Need HELP / doing something wrong?

jon in tx

Member
I've had my 90 gal tank set-up for 8 months and have killed 13 fish!
Only 2 of my 6 remaining have been in the tank for > 2 months. I've been closely following the advice of my LFS which guaranteed a couple of the fish who died within 1-2 weeks. However, most of the fish live about 2 months. I need some advice on what I'm doing wrong (or not doing) PLEASE!
I have a 90 gallon and have only had 3-6 items living at one time (tank is not overstocked). I only feed a small amount every other day. I test my salinity (1.019-1.021), ammonia (0-0.25), ph (7.8-8.2), nitriates (0) & nitrates(0-5) regularly. I do a 15% water change (water from LFS) every 6 weeks and of course add fresh water more often (from LFS).
I have 135 lbs of live rock with built in sump (LFS) - tank pic attached.
WHERE DID I GO WRONG?
:notsure:
:help:
 

royal gang

Active Member
your salinity should be 1.024-1.025
your pH should be 8.1-8.3 not even in the sevens
te ammonia is toxin to your fish.
your alkalinity should be about 3.5
do you even have a heater? your temp. should be 76 oF to 80 oF
i don't even se a normal pump in there lol
 

bill109

Active Member
are the fish that ared dieing have any noticable spots or markings on them or do they look under fed? are the getting anough nutrition.. i feed my YT frozen mysis and flake everyother day and and swith on and off.
 

bill109

Active Member
ok here couls be your problem... do water changes every other weeek tht i when i do them on my 30 gal. ph is a killer i believe. it will crash our system like nothing.. 13 fish is a ton...
but remember the salt is only hundreTHS of salt so it isnt much but wben you do a top off make sure you add a LITTLE bit of salt to get it wherer it should be,
 

jon in tx

Member
Originally Posted by ROYAL GANG
your salinity should be 1.024-1.025
your pH should be 8.1-8.3 not even in the sevens
te ammonia is toxin to your fish.
your alkalinity should be about 3.5
do you even have a heater? your temp. should be 76 oF to 80 oF
i don't even se a normal pump in there lol
Yes, heater is on tank and water stays at 78. The pump is under the tank.
 

jon in tx

Member
Originally Posted by bill109
are the fish that ared dieing have any noticable spots or markings on them or do they look under fed? are the getting anough nutrition.. i feed my YT frozen mysis and flake everyother day and and swith on and off.
Most do not have anything clearly wrong with them. The only one that I noticed something was the last one I lost... damsel (pic attached). I posted on another thread and someone thought it was victim of other fish (Coral Angel would be my guess though I never witnessed a problem). My LFS said it might have been some sort of bacteria??
 

garnet13aj

Active Member
People have sited most of the things that could be the problem before me, so I'll just say, you may be adding too many fish too fast. If you're having trouble with fish dying I would stop adding fish for a month or two and concentrate on the ones you have. Be diligent about water changes, get the salinity up. Do you have a cleanup crew? They may be nice to have if you don't have one to clean up the mess you fish make during and after feeding. Good luck.
 

garnet13aj

Active Member
Also, do you have a quarentine tank? If not I would set one up to put any sick looking fish as well as any new fish in. They can be lifesavers, literally!
 

bill109

Active Member
hmmm cool pic of the damsel never seen a pic like tht b4. but when you said where did you go wrong... going to tht lfs and keeep going there,, they wanna make a few quick bucks. they dont care much about your tank.
 

