Name calling

flricordia

flricordia

Active Member
You have to admit that some of the names given to zoanthid/palys is a bit rediculous and should not have been allowed on the site that most refer too.
Well, it is time for a change and since Mike has started something here and I for one believe it will grow into a database for zoa identification before too long I vote we do a poll on some of the names that have been assigned to certain zoanthids.
Take for instance PURPLE DEATHS, kidding on that one, it stays as is, but for example 'IS IT NIPPY IN HERE?'. Come on now! Zoanthids are becoming one of the most popular corals and as such should be given names that are not only descriptive but easy and a pleasure to use.
I for one do not want to be conversing with a fellow hobbyist and ask if he/she has any 'IS IT NIPPY IN HERE' for trade. How about Nipples or something (which I believe has already been assigned outside of that site to that zoanthid).
Maybe we could start a poll thread that when a name that should not apply to a certain zoanthid has been given it could be voted for a change. The new name would have to remain closely associated with the former though and if possible the origional namer should be contacted and asked if they would approve.
Say someone named a zoanthid after a loved one that had passed on, I would not want to change that for instance, no matter how silly the name sounded. But, since there really is no official common name given to anything except what people use and apply, there should be no problem to rename a few when the occasion calls for it.
There are also several zoanthids that are given different names and it is obvious that by close scrutiny they are the same and these should be assigned one name to end confusion.
 
codylowe

codylowe

Member
I vote against having a database on here period.
I have already seen some that are on this site that vary with another popular zoa naming website. I don't think that SWF.com should try to compete in the "zoa naming" business. They don't even sell rare/exotic zoas. All you can get are "green" or "brown" or "orange" zoas. I don't think that this site is qualified, based on the judgments of one person running the post.
That other site has been available -- and widely accepted -- for a while now and if we start calling the same zoas other similar names or renaming them completely, we, as consumers, get sucked into a larger black hole of the ridiculous amount of zoa naming madness going on already. It is asinine enough without this new 'database.'
The other site also vets new submissions pretty extensively. You cannot just send a pic of a coral and call it what you want. First, you must take a pic of it under your regular lighting and a 'flash' picture to show true colors. They then go through a panel to vote on whether they actually are a new submission or just a different morph of a named zoa/paly.
I am done with my rant... I would like to here other opinions.
Oh and i am renaming my Purple Deaths to Cody's Violet Madness. I am also going to raise the price to $75 a head, because the name is so cool.
 
bronco300

bronco300

Active Member
i personally dont like the names, so i call my zoos whatever i please unless there is an actual well known name across the board, like PPE, RPE, purple death etc...any other pinks and common zoos that have a hundreds names already i just picked a name i like and go with it.
 
flricordia

flricordia

Active Member
Originally Posted by codylowe
http:///forum/post/2629567
I vote against having a database on here period.
I have already seen some that are on this site that vary with another popular zoa naming website. I don't think that SWF.com should try to compete in the "zoa naming" business. They don't even sell rare/exotic zoas. All you can get are "green" or "brown" or "orange" zoas. I don't think that this site is qualified, based on the judgments of one person running the post.
That other site has been available -- and widely accepted -- for a while now and if we start calling the same zoas other similar names or renaming them completely, we, as consumers, get sucked into a larger black hole of the ridiculous amount of zoa naming madness going on already. It is asinine enough without this new 'database.'
The other site also vets new submissions pretty extensively. You cannot just send a pic of a coral and call it what you want. First, you must take a pic of it under your regular lighting and a 'flash' picture to show true colors. They then go through a panel to vote on whether they actually are a new submission or just a different morph of a named zoa/paly.
I am done with my rant... I would like to here other opinions.
Oh and i am renaming my Purple Deaths to Cody's Violet Madness. I am also going to raise the price to $75 a head, because the name is so cool.
I am not asking that names that are widely accepted be changed, only those that are beyond being rediculous and that will be put to a vote.
As far as this site creating a database, there is nothing anywhere that says that the other site is the one and only and certainly no laws making it so. I myself will refer to any sites and compile the info and make my own decisions for my own use, much like is doen on many sellers sites that choose to name a zoanthid something that has already been called by a different name. No one except the hobbyist accepts the common names and like any animal husbandry hobby, common names can vary and even change for example the reptile and amphibian hobby in general.
But to say that one is in charge of this database is WAY-OFF because if you will read the threads, there has been nothing but an arranging of the posts, pics, decriptions and I myself have submitted corrections on common names that were without question applied to the apropriate thread. The QB, so to speak, Mike, has done nothing but compiled info that we as the forum members have submitted ourselves along with info and names.
N one is out to change names commonly held as accurate and acceptable and no one is policing anyone that wishes to call something by another if they so desire to do so and if you wish to call your PD by another name and raise the price that is you choise and no one can do anything about it at all.
TO get into a debate is asinine itself, but to poll, vote, is the American way and I am for one willing to accept any results, I have no choise.
 
