I am thinking of going filterless...bad idea?

[bbreaux1]

i kinda think the same as kyan on the rock thing if he got rock that use to be live rock or just any porus rock it will eventually be live just take a bit longer i cant see sticking that much money into live rock.im thinking the two main reasons for the high nitrates would probibly be the not cleaning the filter pads and might be over feeding even if your fish are eating everything you are feeding them twice a day they are producing twice as much waste as if you would only be feeding once a day and the waste is what eventually turns into nitrates.

 

[broomer5]

Hi kyarnkid
Just thought I'd pop in on this thread too, and offer an "extreme" solution.
Obviously this is my opinion and you should do whatever you feel comfortable doing.
We're assuming the nitrate test kit is good, the test was done properly, and the nitrate level is 160 <img src="graemlins//eek.gif" border="0" alt="[eek]" />
As Ed mentioned, doing small water changes will take forever to reduce the nitrates down to an acceptable level.
Do you have a Q tank or another tank set up ?
If so and this was my situation - I'd remove the fish and inverts to another tank. Even set up a small one and let it cycle for a month or so if necessary, then move the fish over to it.
I'd then perform a near TOTAL water change on the 55 with new saltwater, making sure it's at or near the exact S.G. temperature and pH of the old saltwater. I'd test for nitrates in this newly mixed up batch of saltwater prior to adding it to the 55 too.
Then add a lot more live rock to the 55 if you can afford it, and ditch the Emp400 entirely.
Let this tank stabalize, monitor it's water parameters, and when ready .... acclimate the fish back to it.
Run the Prizm and feed very lightly, about half as much as you have been - every other day.
Then keep this other small tank for a QT or small tank.
Just an idea - not the best if you don't want to have another tank running, but would allow you to get the 55 back in shape within a couple months or so.

 

[kris]

kkid--by now I'd bet you're getting pretty frustrated--both with the problem at hand and the solutions and answers being provided, trust me most of us have had frustrations like this at some time or another. At the risk of complicating matters I will give you my opinion of what to do.
First I TOTALLY agree with broomer here. Some may disagree based on the stress factor and the risk of changing the water paramiters so drastically at one time. However I believe this risk is at least equal to or less than the risk of letting the 160 nitrates continue.
Broomers ideas of the seperate tank would be best. But I personally wouldn't want another tank running, so, considering you're fish are on the hardier side anyway here's what I'd do.
1--remove fish into buckets (inverts too.)
Also save a bucket of tank water
2-drain that tank down to about a couple of inches above the dsb.
3-Then replace with fresh mixed water.
4-add powerheads to aerate and mix, and replace skimmer.
5-remove filters, throw the cartridges, and place bio-media (floss sponges rings whatever else into that reserved bucket of tank water.
6-clean the actual filters out, you can use fresh water for this. Include a brush for cleaning inside tubes and such, don't forget impellers and whatever else.
7-By now your tank should be fairly mixed, check the sg, temp and ph to ensure equal to old water.Adjust if neccesary.
8- return filters to tank fill with tank water replace the bio-media (that has been rised in that old tank water) and new cartrideges and get them running.
9-begin acclimation process of fish and inverts by adding approx 1 cup of tank water to their buckets about every 15 to 20 min. Continue to do this till their buckets are just about full. Total time should be at least 3 hours. (this acclimation will be longer than a normal one due the extreme change in nitrates levels.
10-Check you tank levels once more before putting your fish back in.
11-start building your live rock collection, one piece at a time, remembering that with each addition it's about the equivalent of adding a fish and your system will need to adapt.
This is the first step in my opinion--
After that, while you may have been under the impression that too many water changes was a bad thing, I disagree with that. Monitor your levels and do them accordingly. Every tanks needs are different, and your tests will tell you what YOUR tank needs. Do the filters at each water change at least.
After that just relax, test and wait. Eventually I think you will be able to lose your powerfilters and go filterless if you want, but not until your "natural" filters are WELL established. (imo-about 1 year.)
This may or may not have been what you wanted to hear, and I may get in trouble from other members but I really think it may be your best bet for now (later is a different story)
Good Luck

 

[kris walker]

Interesting posts everyone. It shows the various flavors of the hobby.
Just want to add my 0.04. I haven't cleaned my filter pads in at least 2 months, and haven't had any problems with nitrates (totally undetectable). For that time period, i was generally feeding my coral-only tank once every 2 days with silversides, raw fish, or brine shrimp, during the last 1.5 weeks, feeding every day. So the crap in the filter pads is not causing me any problems (as of yet). But perhaps this is because I have a healthy pod population in these pads. Since pods eat detritus, well you see where I'm going. Also, just because you have crap in your pads doesn't mean it is bad crap. It could easily be aerobic bacteria, which is benefitial to breaking down ammon/trites. Of course, this then produces nitrates in the water column that have a harder time trying to get into a DSB for processing. Unless my nitrates go up, I will never clean those pads, and this example, along with several others that have been stated on the board in the past, *prove without a doubt* that filter pads do not *alone* cause high nitrates.
KK, don't take offense, but I think your problem is overfeeding amplified by the instability of your young tank and DSB, and your overhang filter generating nitrates from breakdown of ammonia/nitrite in the filter media. Most of us have been there. If you cut back on overfeeding dramatically, and remove the filter media, then the DSB will eventually catch up.
Just my 0.04, and good luck,
kris