High nitrates. What's going on?

[wrassecal]

I changed to dsb about 4 1/2 months ago, some of you may remember Anyway, I keep having high nitrates getting up to around 80. I can't believe I'm saying this but when I had cc they were never over 20. It's 4 - 5 inches southdown with ls on top. Shouldn't it be kicking in by now?

 

[david s]

have you seen bubles cover the bottom of the substrate yet ?? for a day or so

 

[keiko]

Oh wow... I can't help but pls be sure to update for me Wrassecal! I was thinking of switching from cc to dsb too and would really like to know what happened!!

 

[bang guy]

Wrasscal,
Hi Do you have any worms in your sand bed? They have a critical part to play in the Nitrate reduction function of a DSB. have you read the article from Dr. Shimek?
Guy

 

[wrassecal]

Guy, I have some worms, now how many I couldn't tell you. I also have some green, red, brown algae going on in the upper area of the dsb against the glass, that's where I can tell best I have some worms. Why? Are you thinking about sending me some from the dungeon? Yes, I read R. Shimek's stuff on dsb's before I did it. I try to read everything I can by him. I am wondering if I have enough diversity in there or not though.

 

[bang guy]

4.5 months should be enough time to see some effect on the Nitrate level. How different does your sandbed look from mine?

 

[wrassecal]

Well, it looks pretty much the same except I don't have anywhere close to that many worms! that are visible anyway.

 

[bang guy]

Is there any chance you have something that would find sandbed worms tasty? Actually I think if you just have a few visible worms you probably have enough. Are you willing to give it another month? In the mean time do some aggressive water changes.

 

[nm reef]

Wrassecal...I'd also suggest looking for the source of the nitrates. The DSB should be able to effectively handle the bio-load of your system. I wonder whats going on to elevate your 'trates to begin with. Also...you may want to look at adding micro fauna to your DSB...personally I prefer getting crud from curing tanks...but a few sites sell kits that may help.As I remember your system it is curious why your 'trates continue to be a problem.....I agree that adding diversity and waiting may help...but like I mentioned search for the source of the nitrates also...and attempt to eliminate them at the source.

 

[wrassecal]

NMReef - I've been getting reef rubble/crud from the lfs for some time now since I saw a while back that you recommended it. Helps keep my pods up for the mandarin too. I haven't lost anything lately and I don't think I'm over feeding so I can't quite figure why the nitrates.
Guy - I did an almost 40% water change last Fri and I'll keep doing some each week to see if I can get them down. Just hope they will stay down.
I'm just stumped as to why they are going up in the first place.
We hatch and feed live brine once a week. Could the problem be coming from that?
The only thing I've ever seen trying to eat a worm is one of my cleaner shrimp.

 

[bang guy]

When you feed the baby brine do you strain them or do you also add the water they were in as well? As usual the Shark has come up with a very valid point about finding the source. What does the typical feeding look like in your tank? Is any of that caulerpa growing yet? That should remove nitrate as well.
Is there any other source of biologic filtration besides the rock and sand? I have an unproven theory that Nitrite reduction must be accomplished in the sand bed for Nitrate removal to be most effective.

 

[jonthefb]

i would throw a poy filter in there for the time being to remove some of th estuff, but also would hunt for th esource. Guy makes a god point askng about the water from the brine eggs, as this stuff is loaded with nitrates, and is very bad for your system. I would also recommend getting some caulerpa started in the tank as this will utilize some of the trates to grow. sorry ot hear of your prob, and i hope it fixes itself soon!
good luck
jon

 

[wrassecal]

Thanks everyone as I consider you all "experts".
Yes we feed the brine with the little airline tube so the water is going in there. We don't strain them, just start them with tank water and then back in it goes! Maybe, I came up with my own answer for source of the buildup. We feed it right away so as to get as much nutritional value as possible. What would be the best way to feed the brine?
I run an Emperor 400 on the tank and a protein skimmer.
The caulerpa is growing but it's not in that tank, it's in the 20 gal. I have a yellow tang and a coral beauty that eat the caulerpa I feed the main tank. I do add it in sometimes for them though it doesn't last long enough to do any good for nitrates. Guy, I think you are sending me some more pretty soon.? ? I wish I could get some of the grape caulerpa growing in the main tank, I'll try.

 

[ed r]

Debi,
I changed to a DSB in my 55g about 3 weeks after you. My nitrate has been zero almost from the start. I started with a pair of clowns and eventually added only a tiny Hippo tang and Royal Gramma so my fish load is lower than yours. I think your wrasse would definitely eat some of your DSB creatures. The Mandarin would eat only the ones on the surface of sand or rocks, but that doesn't help the situation. Can you reduce the feeding a little? When you had the lower nitrate reading with CC, did you have the same fish, or have you added some since? I don't suppose you have another tank where you could move a fish or two for a while? I think with a smaller fish load and less feeding, you should be able to get the nitrate down much more quickly.

 

[dad]

Hate to jump in like this but, I think the nitrate levels have nothing to do with the DSB.
It could be from overfeeding (as said above).
Any food that is not eaten within minutes will cause high nitrates.
Try feeding less at more entrevals(I cannot spell).
You really need to feed once a day. If there is any food left after 1/2 a minute, cut back.
If you miss a feeding now and then, no big deal,

 

[wrassecal]

Ed - You are right, I'm maxed out on fish. I really can't move any of them though.
I only feed once a day, varied diet with fresh frozen shrimp, squid etc, flake, frozen brine or the live brine once a week. I don't overfeed.
I am going to not hatch the brine this week and do another water change and try to see if that is the problem.
Thanks

 

[broomer5]

Out of curiosity - maybe test the brine shrimp hatching water.
I was unaware that this water contains nitrates.
Might be interesting next time you hatch some debi.

 

[wrassecal]

Duh..good idea Broomer, stating the obvious. That's why I love it here, sometimes I can't see even the obvious.

 

[tjkohler]

When brine shrimp hatch the water they hatch in will have huge, and I mean huge, amounts of nitrates. Just get the brine shrimp nets and transport them that way. From what I remember if you test the water after they hatch you'll see 100+ nitrate.

 

[bang guy]

It has been my experience that water from hatching brine shrimp is off the scale of my test kit for nitrate. Just take a scoop with a fine mesh net, rinse (fresh water is fine) and feed. As I recall you are using decapsulated eggs? Believe it or not you can feed them directly and they are actually more nutritious than hatched.
Debi - You should get the Caulerpa today. Let me know how it looks, etc... you know the drill