Kind of lost as to whats next

[sk8fergy]

Thanks guys. Im going to stick with what i have for now. I upgraded to about 30lbs of lr today so thats it for now. So far my only problem that has come about is the hermit crabs are having a blast running all over the feather duster. Will the hurt it? I do weekly water changes as well as keep up with the very minimal evaporation. Oh, the goby seems starved as well. It looks fine but he wont stop chasing anything that floats past him. I guess its good hes already eating though.

 

[mr_x]

what does live rock have to do with a reef tank? live rock is part of our filtration system. i think we all agree that the surface area if the live rock will be where the necessary bacteria will reside, along with on the surface of the shallow sand bed mentioned and the glass....bla bla bla. meanwhile, corals or not, you'll need to have more live rock for 5 or 6 fish in a 29 gallon.
who says live rock needs to be exposed to air? i was asking how long it was exposed to air because if it was for any substantial time, then you will have some die off. maybe you should switch to kool-aid!

 

[1990jpyj]

sk8 i would keep a few gallons of saltwater handy just incase you amon. spikes. if you see it spiking you mgiht be able to save the firefish(from dieing). just do a quick 5 gallon water change and see if it helps. if the amonia gets to high at or above .5 you might have some problems with him. i was able to keep snails and stuff when i have a reading of .25, but they were hitchickers. i had my LR out for about an hour in air for transport, and i got a reading of .25 at my highest. hope this helps a little bit.

 

[aztec reef]

Originally Posted by Mr_X
http:///forum/post/2876435
what does live rock have to do with a reef tank? live rock is part of our filtration system. i think we all agree that the surface area if the live rock will be where the necessary bacteria will reside, along with on the surface of the shallow sand bed mentioned and the glass....bla bla bla. meanwhile, corals or not, you'll need to have more live rock for 5 or 6 fish in a 29 gallon.
who says live rock needs to be exposed to air? i was asking how long it was exposed to air because if it was for any substantial time, then you will have some die off. maybe you should switch to kool-aid!
Well, i would hate people come to my house and say to me: Hey nice rock tank! but wheres your corals?
"you'll need to have more live rock for 5 or 6 fish in a 29 gallon".
Not necesarily, unless lr is the primary filtration. But we've noticed that theres a conjuction of biofilters available.
Second of all, a fish tank doesn't require the same flawless chemistry as a reef.
Third of all, u dont need to add extra lr in order to get more bacteria. All u need is patience, bacteria reproduces/multiplies On demand. That means that when ever your tank has a little spike or the bioload is increased, or excess nutrients rise. Your tank triggers the existings bacterial colonies into multiplication in order to metabolize the new toxic molecular abundance. Thus your tank balances out. Untill the next human intervention..And its all over again.
Nitrogen cycle is not just a starting process of marine tanks, its an indicator that your tank is reacting to something changed in water chemistry..
Cycles are not a 1 time ocurrance, it happends throughout tanks life.
The reason why its so noticeble at first is due to the absence of the bacteria.
so what do we do? we crank it up! by adding some type of ammonia. we let it get kind of high at the start, so that we traine the ecosystem to not crash
in the events of ammonia spikes that might happen in the future.hopefully 1 month from inicial cycle the bacteria colonies have multiplyed good enough to endure future spikes without giving as a high measurable reading..
The reason why inicial cycles get so high ammo levels is due to the lack of bacteria colonies in tank..those of which are necessary for diffusion of nitrogen and other organic/inorganic compounds..
Lets say u get a bunch of lr right now, full of bacteria colonies. U put them in your tank but theres no fish.. Whats going to happend?
A.nothing.
B. bacterias will start to decompose if they dont have an energy source.(resulting in spikes or organic pollution)
C.you'll have to get some fish or phantom feed your tank in order to sustain some of that bacteria..
D. you have to do daily water changes to extract unmetabolize organics in order to keep up with the nitrogen byproducts...
E. all of the above.
who says live rock needs to be exposed to air?
maybe we should ask Sk8fergy that?

 

[mr_x]

i still disagree. you definitely need more surface area for more bacteria. you can't keep 6 or 7 fish in a 29 gallon tank without having some sort of surface area for the bacteria to reside. the glass and sand won't do it by itself.
that's why we say a pound to a pound and a half per gallon. if your theory were true..that suggestion would not be brought up. reef or not, sk8fergy will want to strive for clean water.

 

[sk8fergy]

The lr i got was from an established tank and already cured. As far as being exposed to air it was kept damp and wrapped up but not completely submerged due to transportation. The reason i dipped it in fresh saltwater and did a lil cleaning was to get off sponge that i did not want. The lfs said it would die after exposure to air anyways. Im currently doing weekly 5gal water changes and have extrra on standby in case of an emergency. I do test daily still but ive never had a major spike of any kind possibly due to all my lr being already cured. All the replies I have gotten so far have gone to good use. Thank you everybody. I did take your advice Mr X and got more lr rock and im up to 30lb. I pulled a newb move though and possibly introduced that and the new fish to close as far as time goes but i will keep an eye on it and the first sign of trouble hes goin back to the lfs to survive.

 

[spanko]

Just my $0.02.
You can have a fish only tank without any rock. This is the least expensive setup, but it is not necessarily the easiest to get started with. Getting started may take a little longer than the other setups while waiting for the nitrogen cycle to complete. Fish only tanks also require more frequent tank maintenance than FOWLR tanks. This means that you will need to stay on top of water changes and filteration cleaning to remove the nitrates that are constantly accumulating.
My recommendation to new saltwater startups is always to use live rock as this is an natural form of filtration and much easier to maintain a fish only tank with. Mechanical filtration is an adjunct to natural filtration IMO.

 

[aztec reef]

Originally Posted by Mr_X
http:///forum/post/2876804
i still disagree. you definitely need more surface area for more bacteria. you can't keep 6 or 7 fish in a 29 gallon tank without having some sort of surface area for the bacteria to reside. the glass and sand won't do it by itself.
that's why we say a pound to a pound and a half per gallon. if your theory were true..that suggestion would not be brought up. reef or not, sk8fergy will want to strive for clean water.
I like your conviction..
But, 2 1/2" of sand+15lbs lr+biowheel+ 4 walls of glass is plenty surface area for bacteria to grow and maintain 6-7 small fishes.. we're not talking about 7 tangs.. are we?
Also, im not saying that u can put all 7 fishes in the first month..
Patience...let your tank adapt to each bioload increments..

"that's why we say a pound to a pound and a half per gallon."
Umm, that rule was made and intended for reefs, As reefs have such high biodiversity and are bias Natural biofiltration oppossed to mechanical..
.Personaly it reminds me of the lousy rule of watt per gallon .

 

[sk8fergy]

Aztec i gotta say you know a ton. my head is still spinning. LOL

I think im set for now finally. Im suprisingly stoked with just the firefish. Hes a blast. I also just got a timer for my light set up so that will be regulated alot better. My one last question (for now) is why wont my hermit crabs leave my feather duster alone? They never touch his crown but climb and pick everywhere else. Yhere cant be that much food on him can there? Thanks so much everybody.