Is my tank cursed??

[icon83]

:help:
I am not a religious person but I am beginning to believe that my tank is cursed.
I have a 75g reef tank with a 29g sump/refugium that is filled to around 18g. I estimate that there is about 90g in my system. The tank has been up and running for about 3 months and has cycled. I had a previous tank from which I used all the LR and about 40% of the water to seed this new system. I currently only have a small damsel, some mushrooms, some zoos, a hand leather, green star polys, and a few hermits and snails.
Up until last week, everything in the tank was flurishing. Then, the curse....
Last week, I purchased a small hippo tang from LFS, which turned out to be tremendous mistake. I must admit that it was kind of an impulse buy...he looked a little pale, but I rationalized this and got him anyway. (I always wanted a hippo). I acclimated him and put him into the tank...Although he was swimming around, he seemed really weak and kept getting stuck against the cuts in the overflow box and stuck against the intake if the powerhead...I figured he was just swimming weakly b/c he was new so I turned off the power to my sump and powerhead so the water was stagnant for him overnight. I also used some ammo-lock at this point because I had about .25 ammonia which I thought might be stressing him out a little.
The next morning I found him stuck in a rock upside down...he was still alive though, so i coerced him out of the rock and put him in my quarenteen tank b/c it looked like he had ick, or some other illness. He had white marks all over and he was very disoriented and couldn't get his bearings. He kept swimming in circles and looping upside down, this was very sad to watch.

Anyway, he didn't make it...I flushed him and then did a small 10g water change in my tank.
Over the next few days, everthing in my tank that had been flourishing up to that point had begin to look horrible! The mushrooms became shriveled, the polyps and the zoos were hiding...and worst of all, my devil's hand leather was black and totally limp! My one damsel seems fine, however I do not use her as an idication of anything because she is the toughest little fish ever and has survived the worst emergencies!
I ran some tests and found that my ammonia level was unbelievably high...I'm talkin like 8 ppm!! I don't know if anyone has ever seen this dark green color on the Aquarium Pharmacuedical test, but it is very disturbing. All of my other numbers were great however. Temp: 82 Salinity: 1.022 Trites: 0 Trates: 0 Phosphates: 0...but ammonia was 8!
I initially thought this was due to the ammo-lock which I have heard can give false readings, but my corals looked horrible so it seemed logical that something was definately wrong.
Over the last 3 days I have been working really hard to get this level to drop. I have been changing about 20 gallons a day, but this hasn't been showing any decrease on the test kit and the corals still look horrible. That is a total of 60 gallons which I have changed and no improvement....This is why I believe it is a curse, because it defies all science. If i'm changing that much of a percentage of my water, shouldn't it show some improvement??
Is it possible that the little hippo caused all of my bacteria to die and therefore wiping out my filteration?? I am planning on continuing to change 20 gallons tomorrow and the next day, but if anyone has any ideas other than a curse, I would greatly appriciate it...please!!
I'm starting to think I'm just not meant to this stuff, I don't know what I'm doing wrong!!

 

[icon83]

Oh, I should probably note that I tested the water I use for changes prior to putting it in my tank and there is no ammonia.

 

[lion_crazz]

Your tank is not cursed. You made a few new aquarists mistakes, which usually result in these types of disasters. Just to provide you with a little insight, here is what I would improve upon next time:
Originally Posted by Icon83
I have a 75g reef tank with a 29g sump/refugium that is filled to around 18g. I estimate that there is about 90g in my system. The tank has been up and running for about 3 months and has cycled.
Your tank really is too small for a hippo, plus, it is definitely too young for a tang, in my opinion. The water parameters are not stable enough to try a delicate fish like a hippo tang.
I must admit that it was kind of an impulse buy...he looked a little pale, but I rationalized this and got him anyway. (I always wanted a hippo).
Never impulse buy. This is why most people run into mistakes in this hobby. Did you see the fish eat before you took him home?
b/c he was new so I turned off the power to my sump and powerhead so the water was stagnant for him overnight. I also used some ammo-lock at this point because I had about .25 ammonia which I thought might be stressing him out a little.
And hear is where your problems begin. Because you cut off the flow to the tank, there was no oxygen in the tank when the water went stagnant. All the biological bacteria died off, thus starting a new cycle. Also, any sort of ammonia level will stress a fish out. Ammonia is toxic to fish and should always be 0.
The next morning I found him stuck in a rock upside down...he was still alive though, so i coerced him out of the rock and put him in my quarenteen tank b/c it looked like he had ick, or some other illness. He had white marks all over and he was very disoriented and couldn't get his bearings. He kept swimming in circles and looping upside down, this was very sad to watch.

