble tip anemones, a long tentacle and a sebae. I am thinking for any of them attached to rocks, it might be better for them to go into a tub without light for a day or two than to stay in the tank where all the movement will churn it up.....any thoughts from any of you?

 

[aquafox]

Finally improving....just thought I would share. After replacing all bio balls with live rock, about 150 gallon water change (twice in a two week period), a complete rearrange of the tank including removing about 100 lbs of rock, and adding a refugium with a large chunk of cheato from a really nice guy in Atlanta, my nitrates have dropped to the 80ppm range - now I know that is still very high but it's a tremendous improvement over my previous reading. I test daily and the levels continue to fall. I am happy to report the only major loss has been one hard coral....another is struggling but looking better today and my tube anemone looks a little better. All other corals, anemones and fish look great. I took the plunge today and after a very slow acclimation period, I added some cleaner clams and about 95 snails (cerlith, nassarius, and turbo) - I know they don't handle nitrates well but I took the chance because the clean up is very necessary at this point. I am hoping to continue to see the nitrate levels drop and then once they are near normal, I'll further bulk up the clean up crew. I think I really had a combination of things causing this problem and I used many of the suggestions from this post to get it this far. I just wanted to give everyone that offered assistance this update to let you know it's working. Thanks so much for helping me save my tank.....!!! :joy: