socal57che
Active Member
My wife flies quite often.
Your pilots are being disarmed.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...rogram-that-l/
Your pilots are being disarmed.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...rogram-that-l/
How many of you fly regularly?
- Thread starter socal57che
- Start date
uking smiley:
meowzer
Moderator
Originally Posted by jp30338
http:///forum/post/2990284
This is what we have U.S. Marshals for. Only properly trained law enforment officials should be able to carry a gun on a plane.
The article said the pilots had to go thru a safety course...
They didn't just get a gun handed to them at the gate.
http:///forum/post/2990284
This is what we have U.S. Marshals for. Only properly trained law enforment officials should be able to carry a gun on a plane.
The article said the pilots had to go thru a safety course...
They didn't just get a gun handed to them at the gate.
socal57che
Active Member
Originally Posted by jp30338
http:///forum/post/2990284
This is what we have U.S. Marshals for. Only properly trained law enforment officials should be able to carry a gun on a plane.
*
There is a pilot on EVERY plane. Air marshalls are few and far between. These pilots complete a FEDERAL weapons training course, not unlike the one your precious marshall did.
The pilot is the final line of defense between a possible hijacked plane and tall buildings. People have such short memories in this country.
I fly occasionally. I would rather have an armed pilot that never needs to use his weapon, than be flown into the side of a tall building along with 150 fellow passengers because my pilot lost a fistfight in the cockpit.
http:///forum/post/2990284
This is what we have U.S. Marshals for. Only properly trained law enforment officials should be able to carry a gun on a plane.
*
There is a pilot on EVERY plane. Air marshalls are few and far between. These pilots complete a FEDERAL weapons training course, not unlike the one your precious marshall did.
The pilot is the final line of defense between a possible hijacked plane and tall buildings. People have such short memories in this country.
I fly occasionally. I would rather have an armed pilot that never needs to use his weapon, than be flown into the side of a tall building along with 150 fellow passengers because my pilot lost a fistfight in the cockpit.
indy2009
Member
i'm a furloughed (layed off) Flight Attendant, before an unauthorized entry to the cockpit would occur, cockpit doors are redesigned, and before anyone could enter, the air marshalls would have the situation under control, they have special seat assignments, and if that fails the cockpit crews do have other mean of protection, which I do not want to reveal, so safety has changed after 911, and I personally don't think cockpit crew members no longer should have to carry firearms.
meowzer
Moderator
Originally Posted by socal57che
http:///forum/post/2990304
This is the stupidest thing I have read since the last time you posted...
http:///forum/post/2990304
This is the stupidest thing I have read since the last time you posted...
jp30338
Member
Originally Posted by meowzer
http:///forum/post/2990288
The article said the pilots had to go thru a safety course...
They didn't just get a gun handed to them at the gate.
Wow a gun safety course
http:///forum/post/2990288
The article said the pilots had to go thru a safety course...
They didn't just get a gun handed to them at the gate.
Wow a gun safety course
jp30338
Member
Originally Posted by socal57che
http:///forum/post/2990304
This is the stupidest thing I have read since the last time you posted...
There is a pilot on EVERY plane. Air marshalls are few and far between. These pilots complete a FEDERAL weapons training course, not unlike the one your precious marshall did.
The pilot is the final line of defense between a possible hijacked plane and tall buildings. People have such short memories in this country.
I fly occasionally. I would rather have an armed pilot that never needs to use his weapon, than be flown into the side of a tall building along with 150 fellow passengers because my pilot lost a fistfight in the cockpit.
Reported for name calling
http:///forum/post/2990304
This is the stupidest thing I have read since the last time you posted...
There is a pilot on EVERY plane. Air marshalls are few and far between. These pilots complete a FEDERAL weapons training course, not unlike the one your precious marshall did.
The pilot is the final line of defense between a possible hijacked plane and tall buildings. People have such short memories in this country.
I fly occasionally. I would rather have an armed pilot that never needs to use his weapon, than be flown into the side of a tall building along with 150 fellow passengers because my pilot lost a fistfight in the cockpit.
Reported for name calling
meowzer
Moderator
Originally Posted by jp30338
http:///forum/post/2990307
Wow a gun safety course
YUP and a Federal one too
http:///forum/post/2990307
Wow a gun safety course
YUP and a Federal one too
miaheatlvr
Active Member
POST 911 comment: Personally I think that NO GUNS on planes besides Marshals would be the best bet. I was wondering, if there are terrorists in the cabin of the plane, I dont think I want the PILOT to get out of the captains chair, open the cockpit door to go confront some kind of altercation, also there is a risk of him being overpowered by a number of terrorists, then you are really screwed. Or then how would a pilot captain get to utilize his firearm? Im curious to find out..
jp30338
Member
Originally Posted by MiaHeatLvr
http:///forum/post/2990313
POST 911 comment: Personally I think that NO GUNS on planes besides Marshals would be the best bet. I was wondering, if there are terrorists in the cabin of the plane, I dont think I want the PILOT to get out of the captains chair, open the cockpit door to go confront some kind of altercation, also there is a risk of him being overpowered by a number of terrorists, then you are really screwed. Or then how would a pilot captain get to utilize his firearm? Im curious to find out..