codylowe

codylowe

Member
First, i never stated that the other site was the "one and only" zoa/paly naming website. Only that it is widely popular and highly reputable. They represent the entire SW community and not just a small percentage, like swf.com. I said i vote against have a database on here at all. I don't mind a database with already named zoas/palys for reference; However, i do object to assigning new names or changing the names of zoanthids/palythoas. That is my vote... Of course, in an American way.
Neither was I meaning to direct anything negative at Mike (sorry Mike). Only to say that he, as the only one in charge of the post, will have to make the decision on whether the zoas are the same as another one, a different morph, and it's final choice of the name. There is not a "panel" or group that can choose on what the name should be, or what it actually is. It is, in the end, his judgment only with what will be populated in the database. And of course I understand that the users of this site submit the zoa pics and names along with info about it. But what is to say that they are not ignorant to an already named zoa/paly? I don't think this site should compete/or re-invent, the zoa naming database that is widely accepted by the saltwater community.
On another note, I think that the discover of a new zoa/paly should be able to name it. But the classification and naming of it should be done in a highly vetted way.
 
reefkprz

reefkprz

Active Member
Originally Posted by codylowe
http:///forum/post/2629613
First, i never stated that the other site was the "one and only" zoa/paly naming website. Only that it is widely popular and highly reputable..
reputable my butt, they have the Hasselpaly like its a real zoa..... half the names arent spelled correct, alfa omega? its Alpha and omega.... that site is nothing more than the same thing as the thread here. these names are all fgictional and have no bearing on any scientific base. that site is no more legitimate than a thread created here.
 
michaeltx

michaeltx

Moderator
this is in no way an attempt to dis-credit or conflict with the other nameing site at all. DO I wish that eventually we will have one of the largest databases on the net yeah sure. I use the other site in compareing zoa pictures aswell I do not go out to NAME a zooanthid coral that is not the intention here.
what you are missing however is the posts in the open Thread that once they are submitted with the name the are transfered to the the database thread they are deleted. Yes I am the only that is posting in that thread but its only to keep it neat and clean instead of debates on names and such in the thread. or post thats a cool one. where can I get one, where did you get it. how much did you pay. The other thread is for If someone sees a zooanthid they know by another name the name will be added as an AKA name, or if they would like to add something else.
I am in no way an expert on Ids and have never claimed to be one.can I come up with cool and spify names sure but why again thats not what this is about its about collecting images taking by the members here and putting them in one area for people to look at and see common names and care and growth rates of these corals.
If I ever get to a point where I can look at a zoa and say no its this and this is why maybe I will start getting into the name game but I highly doubt it.
also another reason for this is since SWF.com is a store and links to sites with competitors is not allowed to be posted it gives the posters a way to say hey look at this thread and see if it resembles the solaris zoa and its a way for the members here to look at photos and decide if they want to start looking for that particular coral.
Mike
 
michaeltx

michaeltx

Moderator
Originally Posted by reefkprZ
http:///forum/post/2629669
reputable my butt, they have the Hasselpaly like its a real zoa..... half the names arent spelled correct, alfa omega? its Alpha and omega.... that site is nothing more than the same thing as the thread here. these names are all fgictional and have no bearing on any scientific base. that site is no more legitimate than a thread created here.
I have noticed that aswell. I have also noticed a few other things lately but will keep them to my self.
Mike
 
michaeltx

michaeltx

Moderator
I would like to say on the other ~~widely accepted site~~ until awhile back only had one person nameing and catagorizing them.
Originally Posted by who dah
With this in mind, it became apparent that I could no longer exclusively take on this task. After all, this site was my gift to the Zoanthid community, and thus it seems only right to have the community help decide it's future.
just thought I would bring that up aswell
Mike
 
