I can't keep Zoa's alive!
- Thread starter kiefers
- Start date
cjworkman
Member
They should be fine in the middle of the tank under T5's.. unless you have a 48" x 4 bulbs over a 120 gallon tall tank or something.
What corals are you placing them near? maybe something is stinging them at night.
also, they should live without feeding.. but dosing some zooplex or something as a supplemental food could help if you have lots of other filter feeders.
What corals are you placing them near? maybe something is stinging them at night.
also, they should live without feeding.. but dosing some zooplex or something as a supplemental food could help if you have lots of other filter feeders.
rickross23
Active Member
Too much flow?
kiefers
Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by cjworkman http:///t/391642/i-cant-keep-zoas-alive#post_3474570
They should be fine in the middle of the tank under T5's.. unless you have a 48" x 4 bulbs over a 120 gallon tall tank or something.
What corals are you placing them near? maybe something is stinging them at night.
also, they should live without feeding.. but dosing some zooplex or something as a supplemental food could help if you have lots of other filter feeders.
They eat when the fish eat. Sometimes I give them the resign of what's left over from the sun corals
Quote:
Originally Posted by spanko http:///t/391642/i-cant-keep-zoas-alive#post_3474591
What happens to them ie. they melt, they close up and never open again, etc. etc.?
The stem shrinks, get skinnier, then they do not open, then melt away.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2Quills http:///t/391642/i-cant-keep-zoas-alive#post_3474595
Are you carbon dosing this system? Maybe it's too clean for zoas.
Haven't carbon dosed for several months.
Nitrate around 10-20 but other corals growing and thriving good.
Phosphates 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by rickross23 http:///t/391642/i-cant-keep-zoas-alive#post_3474596
Too much flow?
low to moderate flow.
Originally Posted by cjworkman http:///t/391642/i-cant-keep-zoas-alive#post_3474570
They should be fine in the middle of the tank under T5's.. unless you have a 48" x 4 bulbs over a 120 gallon tall tank or something.
What corals are you placing them near? maybe something is stinging them at night.
also, they should live without feeding.. but dosing some zooplex or something as a supplemental food could help if you have lots of other filter feeders.
They eat when the fish eat. Sometimes I give them the resign of what's left over from the sun corals
Quote:
Originally Posted by spanko http:///t/391642/i-cant-keep-zoas-alive#post_3474591
What happens to them ie. they melt, they close up and never open again, etc. etc.?
The stem shrinks, get skinnier, then they do not open, then melt away.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2Quills http:///t/391642/i-cant-keep-zoas-alive#post_3474595
Are you carbon dosing this system? Maybe it's too clean for zoas.
Haven't carbon dosed for several months.
Nitrate around 10-20 but other corals growing and thriving good.
Phosphates 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by rickross23 http:///t/391642/i-cant-keep-zoas-alive#post_3474596
Too much flow?
low to moderate flow.
rickross23
Active Member
Don't feed them. It can affect their growing I learned. Let them filter the water.
kiefers
Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by rickross23 http:///t/391642/i-cant-keep-zoas-alive#post_3474628
Don't feed them. It can affect their growing I learned. Let them filter the water.
pretty much what I do. They get the residue
Originally Posted by rickross23 http:///t/391642/i-cant-keep-zoas-alive#post_3474628
Don't feed them. It can affect their growing I learned. Let them filter the water.
pretty much what I do. They get the residue
2quills
Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by rickross23 http:///t/391642/i-cant-keep-zoas-alive#post_3474628
Don't feed them. It can affect their growing I learned. Let them filter the water.
Please explain?
Originally Posted by rickross23 http:///t/391642/i-cant-keep-zoas-alive#post_3474628
Don't feed them. It can affect their growing I learned. Let them filter the water.
Please explain?
kiefers
Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by cjworkman http:///t/391642/i-cant-keep-zoas-alive#post_3474642
hmm..
can you take a photo of the rest of your tank? that might help.
How many T5 bulbs do you have and how big is the tank?
My guess is they are getting stung by another coral at night.
picture is not an option right now. Batteries are dead.
I have the 4 bulb Wave Point fixture
And the Zoa's are not placed anywhere close to other coral.
Originally Posted by cjworkman http:///t/391642/i-cant-keep-zoas-alive#post_3474642
hmm..
can you take a photo of the rest of your tank? that might help.