I would recommend putting all fish in the quarantine tank first. This way, you can properly treat disease and observe all new fish before putting them in your display tank.
I ran some tests and found that my ammonia level was unbelievably high...I'm talkin like 8 ppm!! I don't know if anyone has ever seen this dark green color on the Aquarium Pharmacuedical test, but it is very disturbing. All of my other numbers were great however. Temp: 82 Salinity: 1.022 Trites: 0 Trates: 0 Phosphates: 0...but ammonia was 8!
Eight ppm will definitely kill corals. Any ammonia will effect corals negatively. Your tank is now going through a mini-cycle because you killed a lot of the bacteria when you turned the flow off in your tank overnight. Your ammonia will spike, come down, and then the nitrites will spike and come down. At this point, you need to let it go through a cycle so that the bacteria builds up. The water changes are removing the ammonia, but there is no bacteria in the tank to get rid of it when it spikes again. It just keeps on spiking, and you just keep stopping the cycle from occuring. If you want to speed the cycle up, I would recommend getting a bottle of Turbo Start or a pouch of Bio-Spira. This will add live bacteria to your tank in order to speed the cycle up.
Oh, I should probably note that I tested the water I use for changes prior to putting it in my tank and there is no ammonia.
When you make up water, you need to let it mix for 24-48 hours. You also need to put a powerhead and a heater in the container so that the temp and salinity are EXACT! When testing new water, you should never have ammonia. There is no need to test for this. You need to test pH, kH, salinity, and temperature of new water.

 

[keith burn]

my first though is ammonia is not off most of the time if ammonia is off that much
the outher numbers will be off aswell.
(so I turned off the power to my sump and powerhead so the water was stagnant for him overnight.)quote
I thank cutting off sump for 8h may havs started a new cycle
do you run carben or outher ammonia removind equment, thay may nead to change
if not get some
that much water change is not good to much to fast will start cycle aswell
the test kit, try to see if it is ok go to lfs to test water aswell
you have q/t tank running now put what you thank will live in it
DO NOT BUY SICKLEY FISH.
jmo good luck

keith
ps i looked at 1st post after i put in this one
i agree with all

 

[icon83]

ok ok...so maybe it isn't a curse...

thanks for taking the time to help me...I had no idea that cutting off the flow overnight could start a new cycle.
So what is the best thing to do at this point?
Should I stop with the water changes? Do you think my corals have any hope of making it through the cycle period? Also, how long should this "mini-cycle" take?

 

[lion_crazz]

Yes, you should stop with the water changes. That is only delaying the cycle not preventing it.
At this point, I would get a bacteria supplement and add that to your tank to speed up the cycle. I recommend Fritz-Zyme Turbo Start.
However, I doubt that your corals will make it through another cycle. The mini-cycle may take 2 to 3 weeks if you just let it run its course.

 

[icon83]

Do you think I should unplug my protein skimmer? I'm not sure but it seems like it is best to keep as much of the bacteria as possible and not try to remove it though skimming.
Just a thought...

 

[lion_crazz]

No, I would keep the skimmer operating. That is providing your tank with oxygen. The skimmer is not takiing out much biological at all.

