lion fish
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jester
Member
There are a couple of things you need to know. Do not cycle your tank with fish. Use the raw shrimp method(do a search on how to cycle a tank).
As for lion fish being deadly...not to humans.
However...YOU WILL BE VERY MISERABLE for a while.
I have a black volitan and the best way to do tank maintence is to pay attention to where he is.
One more thing, ask any and all you questions here before buying anything. 98% of all lfs
(local fish store) are only out for a sale.
You will get the best advice from everybody here.
We all learn from everybody's mistakes which save's $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$.
As for lion fish being deadly...not to humans.
However...YOU WILL BE VERY MISERABLE for a while.
I have a black volitan and the best way to do tank maintence is to pay attention to where he is.
One more thing, ask any and all you questions here before buying anything. 98% of all lfs
(local fish store) are only out for a sale.
You will get the best advice from everybody here.
We all learn from everybody's mistakes which save's $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$.
fshhub
Active Member
good points, but your plans for stocking are a bit high too
tangs ned a larger tank, 75 is my --. and all hte fish you have lixted are large, you only have a 55 gallon tank, look closely at waht you want, and think through your stocking needs, plan to have a lightly stocked tank , and always figure the size of an adult fish, not the size when you purchase
read this web page:
<a href="http://home.gardenet.co.za/landman/Starting%20with%20Marines.htm" target="_blank">web page</a>
HTH
tangs ned a larger tank, 75 is my --. and all hte fish you have lixted are large, you only have a 55 gallon tank, look closely at waht you want, and think through your stocking needs, plan to have a lightly stocked tank , and always figure the size of an adult fish, not the size when you purchase
read this web page:
<a href="http://home.gardenet.co.za/landman/Starting%20with%20Marines.htm" target="_blank">web page</a>
HTH
pacifica
New Member
I'm not going to tell you that those are way to many fish for a 55 because I don't know the size of your fish. So that said, If you are indeed set on the Lion fish I would start the cycle with some small damsels, and see what kind of lion you really have . Lionfish of course are by far hands down the smartest fish alive. I'm actually in the process of completing my custom stand/canopy for my 55 setup that will house a lion and possibly a snowflake, and a nice size tang for color. Your main concern should be the bio-load from the food the lion eats. If you got him/her pretty much on frozen food the load will be controllable. Since this is not an easy task, I would prepare the setup for an extreme load since feeder foods will leave a lot of waste.
To your question: I'll answer by telling you my plans. I plan on using a nice selective cleaner crew. NO shrimps. Long rod window scrapper, and rubber thick gloves. A daily movement of the window magnet will do wonders.
Deadly? - Reactions vary, however the top spines are venomous, causing reactions similar to a bee sting. So to each his own.
Hope this helps.
. Lionfish of course are by far hands down the smartest fish alive. I'm actually in the process of completing my custom stand/canopy for my 55 setup that will house a lion and possibly a snowflake, and a nice size tang for color. Your main concern should be the bio-load from the food the lion eats. If you got him/her pretty much on frozen food the load will be controllable. Since this is not an easy task, I would prepare the setup for an extreme load since feeder foods will leave a lot of waste. To your question: I'll answer by telling you my plans. I plan on using a nice selective cleaner crew. NO shrimps. Long rod window scrapper, and rubber thick gloves. A daily movement of the window magnet will do wonders.
Deadly? - Reactions vary, however the top spines are venomous, causing reactions similar to a bee sting. So to each his own.
Hope this helps.
fshhub
Active Member
ok, the math, as i said, you need to figure the adult size
so:
2 percs=6 inches
yellow tang is 8
dwarf lion 7
angel minimum 7 inches(most species are 12+), but here are the dwarf angels, 3 to 4 inches
butterfyly 6 minimum(most are larger)
now by my account that is 34 inches of fish in a 55 gallon(minimum, depending on hte species)
tangs, as i mentioned should have more seimming room, and for hte other general stocking
the general rule for sw is 1 inch per 5 gallons, now, this can often be pushed a bit, but i woudl not hink that much, that is over 3 inches per 5 gallons, wiht a real good biofilter and a stable system, i would not exceed 1 inch per 2 galons, but as i said, that is only a general rule, but fairly reliable
adn as i said, you should not consider a 3 inch dwarf lion as 3 inches, it is a 7 inch fish, it will grow, and some believe that they willll grow only to the size of the tank, THIS IS NOT TRUE in sw
HTH
so:
2 percs=6 inches
yellow tang is 8
dwarf lion 7
angel minimum 7 inches(most species are 12+), but here are the dwarf angels, 3 to 4 inches
butterfyly 6 minimum(most are larger)
now by my account that is 34 inches of fish in a 55 gallon(minimum, depending on hte species)
tangs, as i mentioned should have more seimming room, and for hte other general stocking
the general rule for sw is 1 inch per 5 gallons, now, this can often be pushed a bit, but i woudl not hink that much, that is over 3 inches per 5 gallons, wiht a real good biofilter and a stable system, i would not exceed 1 inch per 2 galons, but as i said, that is only a general rule, but fairly reliable
adn as i said, you should not consider a 3 inch dwarf lion as 3 inches, it is a 7 inch fish, it will grow, and some believe that they willll grow only to the size of the tank, THIS IS NOT TRUE in sw
HTH
fishymissy
Member
I agree with Fshhub and Jester, your stocking levels are too high, and you should cycle the tank with a raw piece of shrimp. Why stress a poor fish when it can be done (cycling) so painlessly?