How many T5 bulbs do you have and how big is the tank?
My guess is they are getting stung by another coral at night.
picture is not an option right now. Batteries are dead.
I have the 4 bulb Wave Point fixture
And the Zoa's are not placed anywhere close to other coral.
rickross23
Active Member
I fed them mysis and they stayed shriveled and didn't grow much. I have since fed them nothing and they are spreading fast. The only food I think that may work for them is phytoplankton.
2quills
Well-Known Member
These situations can be tricky because the way I understand is that different colonies do well in different conditions. Some zoas I've heard can thrive in SPS tanks for instance and some just won't. Maybe you just need to keep searching for the right types of colonies. I've had a couple different colonies that have always done great in my tank. And I've tried a few others that just never did good at all, they went straight down hill I guess the moment they got to my tank.
snakeblitz33
Well-Known Member
The new TOTM on ReefKeeping Magazine website for May 2012 ...Levi Morgan's (ia2kass) 247-gallon Zoanthid Dominated Reef Aquarium... so a search. There's a lot of valuable information in there such as: (copied and pasted from the TOTM article from May of 2012:
So you wanna keep Zoantharia eh?:
Here are a few helpful hints:
• Studies on Zoantharia nutrition tend to be few and far between but generally identify dissolved organics and bacteria as large contributors of nitrogen and carbon not acquired through photosynthesis. Having a healthy system which can easily turn nutrients into bacteriobiomass works wonders for zoanthids. In addition to the bacteria, fish waste and detritus is routinely captured by species from the families Parazoanthidae and Sphenopidae while Zoanthidae tends to rely more on photosynthetic processes. Identifying the family helps identify what care is required, this unfortunately is not an easy task for beginners and experts alike.
• Zoantharia as an order tends to be vastly diverse so you need to find the correct light & flow for each colony. Anyone claiming to have the ability to keep every morph of zoanthid happy is flat out lying, a recent study out of Japan noted natural mortality rates close to 40% in the species Zoanthus sociatus, as hobbyists we can only strive to improve on numbers like this. Many zoanthids have horrible track records in captivity, these are usually the sought after ones adding to the frustration. Aquacultured corals just like SPS tend to be a little more resilient so buying cultured is the best way to go.
• Flow is pivotal, although branded as beginner coral high variable flow mixed with strong lighting is highly beneficial for pretty much all species belonging to Zoantharia. This allows for detritus to be removed from the coenenchyme and provides a constant supply of required dissolved compounds.
• Actinics make the pigments in Zoanthids fluoresce, the bluer the spectrum the more "pop" you get. There is a trade off with growth and color so finding the sweet spot is a tricky ordeal.
• Keeping wrasses from the genus Halichoeres and having a healthy wrasse population in general is a powerful way to combat zoanthid pests. Wrasses actively seek out and hunt bristle worms, copepods, amphipods, nudibranches and a whole assortment of inverts that could potentially irritate your polyps. In a tank full of infectious microbes irritation of your zoas is the enemy!
• A few Asterina starfish species do prey on zoanthids, we were initially not removing them from new additions but have since changed our stance after they reached plague proportions. Of the three species that became prolific in our tank the larger red ones were found the most directly on zoanthid coenenchyme. We have since added a pair of Harlequin Shrimp (Hymenocera elegans) which have decimated the population, as these are obligate feeders they will require biweekly starfish feeding after all the Asterinas are gone.
So you wanna keep Zoantharia eh?:
Here are a few helpful hints:
• Studies on Zoantharia nutrition tend to be few and far between but generally identify dissolved organics and bacteria as large contributors of nitrogen and carbon not acquired through photosynthesis. Having a healthy system which can easily turn nutrients into bacteriobiomass works wonders for zoanthids. In addition to the bacteria, fish waste and detritus is routinely captured by species from the families Parazoanthidae and Sphenopidae while Zoanthidae tends to rely more on photosynthetic processes. Identifying the family helps identify what care is required, this unfortunately is not an easy task for beginners and experts alike.