 

[laddy]

The protein skimmer isn't removing bacteria, per se, it's removing organic matter out of the water column. You'll want to keep the skimmer on and running. I wouldn't induce with any kind of "insta cycle" though, I think it's a bad habit to get into. If your tank has readable ammonia levels, and nitrite levels, your tank is already cycling and I'd leave it alone.

 

[icon83]

I see....what do u think of this idea...
What if I go to my LFS and ask them for a bucket of water from one of their tanks...then take it home and acclimate my corals into that water and let them stay in there with a powerhead for circulation until the cycle is over??
Sorry, I am just thinkin of anyway possible to keep my corals so I don't have to completely start over...
I am really kicking myself for making these mistakes...no one to blame but me!!

 

[keith burn]

Originally Posted by Icon83
I see....what do u think of this idea...
What if I go to my LFS and ask them for a bucket of water from one of their tanks...then take it home and acclimate my corals into that water and let them stay in there with a powerhead for circulation until the cycle is over??
Sorry, I am just thinkin of anyway possible to keep my corals so I don't have to completely start over...
I am really kicking myself for making these mistakes...no one to blame but me!!

live it love it mess it up
we all have mess it up 1 or 2 time
me myself 496 time but who's counting

 

[lion_crazz]

Originally Posted by Icon83
I see....what do u think of this idea...
What if I go to my LFS and ask them for a bucket of water from one of their tanks...then take it home and acclimate my corals into that water and let them stay in there with a powerhead for circulation until the cycle is over??
Sorry, I am just thinkin of anyway possible to keep my corals so I don't have to completely start over...
I am really kicking myself for making these mistakes...no one to blame but me!!

Don't kick yourself, we all make mistakes.
That idea would not help you either, as the water does not contain biological bacteria. Their filter media and/or live rock is holding their biological bacteria. The water would do you no good.
Laddy, I don't mean to criticize, but how is adding extra biological bacteria a "bad habit"? If he does nothing, all the corals in his tank are most likely going to be dead. By adding the biological bacteria, he may be able to add enough bacteria to save at least a few things..

 

[laddy]

It isn't a certainty that your zoos and shrooms will die, they are more resiliant than most LPS'. I'd ride the cycle out, chances are that it will be quick. If I were you I'd concentrate on keeping the water topped off (stable SG), the heat constant, and the pH stable. You'd probably be better off asking the LFS to host your corals until the cycle was complete than puting them in a bucket.

 

[lion_crazz]

Originally Posted by Laddy
You'd probably be better off asking the LFS to host your corals until the cycle was complete than puting them in a bucket.
I like this idea best.

 

[icon83]

hmm...what if i purchase a new piece of LR from one of their established tanks, and put it in with the corals??
Any other suggestions?? Or is all hope lost?!?

 

[laddy]

The more LR the better, but it's not going to shorten your cycle to any measurable degree.

 

[icon83]

Originally Posted by Laddy
You'd probably be better off asking the LFS to host your corals until the cycle was complete than puting them in a bucket.
Didn't see that suggestion when I wrote the one before this...not a bad idea...
I wasn't gonna keep them in the bucket just use that water to put in my now empty quarentine tank with a light...but I guess there would be no bacteria anywhere as I don't have any substrate or corals or media in there.

 

[laxzach]

Could you add your corals to yor QT?

 

[emperor11]

Originally Posted by Laxzach
Could you add your corals to yor QT?

Its an idea, if he's never used copper, and can put lights on it.

 

[icon83]

No, unfortunetly I used some copper in there on the hippo so I had to empty it out...
What I was thinking is...
I get some water and a piece of rock from an established tank in a LFS, move my corals in there and use a spare PC light I have.
Would I still have a problem because of the lack of filtration?
I must admit, the LFS that are around where I live stink...and I feel kinda stupid going to them with a bucket of my corals and asking them to put them in their tanks for me...I feel like they wont understand my problem...
Maybe as a last possible resort, but I would much rather handle this at home if possible.
My hand leather looks all black already, so I doubt they would want to put it into their tanks.