+1
http:///forum/post/2990313
POST 911 comment: Personally I think that NO GUNS on planes besides Marshals would be the best bet. I was wondering, if there are terrorists in the cabin of the plane, I dont think I want the PILOT to get out of the captains chair, open the cockpit door to go confront some kind of altercation, also there is a risk of him being overpowered by a number of terrorists, then you are really screwed. Or then how would a pilot captain get to utilize his firearm? Im curious to find out..
+1
socal57che
Active Member
Originally Posted by Indy2009
http:///forum/post/2990305
i'm a furloughed (layed off) Flight Attendant, before an unauthorized entry to the cockpit would occur, cockpit doors are redesigned, and before anyone could enter, the air marshalls would have the situation under control, they have special seat assignments, and if that fails the cockpit crews do have other mean of protection, which I do not want to reveal, so safety has changed after 911, and I personally don't think cockpit crew members no longer should have to carry firearms.
Please clarify your closing statement...It is a little hard to figure out what you are saying.
If the cockpit is, in fact, sealed from take off to landing then I agree that it is not necessary. Do the pilots have their own bathroom? Do they have their own source of food and drink? It the door opened during flight for any reason? Finally, is there a marshall on every flight?
There was a reason to allow pilots to be allowed to carry weapons. (also post 911) Is that reason now gone? If you can tell me that there is absolutely no circumstance where a pilot or cockpit would be compromised, then I would agree that the pilots need not be allowed to protect themselves or the cockpit with a firearm.
http:///forum/post/2990305
i'm a furloughed (layed off) Flight Attendant, before an unauthorized entry to the cockpit would occur, cockpit doors are redesigned, and before anyone could enter, the air marshalls would have the situation under control, they have special seat assignments, and if that fails the cockpit crews do have other mean of protection, which I do not want to reveal, so safety has changed after 911, and I personally don't think cockpit crew members no longer should have to carry firearms.
Please clarify your closing statement...It is a little hard to figure out what you are saying.
If the cockpit is, in fact, sealed from take off to landing then I agree that it is not necessary. Do the pilots have their own bathroom? Do they have their own source of food and drink? It the door opened during flight for any reason? Finally, is there a marshall on every flight?
There was a reason to allow pilots to be allowed to carry weapons. (also post 911) Is that reason now gone? If you can tell me that there is absolutely no circumstance where a pilot or cockpit would be compromised, then I would agree that the pilots need not be allowed to protect themselves or the cockpit with a firearm.
socal57che
Active Member
indy2009
Member
Originally Posted by socal57che
http:///forum/post/2990315
Please clarify your closing statement...It is a little hard to figure out what you are saying.
If the cockpit is, in fact, sealed from take off to landing then I agree that it is not necessary. Do the pilots have their own bathroom? Do they have their own source of food and drink? It the door opened during flight for any reason? Finally, is there a marshall on every flight?
There was a reason to allow pilots to be allowed to carry weapons. (also post 911) Is that reason now gone? If you can tell me that there is absolutely no circumstance where a pilot or cockpit would be compromised, then I would agree that the pilots need not be allowed to protect themselves or the cockpit with a firearm.
Cockpit cannot be accessed from the cabin side, before 911 we were able to access the cockpit with just a key, we are no longer able to do so, each carrier has their own procedure when a cockpit crew member exits the cockpit in flight, and no, air marshalls are not on every flight, air marshalls have special seat assignments, pax do not know whether air marshalls are on the flight or not, but as much as you say you or your wife fly, 90% of the time you have air marshalls on board, I would work a 3 day trip and would have air marshalls onboard every leg, i've been a Flight Attendant for 20+ years, I'm never afraid of a terriost take over onboard, i'm more afraid of engine failure or an electricial issue, which has happened, so if you are concerned about a take over onboard any US carrier, it is a very very slim chance that will ever occur again, and I'm not staying it would not be attempted, but chances are slim to none. The concern should be prior to inflight, it should be addressed with TSA, if they were actually doing their job, cockpit crew members wouldn't have to carry firearms.
http:///forum/post/2990315
Please clarify your closing statement...It is a little hard to figure out what you are saying.
If the cockpit is, in fact, sealed from take off to landing then I agree that it is not necessary. Do the pilots have their own bathroom? Do they have their own source of food and drink? It the door opened during flight for any reason? Finally, is there a marshall on every flight?
There was a reason to allow pilots to be allowed to carry weapons. (also post 911) Is that reason now gone? If you can tell me that there is absolutely no circumstance where a pilot or cockpit would be compromised, then I would agree that the pilots need not be allowed to protect themselves or the cockpit with a firearm.