Lionfish are quite easy to switch from live to frozen foods, you just have to be firm about it. I would also recommend that the lionfish be alone in either the main tank or a QT when you go to do this, it will be much easier to train him. You will want to switch him over to the frozen for health reasons. Feeding freshwater feeders is very bad for marine fish, ruins their livers and shortens their life spans.
The pain from being stung has been likened to the worst wasp sting you ever had.... times 10. If you do get stung, the first thing you should do is put the affected area under the hottest water you can stand (not scalding). This will help to break up the venom. You can also take an anti-histamine and tylenol for pain. If you have heart palpations, or trouble breathing, or you are allergic to bee, wasp stings, then right after the hot water treatment, you need to go to the hospital. If in doubt, go to the emergency room!
One good thing, lionfish are not really aggressive animals. When I have my hand in the lionfish tank, he swims away and goes to his hiding spot. I always know where he is though. If I get stung it will be my fault, not his!
Lionfish are quite easy to switch from live to frozen foods, you just have to be firm about it. I would also recommend that the lionfish be alone in either the main tank or a QT when you go to do this, it will be much easier to train him. You will want to switch him over to the frozen for health reasons. Feeding freshwater feeders is very bad for marine fish, ruins their livers and shortens their life spans.
The pain from being stung has been likened to the worst wasp sting you ever had.... times 10. If you do get stung, the first thing you should do is put the affected area under the hottest water you can stand (not scalding). This will help to break up the venom. You can also take an anti-histamine and tylenol for pain. If you have heart palpations, or trouble breathing, or you are allergic to bee, wasp stings, then right after the hot water treatment, you need to go to the hospital. If in doubt, go to the emergency room!
One good thing, lionfish are not really aggressive animals. When I have my hand in the lionfish tank, he swims away and goes to his hiding spot. I always know where he is though. If I get stung it will be my fault, not his!
lionpicasso
Member
Well this is what happened when a employee was stung at my lfs she was stung on the thumb, nothing happened until 1hr later her arm started swelling it got bigger and bigger, then they called poison control, they didn't know what to do so they told her to take advil to suppress swelling and stick her hand in hot water.
After the swelling went down her knuckles and joints turned black.
Thats what happened at my lfs.
After the swelling went down her knuckles and joints turned black.
Thats what happened at my lfs.
pacifica
New Member
Don't be mislead that Lion fish are not really aggressive.. Lion Fish are classified and are semi to aggressive fish. Not saying their going
to attack you, but they are semi to aggressive fish.
I admit at full adult size your stock is too high. However I'm a believer that if you want it and buy it. Enjoy it. But enjoy it as a juvenile, if your tank is not adequate size. Granted lets be sensible on tank size. Were not talking
about a 29 or 35 for your selection.
Everyone always respond with stocking limits and such, and I to DO abide by the inch per gallon rules, but realize fish do not grow x per month and reach x size by year. Its all a life cycle and it is a life cycle per fish and most importantly per environment.
So if you want to start out reaching your inch size limit of your tank, so be it. I don’t recommend it, but I wouldn’t knock you for wanting to do it. However know when to upgrade in tank size and when to remove a fish because of growth and stress, and when to upgrade/remove because of bio-loads.
Juveniles of the Angel, Tang, and Lion will be fine in a 55 for quite a while. Enjoy your fish.
Again Reactions from being stung vary.
to attack you, but they are semi to aggressive fish.
I admit at full adult size your stock is too high. However I'm a believer that if you want it and buy it. Enjoy it. But enjoy it as a juvenile, if your tank is not adequate size. Granted lets be sensible on tank size. Were not talking
about a 29 or 35 for your selection.
Everyone always respond with stocking limits and such, and I to DO abide by the inch per gallon rules, but realize fish do not grow x per month and reach x size by year. Its all a life cycle and it is a life cycle per fish and most importantly per environment.
So if you want to start out reaching your inch size limit of your tank, so be it. I don’t recommend it, but I wouldn’t knock you for wanting to do it. However know when to upgrade in tank size and when to remove a fish because of growth and stress, and when to upgrade/remove because of bio-loads.
Juveniles of the Angel, Tang, and Lion will be fine in a 55 for quite a while. Enjoy your fish.
