HR 669 **alert**

nina&noah

nina&noah

Member
I don't understand, what is the point of such a bill? Why would anyone bring this up? What do they have to gain by shutting down the pet industry?
 
renogaw

renogaw

Active Member
look mainly at:
boas
pythons
lion fish
frogs
etc.
mainly there is already a "list" of unapproved animals that cannot be brought into the states due to if they get let loose, there's nothing in the wild to keep them in check. the problem with this "list" is that until something is put on this list, it is not considered illegal. when enough of the animals are let loose (cough, lion fish) it becomes a problem.
this bill wants to make EVERYTHING illegal to import, own, trade, buy and THEN put stuff on the list of "ok" items, things that won't cause too much of an issue in the wild.
problem is, this is going to take YEARS of research. then, take into account regional probabilities of issues. is a lion fish released in the CT sound, where it's way too cold for it to survive, giong to be as much of an issue as down in the carribean, where they are taking over... or if a boa is released in minnesota, it's gonna die that winter, no ifs ands or buts...but release down in louisaana, and it can probably survive nicely.
this list cannot be approved for parts of the states and not approved for others, so NO ONE will be able to have them.
the humane society tried to get this passed last fall, but legistlation recessed before talking about it. so it was renamed, rethought (used loosely...) and is trying to get snuck through while everyone's eyes are on the economy and war...
 
nina&noah

nina&noah

Member
OK, that makes sense to me now. I didn't think about that. Still, it seems a little drastic to shut down the entire pet industry all together.
I get tired of being punished for the stupidity of others. I mean really, who thinks it is a good idea to take your pet boa and release him in the local forest. Lion fish are another good example. Why on earth would you buy a lion fish and then take him and set him loose in the ocean. If you don't want him anymore, why not just take him to the LFS.
 
geridoc

geridoc

Well-Known Member
Birdkeepers are freaking out about this bill, too. Birds often outlive their owners, and this bill would make it illegal to transfer ownership to another person other than a zoo, lab, etc. That would leave lots of large birds without homes at all after their owners died or decided they couldn't manage them anymore.
 
beth

beth

Administrator
Staff member
http://www.pijac.org/files/public/US_HR_669.pdf
I found this which has a bit more info in plain language.
I do believe that the exotic trade and ownership should be more regulated, and that, in many cases, should mean owners of potentially invasive animals would need to be licensed and prove the status of your captive animals. How this could possibly be done by the government is beyond my comprehension....we can't even keep invasive people out of the USA, let alone animals. We can't keep drugs, terrorists, or illegal aliens out, but we're going to try and keep gerbils, parrots, and pythons out??

Give me a break. The person introducing the bill is a D from Guam? Come on.
 
al mc

al mc

Active Member
It would never pass in its present form. I can see a VERY modified one passing in the distant future. Just MHO.
 
sickboy

sickboy

Active Member
You guys/gals did read the part about how ANYONE can petition to have a species included and they are only worried about invasive species....right?
Blown out of proportion......
 
pbnj

pbnj

Member
Just heard/read about this today....why is everyone freaking out about this?
Someone please tell me where in the proposed legislation it says that everything nonnative immediately becomes illegal?
The Act only establishes a risk assessment process based on scientific and commercial information. All nonnative species, after being assessed, will either be placed on an "approved" list or an "unapproved" list.
This is just an expansion of current Fish & Wildlife legislation. To date, we've only had a list of illegal species and everything else was free to be imported. This Act just makes sure EVERYTHING nonnative is put into one of the two categories AFTER being assessed.
Relax...I don't think anyone's going to have trouble buying damsels anytime soon.

Maybe if we had this legislation in place 20 years ago, there wouldn't be so many 20ft Burmese Pythons swimming around the Florida Everglades and Lionfish wouldn't be all over the Atlantic/Caribbean.
I support this Bill.
 
stangs13

stangs13

New Member
I keep and breed ball pythons and this is how I found out about this bill...through another forum. They have never seen such a big deal made about a bill before, so this must be something to fret about. Just take the 5 mins to send the pre written letter to your reps.
 
pbnj

pbnj

Member
Originally Posted by stangs13
http:///forum/post/3016146
I keep and breed ball pythons and this is how I found out about this bill...through another forum. They have never seen such a big deal made about a bill before, so this must be something to fret about. Just take the 5 mins to send the pre written letter to your reps.
If you're a snake-keeper of certain species, maybe you do have to be concerned, but it's irresponsible to scare people into supporting your interests by saying they are going to ban all nonnative species of fish & wildlife.....it's just not true. Sorry, I will not be protesting the Bill. I think it's a good thing.
 