• Zoantharia as an order tends to be vastly diverse so you need to find the correct light & flow for each colony. Anyone claiming to have the ability to keep every morph of zoanthid happy is flat out lying, a recent study out of Japan noted natural mortality rates close to 40% in the species Zoanthus sociatus, as hobbyists we can only strive to improve on numbers like this. Many zoanthids have horrible track records in captivity, these are usually the sought after ones adding to the frustration. Aquacultured corals just like SPS tend to be a little more resilient so buying cultured is the best way to go.
• Flow is pivotal, although branded as beginner coral high variable flow mixed with strong lighting is highly beneficial for pretty much all species belonging to Zoantharia. This allows for detritus to be removed from the coenenchyme and provides a constant supply of required dissolved compounds.
• Actinics make the pigments in Zoanthids fluoresce, the bluer the spectrum the more "pop" you get. There is a trade off with growth and color so finding the sweet spot is a tricky ordeal.
• Keeping wrasses from the genus Halichoeres and having a healthy wrasse population in general is a powerful way to combat zoanthid pests. Wrasses actively seek out and hunt bristle worms, copepods, amphipods, nudibranches and a whole assortment of inverts that could potentially irritate your polyps. In a tank full of infectious microbes irritation of your zoas is the enemy!
• A few Asterina starfish species do prey on zoanthids, we were initially not removing them from new additions but have since changed our stance after they reached plague proportions. Of the three species that became prolific in our tank the larger red ones were found the most directly on zoanthid coenenchyme. We have since added a pair of Harlequin Shrimp (Hymenocera elegans) which have decimated the population, as these are obligate feeders they will require biweekly starfish feeding after all the Asterinas are gone.
rickross23
Active Member
What's better 20k or 15k? sdifference? Could i get one of each? I have 2 150w halides. Are 20k deeper in color or better for coral?
kiefers
Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by spanko http:///t/391642/i-cant-keep-zoas-alive#post_3474660
have a read of the first link here.
http://www.google.com/search?q=View+P
oll+Results%3A+Which+zoa%2Fpaly+morphs+are+melters%3F&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US
fficial&client=firefox-a&channel=fflb
coudn't open this Henry. You try clicking on it or PM me.
Originally Posted by spanko http:///t/391642/i-cant-keep-zoas-alive#post_3474660
have a read of the first link here.
http://www.google.com/search?q=View+P
oll+Results%3A+Which+zoa%2Fpaly+morphs+are+melters%3F&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US
fficial&client=firefox-a&channel=fflbcoudn't open this Henry. You try clicking on it or PM me.
2quills
Well-Known Member
I think this is what he wanted you to see...
View Poll Results: Which zoa/paly morphs are melters?
Voters
111. You may not vote on this poll
Space Monster
x-shadow: none !important; position: relative; width: 565px; float: left; clear: right; ">
43.60%
[*]
Soprano
2219.82%
w: none !important; position: relative; width: 291px; float: left; bottom: 0px; ">
Darth Maul
4237.84%
[*]
Darth Maul, spackled red var.
1210.81%
m; float: left; background-image: initial; background-attachment: initial; background-origin: initial; background-clip: initial; border-top-width: 0px; border-right-width: 0px; border-bottom-width: 0px; border-left-width: 0px; border-style: initial; border-color: initial; border-image: initial; clear: both; ">
Nightmares
2018.02%
Serene Nova
3-box-shadow: none !important; position: absolute; right: 0px; top: 0px; ">2.70%
[*]
Other "Japanese Deep Water" morphs
109.01%
Fruit Loops
-right: 0.5em; padding-bottom: 0.1em; padding-left: 0.5em; display: block; margin-left: 0.5em; float: left; clear: right; ">119.91%
[*]
Blondies
21.80%
Purple Death
k; background-image: none; background-attachment: initial; background-origin: initial; background-clip: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 132, 255); float: left; width: 5px; ">