Cockpit cannot be accessed from the cabin side, before 911 we were able to access the cockpit with just a key, we are no longer able to do so, each carrier has their own procedure when a cockpit crew member exits the cockpit in flight, and no, air marshalls are not on every flight, air marshalls have special seat assignments, pax do not know whether air marshalls are on the flight or not, but as much as you say you or your wife fly, 90% of the time you have air marshalls on board, I would work a 3 day trip and would have air marshalls onboard every leg, i've been a Flight Attendant for 20+ years, I'm never afraid of a terriost take over onboard, i'm more afraid of engine failure or an electricial issue, which has happened, so if you are concerned about a take over onboard any US carrier, it is a very very slim chance that will ever occur again, and I'm not staying it would not be attempted, but chances are slim to none. The concern should be prior to inflight, it should be addressed with TSA, if they were actually doing their job, cockpit crew members wouldn't have to carry firearms.
1journeyman
Active Member
90%?????
Do you realize how many flights are flown domestically and Internationally in the USA every day?
I personally would be amazed if 9% of the flights have a Marshall on board.
Do you realize how many flights are flown domestically and Internationally in the USA every day?
I personally would be amazed if 9% of the flights have a Marshall on board.
indy2009
Member
Originally Posted by 1journeyman
http:///forum/post/2990351
90%?????
Do you realize how many flights are flown domestically and Internationally in the USA every day?
I personally would be amazed if 9% of the flights have a Marshall on board.
well your are wrong, Internationally long hauls air marshalls are always onboard, (now I'm talking about the carrier I work for) I can't speak for other carriers, I just know what procedures my company has in place, I do know some Flight Attendants that work for CO and some of their procedures are the same as ours, like I stated before, you will never know if air marshalls are onboard or not, are you in the airline industry? Where do you come up with 9% domestic/international? And yes I realize how many flights takeoff daily, I've been in the Industry 20+ years.
http:///forum/post/2990351
90%?????
Do you realize how many flights are flown domestically and Internationally in the USA every day?
I personally would be amazed if 9% of the flights have a Marshall on board.
well your are wrong, Internationally long hauls air marshalls are always onboard, (now I'm talking about the carrier I work for) I can't speak for other carriers, I just know what procedures my company has in place, I do know some Flight Attendants that work for CO and some of their procedures are the same as ours, like I stated before, you will never know if air marshalls are onboard or not, are you in the airline industry? Where do you come up with 9% domestic/international? And yes I realize how many flights takeoff daily, I've been in the Industry 20+ years.
socal57che
Active Member
Originally Posted by Indy2009
http:///forum/post/2990339
Cockpit cannot be accessed from the cabin side, before 911 we were able to access the cockpit with just a key, we are no longer able to do so,
But the pilots were allowed to carry firearms post 911. What changed in the recent past to make it less necessary?
Air marshalls say there is a breakdown in security where they are concerned.
http://www.thedenverchannel.com/news...97/detail.html
Australia cuts it's air marshall team to skeleton crew.
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au...-31477,00.html
I know that's in Australia, but look at the number of marshalls compared to flights. Are we really that different? We can't possibly have enough marshalls to be on 90% of flights in the US. What about flights with international destinations?
socal57che
Active Member
"You might as well put us in uniform and put us on the planes with semiautomatic weapons," said one air marshal.
"You're saying anybody with any kind of intelligence could pick you out on most flights?" Kovaleski asked.
"Absolutely," one air marshal said.
"In my opinion, I will be the first target on that aircraft because they no longer have to bring on board any weapon of any type, other than a shoestring to strangle me while I'm sitting in my seat, take my weapon, and then they have the aircraft," an air marshal said.
"You're saying anybody with any kind of intelligence could pick you out on most flights?" Kovaleski asked.
"Absolutely," one air marshal said.
"In my opinion, I will be the first target on that aircraft because they no longer have to bring on board any weapon of any type, other than a shoestring to strangle me while I'm sitting in my seat, take my weapon, and then they have the aircraft," an air marshal said.
indy2009
Member
Originally Posted by socal57che
http:///forum/post/2990370
But the pilots were allowed to carry firearms post 911. What changed in the recent past to make it less necessary?
Air marshalls say there is a breakdown in security where they are concerned.
http://www.thedenverchannel.com/news...97/detail.html
Australia cuts it's air marshall team to skeleton crew.
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au...-31477,00.html
I know that's in Australia, but look at the number of marshalls compared to flights. Are we really that different? We can't possibly have enough marshalls to be on 90% of flights in the US. What about flights with international destinations?
Secrurity procedures have changed according to TSA, I'm talking in secured areas, once you pass through secruity checkpoints, as crew members we also have to go through these checkpoints as well, as crew members we are exempt from some of the restrictions that the general public are not, but according to TSA and other government agencies, the changes are successful, and firearms are no longer neccesarry, but I'm only going by what i've read in our company newsletters, IMO TSA is a big Joke, post 911 thousands of AMarshalls were hired, I feel after this change many will be discharged, but that does not mean that safety inflight will be jeopardize, it will and always be a concern, International flight with my company we have AMarshalls on all Long Haul flights.