beth

beth

Administrator
Staff member
Originally Posted by sickboy
http:///forum/post/3016044
You guys/gals did read the part about how ANYONE can petition to have a species included and they are only worried about invasive species....right?
Blown out of proportion......
Any exotic pet can be invasive, due to human error, or outright disregard for the environment. The Everglades is full of Burmese pythons (a 20' snake) because pet owners decided they could no longer keep their cute little 1' snake that grew into a 15' snake (and was still growing) and threw them out into the wilderness. In the Florida Keys iguanas are totally out of control because pet owners could no longer keep the cut little 1/2' lizard when it became 3', ugly and nasty tempered. So out into the wild it went.
Aquarium owners dump dead fish, and even sick fish in the toilet all the time. That can result in the proliferation of parasites and diseases coming from these species. How many instances of devastating harvesting of aquarium species have occurred?
The Mediterranean is plagued by red tide algae, thought to be a result of an Aquarium in France dumping algae, resulting in algae laced runoff going into the sea.
Any of these things can be invasive. In my view, ferrel cats and dogs could also be considered invasive. Ferrel animals carry a host of diseases, including feline Aids, leukemia, even rabies. Good hearted people feel that they are being kindhearted by feeding ferrel cats and dogs. What they are doing is contributing to these animals' proliferation and the spread of very serious diseases that effect domesticated animals. And, it is not unheard of that such diseases make the jump to humans. AIDS is believed to have come from animals, monkeys, in Africa.
There should be regulation, and excluded species. People keeping especially troublesome species, such as the Burmese (which can easily kill someone) should be licensed and accountable. People dumping their "pets" into the wild should fined heavily. Animals obtained from retailers or even the humane society can be micro-chipped, to track these pets; then owners could be required to periodically report on the status of the animal through their vet. And, yes, taking pets to the vet may should be compulsory. Basically, if you can't take care of an animal, then don't get them to begin with.
All of that said, excluding all exotics is ridiculous and highly punitive to those of us who are responsible animal keepers (not to mention voters as well).
 
reefraff

reefraff

Active Member
Stray cats are one of the most invasive species. Lets ban cats

This bill is ridiculous. I wonder what loophole in this bill benefits Guam.
 
stangs13

stangs13

New Member
Originally Posted by pbnj
http:///forum/post/3016152
If you're a snake-keeper of certain species, maybe you do have to be concerned, but it's irresponsible to scare people into supporting your interests by saying they are going to ban all nonnative species of fish & wildlife.....it's just not true. Sorry, I will not be protesting the Bill. I think it's a good thing.
I was by no means "scaring" people. The only reason I posted this here is because of the threat to stop the trade, propogation and all over keeping of aquarium fish. And pretty much everything else. I understand that reptiles have a larger effect on our environment if released by irresponsible owners, but there is no reason to punish the responsible owners..Reptile breeding and keeping is a huge deal if you look into it, and it is just as exciting as keeping and building aquariums. Thats pretty selfish of you to sit over here and not care about the others who are trying to keep there hobby alive. We should support each other not as individuals but as pet owners alike to stand up and fight for our freedoms. I understand if you don't agree completely, but still look at the big picture.
 
beth

beth

Administrator
Staff member
I own 3 ball pythons. So, yes I am concerned about any bills of this nature.
However, in terms of threats to humans, likely wild cats tops the list.
All of these problems are due to humans being irresponsible.
 
uneverno

uneverno

Active Member
I haven't read the full text, but I would guess that it originated from the Guam rep. because Guam and after that HI, are the most threatened by invasive non-native species, for obvious reasons. (Biggest trouble Guam has is with some kind of asian snake, that was allegedly introduced by a commercial airliner when the snake hid in its wheelwell.)
CA is right there on the list as well. We already can't have ferrets or Caulerpa (among many other things) because of irresponsible former owners. Both are destroying native habitats at a cost of millions to we the taxpayers. There is a feral parrot population (some kind of Senegal, I think) a few miles from my house. When I first moved here, there were 6 or 7 of them. The flock numbers in the 50-60 range now, only a few years later.
I hope the bill doesn't pass, but the concerns of the authors are not without merit.
 
coral keeper

coral keeper

Active Member
Originally Posted by uneverno
http:///forum/post/3016351
I haven't read the full text, but I would guess that it originated from the Guam rep. because Guam and after that HI, are the most threatened by invasive non-native species, for obvious reasons. (Biggest trouble Guam has is with some kind of asian snake, that was allegedly introduced by a commercial airliner when the snake hid in its wheelwell.)
CA is right there on the list as well. We already can't have ferrets or Caulerpa (among many other things) because of irresponsible former owners. Both are destroying native habitats at a cost of millions to we the taxpayers. There is a feral parrot population (some kind of Senegal, I think) a few miles from my house. When I first moved here, there were 6 or 7 of them. The flock numbers in the 50-60 range now, only a few years later.
I hope the bill doesn't pass, but the concerns of the authors are not without merit.
You can always send a few of those birds this way if you want...
 
pbnj

pbnj

Member
Originally Posted by stangs13
http:///forum/post/3016302
Thats pretty selfish of you to sit over here and not care about the others who are trying to keep there hobby alive. We should support each other not as individuals but as pet owners alike to stand up and fight for our freedoms. I understand if you don't agree completely, but still look at the big picture.
Let me get this straight...you want to oppose a Bill that is designed to protect our environmental and economic interests just so you can keep pet snakes and I'm being selfish?
Let me know if my reef tank is a threat to the US and I'll take it down tomorrow.
 
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