10.90%
[*]
Nuclear Green
00%
Captain America
lor: transparent; border-bottom-color: transparent; border-left-color: transparent; border-style: initial; border-image: initial; display: inline-block; background-image: none; background-attachment: initial; background-origin: initial; background-clip: initial; background-color: rgb(156, 255, 198); float: left; width: 15px; ">
32.70%
[*]
Other paly (ie mindblowing, two face, etc)
54.50%
Palythoa Grandis
s="pollbarwrapper" style="-webkit-box-shadow: none !important; position: relative; width: 565px; float: left; clear: right; ">
00%
[*]
My clementines
43.60%
Campfires
e="-webkit-box-shadow: none !important; font-size: 11px; position: relative; float: left; min-width: 400px; width: 681px; ">
109.01%
[*]
Ko's Nightmare
21.80%
t-width: 0px; border-bottom-width: 0px; border-left-width: 0px; border-style: initial; border-color: initial; border-image: initial; clear: both; ">
Candy Apple Red
87.21%
[*]
Sunny Delights
87.21%
-shadow: none !important; padding-top: 5px; list-style-type: none; list-style-position: initial; list-style-image: initial; width: 973px; position: relative; min-height: 2em; float: left; background-image: initial; background-attachment: initial; background-origin: initial; background-clip: initial; border-top-width: 0px; border-right-width: 0px; border-bottom-width: 0px; border-left-width: 0px; border-style: initial; border-color: initial; border-image: initial; clear: both; ">
Rainbow Paly morphs
21.80%
Bowsers
0hadow: none !important; position: absolute; right: 0px; top: 0px; ">0%
[*]
Shazaam
10.90%
Vipers
ng-left: 0.5em; display: block; margin-left: 0.5em; float: left; clear: right; ">54.50%
[*]
Valentines Day Massacre
2219.82%
Hawaiian PE morphs
none; background-attachment: initial; background-origin: initial; background-clip: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 132, 132); float: left; width: 35px; ">
76.31%
[*]
Carribean PE morphs
65.41%
Carribean "lotus eater morphs"
x-shadow: none !important; height: 15px; border-top-width: 0px; border-right-width: 0px; border-bottom-width: 0px; border-left-width: 0px; border-top-color: transparent; border-right-color: transparent; border-bottom-color: transparent; border-left-color: transparent; border-style: initial; border-image: initial; display: inline-block; background-image: none; background-attachment: initial; background-origin: initial; background-clip: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 231, 132); float: left; width: 15px; ">
32.70%
[*]
Carribean zoas
32.70%
Magicians
style="-webkit-box-shadow: none !important; font-size: 11px; position: relative; float: left; min-width: 400px; width: 681px; ">
1412.61%
[*]
Micro zoa morphs
1210.81%
rder-right-width: 0px; border-bottom-width: 0px; border-left-width: 0px; border-style: initial; border-color: initial; border-image: initial; clear: both; ">
"Panamanian" zoas
21.80%
[*]
African "Blue Hornet or Blue Steel"
1816.22%
lass="blockrow" style="-webkit-box-shadow: none !important; padding-top: 5px; list-style-type: none; list-style-position: initial; list-style-image: initial; width: 973px; position: relative; min-height: 2em; float: left; background-image: initial; background-attachment: initial; background-origin: initial; background-clip: initial; border-top-width: 0px; border-right-width: 0px; border-bottom-width: 0px; border-left-width: 0px; border-style: initial; border-color: initial; border-image: initial; clear: both; ">
Purple Hornet
119.91%
Red Hornet
ef2reef.com/forums/zoa-discussion-club-zoa/poll-448-a.html" style="-webkit-box-shadow: none !important; color: rgb(0, 80, 179); text-decoration: none; ">76.31%
[*]
Blue Hornet
109.01%
Other "hornet" morph
in: initial; background-clip: initial; background-color: rgb(156, 255, 198); float: left; width: 25px; ">
54.50%
Multiple Choice Poll.
View Poll Results: Which zoa/paly morphs are melters?
Voters
111. You may not vote on this poll
Space Monster
x-shadow: none !important; position: relative; width: 565px; float: left; clear: right; ">
43.60%
[*]
Soprano
2219.82%
w: none !important; position: relative; width: 291px; float: left; bottom: 0px; ">
Darth Maul
4237.84%
[*]
Darth Maul, spackled red var.
