ick from hell
- Thread starter bird dog
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motohead
Member
unfortunatel the methods that work best are also a pain in the butt.quarantine for weeks and meds.i have not had it in my tank for a couple of years now but the last time i did i let it run its course and waited about 3 months before adding anything else in the way of livestock.had 10 fish at the time of that last outbreak and lost two or three.the rest made it and have not had it since.the harsh reality is if you are not prepared to deal with it properly,and in my opinion,ich x and the rest of those so called reef safe meds are not proper,then you either get prepared by settin up a qt or let it run itself out.
motohead
Member
well i lost a firefish,blenny, and a carpenter wrasse.the fish that made it were yellow tang,coral beauty,bar gobies,possum wrasse and my two percs.it was saddening to me but i let it run its course.i hated to lose the fish but i really had no choice at the time.now when i add livestock,i make sure that it has qt'ed at the lfs for a couple weeks.and make sure it has eaten in that period of time.i have not added fish for a long time though.i think i got what i want and wont be adding anymore anytime soon.less chance of problems too.now i just add rock and coral.lol.really though,broke my heart and my wifes heart to let the ich do its thing,and i do not suggest anyone else do that but that was my experience with it.i have been keeping a reef tank for 4 years or thereabouts and had two outbreaks.so by no means dio i know what i am doing.we do not have the space for even a 10 gal qt and that is a waste of time anyway when you have 8 or nine fish that need to be treated.we got lizards,dogs,kid and more fish in his rom.and i do not have time to properly deal with the qt time.i work in a refinery and too much overtime and call outs and such to do it properly.my lfs will treat my fish for me in their hospital tanks if i have a problem and that is about the best i can do.anyway,good luck to you and if you can afford to set up a qt that is able to handle the amount of fish you have then get on it.otherwise,o do not know if you can get rid of it.also,once you remove them from your display to your qt,i believe the display tank has to be fishless for about two months in order for the ich to perish fully.otherwise it is just hangin around waitin for you to put them back in.there are people on here who know much about this,hopefully they will catch this thread and help you out.good luck to you.
L
lockemup
Guest
IMO the best way I have found to get rid of Ich
1. Hold off adding any new life for at least 10 days. (lifespan of free floating Ich in the water)
2. Install a UV sterilizer to kill any free floating microbacteria associated with Ich as well as other bad stuff. Yes, it can and will kill some of the good bacteria too, but whatever bacteria that is on your LR will remain and should be enough to feed the tank.
3. Using a QT is a good idea but make sure you treat the new livestock while you have them in the QT.
A. I will be treating with copper for 10 days and as well as melafix if the new fish has any types of blemishes. (you can talk the LF dealer down in price if there are blemishes...
)
B. Then I do a 100% water change in the QT and go 10 days without any additives, just allowing the fish to breathe the saltwater and clear any copper and other stuff from it's system.
**NOTE** Make sure you acclimate the fish to the QT each time it goes into it. (during medicine phase as well as saltwater only phase) Also, You dont need to go 10 and 10, that is just my preference. A buddy of mine does 7 days treating with copper, 7 days of saltwater only and melafix if there are any wounds and another 3-7 days of saltwater only.
4. Then the new fish is ready for your display.
5. Finally, you would be best to ID where the Ich came from and avoid repeating the steps that led to it getting into your system.. I found that every time I fed live brine from a local LFS, Ich would be present within 5-7 days after. Now I only use frozen brine. It is a bit more expensive, but some is combined with stuff for the imune systems and some is for the coloring of your fish that feed on it. This is much better than the live brine which has no nutritional value to your fish.
Again, this is just my opinion and what works for me may not work for you. I have seen people do weird a** sh*t and still come away with some awesome looking tanks. They are lucky because they defy all science involved and their tanks never seem to get a "cold." None of this matters if your wife puts about 5-6 fish in the tank while you are at work and then leaves the dead ones in the tank overnight like mine did. It was pretty neat to watch the way the tank goes into a rapid cycle and kills off all the fish only leaving rock, corals and inverts alone.
This hobby seems to be more stressful inducing than stress relieving huh?
1. Hold off adding any new life for at least 10 days. (lifespan of free floating Ich in the water)
2. Install a UV sterilizer to kill any free floating microbacteria associated with Ich as well as other bad stuff. Yes, it can and will kill some of the good bacteria too, but whatever bacteria that is on your LR will remain and should be enough to feed the tank.