deltablack22

deltablack22

Active Member
Hey Mike,
I know your overseeing the zoanthid naming thread and I think its a good idea. For it to be effective I think you should try to group like polyps together. Any similar morphs should be back to back posts in order to keep the confusion down to a minimum. A thread isnt probably the best place to have an ID area unless you lay down some clear navigational rules ahead of time and give it some structure.
I was thinking along the lines of what Beth has done in some of her disease forums with a main page and links to other threads. Something like:
Zoanthids-
Blue
Green
Orange
Purple
Red
Yellow
MISC
Palys-
etc.............
Is this kinda what the final product will look like?
Best of luck anyway and I for one appreciate your work in compiling a "new" ID area.
 
michaeltx

michaeltx

Moderator
the format its in now wont be the final format. but without knowing how many of what type there is then its hard to leave room. once there is enough it will be broke down alittle bit more and links in one post for like you said green colored or something linking it to another thread with all those pictures in that thread.
I just couldnt do it with a handful and know which direction it should be in. I also didnt know how well it would go over or how much participation there would be in that project.
Thanks
Mike
 
deltablack22

deltablack22

Active Member
Yeah I would think you would wait until you had enough to at least start making categories and such. I just wanted to make sure it wasnt going to be one giant thread before adding to it.
 
michaeltx

michaeltx

Moderator
o no I wouldnt like to look at a thread like that for very long LOL its a transition thread really I can move posts in and out of that one once its starts getting set up in a permanant manner.
Mike
 
codylowe

codylowe

Member
Originally Posted by reefkprZ
http:///forum/post/2629669
reputable my butt, they have the Hasselpaly like its a real zoa..... half the names arent spelled correct, alfa omega? its Alpha and omega.... that site is nothing more than the same thing as the thread here. these names are all fgictional and have no bearing on any scientific base. that site is no more legitimate than a thread created here.
I am sure someone named it "alfa omega" rather than it being a mistype. If you notice others such as "er1ck's paly" or "Europas"... Again the discover has rights to pick the name.
Anyways, I see a couple of IDs already in the database here that i would dispute as being other names. A lot of them have "aka" or two names?? That's why i am against it.
For example, I don't get the Gorilla Nip ples aka Pink Panthers... Gorilla Nip ples don't look anything like what is pictured... They are Pink Panthers and Pink Panthers only. Why have Gorilla Nipples there?
The solars look a lot like Bam Bam Oranges. Why are they called solars?
The way i see it is that there is no verification.
I can call, or insert into the database, something with a certain name on here, when in fact it is not. Then i can sell it for way more than it's worth.
 
rebelprettyboy

rebelprettyboy

Active Member
On mine only the mouth are orange. And Bams Bams are usually almost the whole disk orange. Ill see if I can find a better pic.
 
michaeltx

michaeltx

Moderator
thats where this is different. OK you see one or 2 how ever many that you disagree with the name of alright now we can go back and look at these and get the right ID> like I said I am in no way an expert I can only look and see what they look like to me and go by what posters add. they go by what they are told by a site or individual they purchased them from.
since you are seeing ones missed named in your opinion help make it better and take alook at them and see and make recomendations on what you say they should be by what you see. I have already asked a couple of others to do the same thing and make it a verifiable list.
I am easy person to get along with I promise LOL
Mike
 
rebelprettyboy

rebelprettyboy

Active Member
Couple Quick snaps. (If they are Bams Bams then great, but IDK. Just orange disk isnt big enough for me and way more black are on the disk of my zoas.)
Current Pic


OLD PIC

ALSO MIKE I THINK THE 1st 2 PICS ARE BETTER THAN THE ONES I POSTED. If U want u can switch them out
 
michaeltx

michaeltx

Moderator
Anyways, I see a couple of IDs already in the database here that i would dispute as being other names. A lot of them have "aka" or two names?? That's why i am against it.
but you can go to different places and there will be more than one name listed. IE the database we are talking about and another seller may call them something completely different. most zoas are a morph of another though flricordias thread shows how completely different they can look in a few months just from lighting and parameters.
Mike
 
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