1210.81%
m; float: left; background-image: initial; background-attachment: initial; background-origin: initial; background-clip: initial; border-top-width: 0px; border-right-width: 0px; border-bottom-width: 0px; border-left-width: 0px; border-style: initial; border-color: initial; border-image: initial; clear: both; ">
Nightmares
2018.02%
Serene Nova
3-box-shadow: none !important; position: absolute; right: 0px; top: 0px; ">2.70%
[*]
Other "Japanese Deep Water" morphs
109.01%
Fruit Loops
-right: 0.5em; padding-bottom: 0.1em; padding-left: 0.5em; display: block; margin-left: 0.5em; float: left; clear: right; ">119.91%
[*]
Blondies
21.80%
Purple Death
k; background-image: none; background-attachment: initial; background-origin: initial; background-clip: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 132, 255); float: left; width: 5px; ">
10.90%
[*]
Nuclear Green
00%
Captain America
lor: transparent; border-bottom-color: transparent; border-left-color: transparent; border-style: initial; border-image: initial; display: inline-block; background-image: none; background-attachment: initial; background-origin: initial; background-clip: initial; background-color: rgb(156, 255, 198); float: left; width: 15px; ">
32.70%
[*]
Other paly (ie mindblowing, two face, etc)
54.50%
Palythoa Grandis
s="pollbarwrapper" style="-webkit-box-shadow: none !important; position: relative; width: 565px; float: left; clear: right; ">
00%
[*]
My clementines
43.60%
Campfires
e="-webkit-box-shadow: none !important; font-size: 11px; position: relative; float: left; min-width: 400px; width: 681px; ">
109.01%
[*]
Ko's Nightmare
21.80%
t-width: 0px; border-bottom-width: 0px; border-left-width: 0px; border-style: initial; border-color: initial; border-image: initial; clear: both; ">
Candy Apple Red
87.21%
[*]
Sunny Delights
87.21%
-shadow: none !important; padding-top: 5px; list-style-type: none; list-style-position: initial; list-style-image: initial; width: 973px; position: relative; min-height: 2em; float: left; background-image: initial; background-attachment: initial; background-origin: initial; background-clip: initial; border-top-width: 0px; border-right-width: 0px; border-bottom-width: 0px; border-left-width: 0px; border-style: initial; border-color: initial; border-image: initial; clear: both; ">
Rainbow Paly morphs
21.80%
Bowsers
0hadow: none !important; position: absolute; right: 0px; top: 0px; ">0%
[*]
Shazaam
10.90%
Vipers
ng-left: 0.5em; display: block; margin-left: 0.5em; float: left; clear: right; ">54.50%
[*]
Valentines Day Massacre
2219.82%
Hawaiian PE morphs
none; background-attachment: initial; background-origin: initial; background-clip: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 132, 132); float: left; width: 35px; ">
76.31%
[*]
Carribean PE morphs
65.41%
Carribean "lotus eater morphs"
x-shadow: none !important; height: 15px; border-top-width: 0px; border-right-width: 0px; border-bottom-width: 0px; border-left-width: 0px; border-top-color: transparent; border-right-color: transparent; border-bottom-color: transparent; border-left-color: transparent; border-style: initial; border-image: initial; display: inline-block; background-image: none; background-attachment: initial; background-origin: initial; background-clip: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 231, 132); float: left; width: 15px; ">
32.70%
[*]
Carribean zoas
32.70%
Magicians
style="-webkit-box-shadow: none !important; font-size: 11px; position: relative; float: left; min-width: 400px; width: 681px; ">
1412.61%
[*]
Micro zoa morphs
1210.81%
rder-right-width: 0px; border-bottom-width: 0px; border-left-width: 0px; border-style: initial; border-color: initial; border-image: initial; clear: both; ">
"Panamanian" zoas
21.80%
[*]
African "Blue Hornet or Blue Steel"
1816.22%
lass="blockrow" style="-webkit-box-shadow: none !important; padding-top: 5px; list-style-type: none; list-style-position: initial; list-style-image: initial; width: 973px; position: relative; min-height: 2em; float: left; background-image: initial; background-attachment: initial; background-origin: initial; background-clip: initial; border-top-width: 0px; border-right-width: 0px; border-bottom-width: 0px; border-left-width: 0px; border-style: initial; border-color: initial; border-image: initial; clear: both; ">
Purple Hornet
119.91%
Red Hornet
ef2reef.com/forums/zoa-discussion-club-zoa/poll-448-a.html" style="-webkit-box-shadow: none !important; color: rgb(0, 80, 179); text-decoration: none; ">76.31%
[*]
Blue Hornet
109.01%
Other "hornet" morph
in: initial; background-clip: initial; background-color: rgb(156, 255, 198); float: left; width: 25px; ">
54.50%
Multiple Choice Poll.