3. Using a QT is a good idea but make sure you treat the new livestock while you have them in the QT.
A. I will be treating with copper for 10 days and as well as melafix if the new fish has any types of blemishes. (you can talk the LF dealer down in price if there are blemishes...
) B. Then I do a 100% water change in the QT and go 10 days without any additives, just allowing the fish to breathe the saltwater and clear any copper and other stuff from it's system.
**NOTE** Make sure you acclimate the fish to the QT each time it goes into it. (during medicine phase as well as saltwater only phase) Also, You dont need to go 10 and 10, that is just my preference. A buddy of mine does 7 days treating with copper, 7 days of saltwater only and melafix if there are any wounds and another 3-7 days of saltwater only.
4. Then the new fish is ready for your display.
5. Finally, you would be best to ID where the Ich came from and avoid repeating the steps that led to it getting into your system.. I found that every time I fed live brine from a local LFS, Ich would be present within 5-7 days after. Now I only use frozen brine. It is a bit more expensive, but some is combined with stuff for the imune systems and some is for the coloring of your fish that feed on it. This is much better than the live brine which has no nutritional value to your fish.
Again, this is just my opinion and what works for me may not work for you. I have seen people do weird a** sh*t and still come away with some awesome looking tanks. They are lucky because they defy all science involved and their tanks never seem to get a "cold." None of this matters if your wife puts about 5-6 fish in the tank while you are at work and then leaves the dead ones in the tank overnight like mine did. It was pretty neat to watch the way the tank goes into a rapid cycle and kills off all the fish only leaving rock, corals and inverts alone.
This hobby seems to be more stressful inducing than stress relieving huh?
ophiura
Active Member
IMO, you will continue to have ick problems so long as there is a stressor in the tank that is causing trouble for the fish. So you need to figure out what could be going wrong with water quality, diet, aggressive fish, and other factors to address what is causing things to stress. QT, etc are very good things to do as well, but fundamentally if you have a problem in your tank, you will continue to have sick fish.
So I would start with a review of your tank, giving us filtration, size, age, fish, live rock, circulation, skimming, specific water quality, etc. before spending a dime on a UV or anything else
So I would start with a review of your tank, giving us filtration, size, age, fish, live rock, circulation, skimming, specific water quality, etc. before spending a dime on a UV or anything else
L
lockemup
Guest
Originally Posted by ophiura
So I would start with a review of your tank, giving us filtration, size, age, fish, live rock, circulation, skimming, specific water quality, etc. before spending a dime on a UV or anything else
I agree with 95% of your post, but why not invest in a UV? It is a proven method of removing parasites isn't it? I was fortunate to discover where the source was coming into my tank but a lot of people may not be so lucky...
ophiura
Active Member
UV, if set up properly, with correct flow rate, proper aged bulb, no build up inside the unit, etc, etc etc (fair number of "ifs" in many cases) will kill the parasite and a whole lot of critters that you don't really want to be killed. So I would spend the money on something else. IMO, a UV will not totally prevent an ick outbreak if QT is not followed and there is some other stress in the tank as well. Everyone is entitled to their opinions, however, and if it gives one a sense of security than so be it
L
lockemup
Guest
That is true. Very few of us are marine biologists and none of us have all the answers. The best we can hope is to learn from each other. My post above seems to work for me, at least until the next time as we all know. lol
I do think he definitely needs to identify what is introducing the Ich into the system before doing anything to it. Mine was the live brine and since stopping it, no more problems...
I do think he definitely needs to identify what is introducing the Ich into the system before doing anything to it. Mine was the live brine and since stopping it, no more problems...
itchy
Member
My yellow tang and my flame angel keep showing a couple of spots of ich. I did not want to stress them more by moving them to a QT for only a small outbreak of ich. Instead I decided to use garlic with their food and add vitamins as well. All of this boost the fish immune system and helps them fight of parasites thru their own defense. However, if you have a bad case of ich then the only recourse is to use a QT and do HYPO therapy as this tends to be a sure way of killing the parasite. I have had a couple of fish over the years that were to compromised to take the stress of hypo therapy and die. There are some great threads on here about hypo therapy and how it works, do a search.
I know some people use copper but I have corals and LR so that is not an option for me. Besides once copper is introduced into any tank you will never be able to have any inverts in that tank...EVER.
Some people sware by UV sterilizers. I have one and do not use it as it will kill everything in the water that passes thru the light. Not only that you need a certain flow rate and the bulbs have to be up to par so IMO it is a false since of sercurity...for me anyway. However it sure hepled with my algae when I used it....