Again Reactions from being stung vary.
fshhub
Active Member
good point pacifica, but
i do not agree with borrowing fish, so removing one is not an option in my book, not to mention that it is stressful on hte fish, most of us adopt our fish and saying i will return it, is easily said but often never happens
msot new aquariists do not realize the size of fish, and or when to upgrade(passing this limit is very stressful), an dthis is why when i see somethign like this, i offer information on where they stand, it was only a suggestion to rethink things before stocking
many of us do not have the room or finaances to upgragde tank sizes, so this maynever actually happen either
and lastly, you did make a good point about growth rates, but one thign is that some species grow alot in their first year, and some maybe only an inch or so, or even less, so htis must also be taken into account, IF t he individual would proceed from here
but as i said, often newcomers do not realize what is being pointed out, and assume that they can stock like they do a fw tank, so i and others will try and alert them to important information, that is all, there was no bashing, just offering advice and information
i do not agree with borrowing fish, so removing one is not an option in my book, not to mention that it is stressful on hte fish, most of us adopt our fish and saying i will return it, is easily said but often never happens
msot new aquariists do not realize the size of fish, and or when to upgrade(passing this limit is very stressful), an dthis is why when i see somethign like this, i offer information on where they stand, it was only a suggestion to rethink things before stocking
many of us do not have the room or finaances to upgragde tank sizes, so this maynever actually happen either
and lastly, you did make a good point about growth rates, but one thign is that some species grow alot in their first year, and some maybe only an inch or so, or even less, so htis must also be taken into account, IF t he individual would proceed from here
but as i said, often newcomers do not realize what is being pointed out, and assume that they can stock like they do a fw tank, so i and others will try and alert them to important information, that is all, there was no bashing, just offering advice and information
fishymissy
Member
BTW, this is only my opinion and like others have said, not meant to offend.
The reason I feel that stocking with the adult size of the animal in mind is important is that most people become attached to the animal and cannot bear to part with it, (think of a fish you have raised from a little tiny thing into a beautiful big animal, going into a total newbies tank who doesn't even know what cycling is...) and having the good intention of buying a larger tank later on, can be just that, a good intention. Life happens, and you can't always get that bigger tank. You loose a job, someone gets sick, the car breaks down.......
Lionfish are indeed classified as aggressive, but not for the reasons most people think of. It's mainly because there isn't a section for "Big and Perpetually Hungry"!
The thing about lions is that they will eat ANY fish that fits in their surprizingly large mouths, and ALL shrimp are appetizers!
But they do this in the nicest possible way.....
They will not, however, harass fish, take hunks out of them, attack people's hands, attack fish of the same or similar species.....
The reason I feel that stocking with the adult size of the animal in mind is important is that most people become attached to the animal and cannot bear to part with it, (think of a fish you have raised from a little tiny thing into a beautiful big animal, going into a total newbies tank who doesn't even know what cycling is...) and having the good intention of buying a larger tank later on, can be just that, a good intention. Life happens, and you can't always get that bigger tank. You loose a job, someone gets sick, the car breaks down.......
Lionfish are indeed classified as aggressive, but not for the reasons most people think of. It's mainly because there isn't a section for "Big and Perpetually Hungry"!
The thing about lions is that they will eat ANY fish that fits in their surprizingly large mouths, and ALL shrimp are appetizers!
But they do this in the nicest possible way.....
They will not, however, harass fish, take hunks out of them, attack people's hands, attack fish of the same or similar species.....
bob_purdue
New Member
IhjI have a dwarf lion fish (Fuzzy dwarflionfish or shortfin lionfish) he's gotta be one of the shyest things in my tank. My eibls chases him around all the time, and they're both about the same size 2-1/2 inches. I i put my hand in the tank to clean first thing he usually does is bolt for the other side and hide in some rock . As far as eating goes at first he didn't like frozen food but after i quit giving him live stuff (bout a week) i guess he relized it was that or starve. I've had this one for about 3 months now. (previous one died of heat stroke when the heater didn't turn off when i left town for the weekend )
. As far as eating goes at first he didn't like frozen food but after i quit giving him live stuff (bout a week) i guess he relized it was that or starve. I've had this one for about 3 months now. (previous one died of heat stroke when the heater didn't turn off when i left town for the weekend )
karlas
Member
stocking with size in mind is a real good idea because the rule of "the fish will only get as big as the environment" does not pertain to salt 95% of salt water fish if put in a small tank "will" outgrow the tank. your perculas could become lunch they only get about 3-4" in length. the dwarf can get up to about 8". and a lion will eat anything that it can fit in its mouth and they (even dwarfs) have pretty big mouths. other than compatability you should check feeding habits, level of care, and minimum tank capacity. for each fish.
cycling with fish can be very hard on them, a lot of them don't live through it. on the other hand some may live and be ok, but it can cause long term damage on the gills or respitory system of the fish. use the shrimp method, or are you getting lr if so you can use that to cycle also.
cycling with fish can be very hard on them, a lot of them don't live through it. on the other hand some may live and be ok, but it can cause long term damage on the gills or respitory system of the fish. use the shrimp method, or are you getting lr if so you can use that to cycle also.