I think the most important thing is to try and let the fish fight it themselves if possible but sometimes the parasite my consumer the fish and they need help....so way your options!! Good LUck
I know some people use copper but I have corals and LR so that is not an option for me. Besides once copper is introduced into any tank you will never be able to have any inverts in that tank...EVER.
Some people sware by UV sterilizers. I have one and do not use it as it will kill everything in the water that passes thru the light. Not only that you need a certain flow rate and the bulbs have to be up to par so IMO it is a false since of sercurity...for me anyway. However it sure hepled with my algae when I used it....
I think the most important thing is to try and let the fish fight it themselves if possible but sometimes the parasite my consumer the fish and they need help....so way your options!! Good LUck
L
lockemup
Guest
very good advice on the garlic. I have a concoction where I soak the food in Zoe and add a few drops of garlic guard. the fish seem to love it. I am putting live copepods in my fuge and I do dose with phyto. I only recently added the UV, but everyone I know who purchase the more expensive fish and have them surviive use a UV. Now, they also QT the new livestock and I don't believe they put inverts in the QT as the copper will kill them... There are huge UV on a couple of the tanks at the Florida Aquarium as well...
ophiura
Active Member
Large Fish Only systems commonly run with UV as a parasite preventative, because the monetary loss in livestock or in medication could be very significant when treating tens of thousands of gallons. They have few options and so a UV is reasonable. A UV on a fish only system is somewhat different, IMO, than on a reef system.
ctgretzky9
Member
I'll die swearing by kick-ich. Product is totally reef safe, and you cure the whole tank including ichs swimming stage, which is the important cycle. I used it a while back, no death to any inhabitants. It was reccomended to me by one of the only LFS I truly trust, and he has used it many many times with no problems.
I have also read a couplke of posts on it, and no negative feedback I have seen.
I have also read a couplke of posts on it, and no negative feedback I have seen.
dattong
Member
QT fish sounds like a good practice, I've heard many hobbists QT their fish for months before putting them in the display tank but I doubt it'd get rid of the ick for good. Not many of us invest a large enough QT tank due to our limited space, so larger fish usually end up stressing out in a small QT tank.
If you'd kept saltwater fish for a few years, you'd see a fact that ick will hunt the fish down untill it become immune to ick. I'd worry if my fish got other diseases but ick. A stress free envinronment and top notch water quality would help fish a great deal to fight the ick without any medicine aid. If your fish are happy eating, give them a chance to fight the ick off by themself. I'd say it'd be 6 months at most, your fish would be immune to ick.
It's just my opinion though. good luck
If you'd kept saltwater fish for a few years, you'd see a fact that ick will hunt the fish down untill it become immune to ick. I'd worry if my fish got other diseases but ick. A stress free envinronment and top notch water quality would help fish a great deal to fight the ick without any medicine aid. If your fish are happy eating, give them a chance to fight the ick off by themself. I'd say it'd be 6 months at most, your fish would be immune to ick.
It's just my opinion though. good luck
57chev
Member
Try this if ya get bored, I agree that boosting your fish food with garlic and vitamines are a good thing how couldn't it be. So, I thought why not take my brocolli and greens put them into a vacuum bag along with my garlic juice and vitamins and vacuum pack it. The vacuum in the bag forces the goods in to the brocolli.
Next, I have to chyme in on the UV thing, I have yet to see any ill affects of any kind using a UV in a reef system. The benifits far out weigh any costs if there is one. The important bio we have in our tanks is in the rock exponentially compared to the water itself. Look at the gigantic amount of water that is over a real reef compared to the live rock. Its also important to keep in perspective that all of our tanks are basically toilets when it comes to water quality compared to the ocean were the real reefs are. Its easy to think we all have great water quality just because of what our test kits say. There all we have, but its not much really. We need all the purification we can get even with frequent qater changes.
Next, I have to chyme in on the UV thing, I have yet to see any ill affects of any kind using a UV in a reef system. The benifits far out weigh any costs if there is one. The important bio we have in our tanks is in the rock exponentially compared to the water itself. Look at the gigantic amount of water that is over a real reef compared to the live rock. Its also important to keep in perspective that all of our tanks are basically toilets when it comes to water quality compared to the ocean were the real reefs are. Its easy to think we all have great water quality just because of what our test kits say. There all we have, but its not much really. We need all the purification we can get even with frequent qater changes.