mandarin w

Member
Originally Posted by Jon in Tx
I've had my 90 gal tank set-up for 8 months and have killed 13 fish!
Only 2 of my 6 remaining have been in the tank for > 2 months. I've been closely following the advice of my LFS which guaranteed a couple of the fish who died within 1-2 weeks. However, most of the fish live about 2 months. I need some advice on what I'm doing wrong (or not doing) PLEASE!
I have a 90 gallon and have only had 3-6 items living at one time (tank is not overstocked). I only feed a small amount every other day. I test my salinity (1.019-1.021), ammonia (0-0.25), ph (7.8-8.2), nitriates (0) & nitrates(0-5) regularly. I do a 15% water change (water from LFS) every 6 weeks and of course add fresh water more often (from LFS).
The level are off as mentioned earlier, and your water changes are not fregent enough.
I have 135 lbs of live rock with built in sump (LFS) - tank pic attached.
WHERE DID I GO WRONG?
:notsure:
:help:
In my opionion, it seem you may have gone wrong trusting your LFS too much.
Fist off don't get anymore fish until you get your tank levels under control.
Next time you go to the LFS store to pick up your water, ask if they have a TDS meter. As them to test the water you are buying. Make sure the water you are getting has a TDS level of no greater than .05. When you buy or make your own RO water you are taking the junk out of the water. A TDS meter measures the the junk that is left in the water. LFS are notiorious for not changing their filters on a regular basis. And you are spending your money on nothing but tap water that has passed thru a filter and in some cases can come out worse than it went in. If they don't have a TDS meter, or the levels are high don't get your water from them anymore. But really you should look into buying your own RO filter system. They are only about 120 bucks on the major aution site.
Do your water changes every week or even twice a week right now. Your amonia and nitrate are high. the amonia should be zero, and nitrate should not be more than 20, but zero is better there too.
When you get your fish, only add one at a time. Keep it in quarintine for a few weeks before you put them in your tank. Before you buy your fish, check it out, look for spots, white or black dots, it will look like pepper. Look for torn fins, this could be signs of a desease or other fish picking on it, and your fish may be overly stress. Make sure the fish is curious, swimming around look at every thing in the tank, That it is interested in its surroundings. Ask the LFS it you can see the fish eat, and don't let them get away with feeding brine shrimp. If they say the fish has already eaten for the day, then come back and watch them eat on another day. If all looks good, ask the LFS if you can put a refundable deposit down on the fish, and see if the fish is ok in a week, if so then go ahead and purchase the fish. Bring it home and QT it for a few weeks.
Another issue may be the types of fish you had die, What type of fish were they. Some fish are just harder to keep, some need a very mature well established tank. If you still remember the fish you had that died that could help.
 

jon in tx

Member
Originally Posted by garnet13aj
People have sited most of the things that could be the problem before me, so I'll just say, you may be adding too many fish too fast. If you're having trouble with fish dying I would stop adding fish for a month or two and concentrate on the ones you have. Be diligent about water changes, get the salinity up. Do you have a cleanup crew? They may be nice to have if you don't have one to clean up the mess you fish make during and after feeding. Good luck.
What is a cleanup crew? Do you mean snails? I had 12 originally - think maybe half that many are left/active. I am having to Mag-Float the glass almost daily due to algae. Any suggestions?
 

jon in tx

Member
Originally Posted by garnet13aj
Also, do you have a quarentine tank? If not I would set one up to put any sick looking fish as well as any new fish in. They can be lifesavers, literally!
No I don't . Most of the fish I've lost didn't look sick when they died... many ate the day before they died?
 

jon in tx

Member
Originally Posted by mandarin w
In my opionion, it seem you may have gone wrong trusting your LFS too much.
Fist off don't get anymore fish until you get your tank levels under control.
Next time you go to the LFS store to pick up your water, ask if they have a TDS meter. As them to test the water you are buying. Make sure the water you are getting has a TDS level of no greater than .05. When you buy or make your own RO water you are taking the junk out of the water. A TDS meter measures the the junk that is left in the water. LFS are notiorious for not changing their filters on a regular basis. And you are spending your money on nothing but tap water that has passed thru a filter and in some cases can come out worse than it went in. If they don't have a TDS meter, or the levels are high don't get your water from them anymore. But really you should look into buying your own RO filter system. They are only about 120 bucks on the major aution site.
Do your water changes every week or even twice a week right now. Your amonia and nitrate are high. the amonia should be zero, and nitrate should not be more than 20, but zero is better there too.
When you get your fish, only add one at a time. Keep it in quarintine for a few weeks before you put them in your tank. Before you buy your fish, check it out, look for spots, white or black dots, it will look like pepper. Look for torn fins, this could be signs of a desease or other fish picking on it, and your fish may be overly stress. Make sure the fish is curious, swimming around look at every thing in the tank, That it is interested in its surroundings. Ask the LFS it you can see the fish eat, and don't let them get away with feeding brine shrimp. If they say the fish has already eaten for the day, then come back and watch them eat on another day. If all looks good, ask the LFS if you can put a refundable deposit down on the fish, and see if the fish is ok in a week, if so then go ahead and purchase the fish. Bring it home and QT it for a few weeks.
Another issue may be the types of fish you had die, What type of fish were they. Some fish are just harder to keep, some need a very mature well established tank. If you still remember the fish you had that died that could help.
Thanks for the info! I'll check into the RO filter system. The fish that died were Cleaner Shrimp, Foxface, Yellow Tang (3), Strawberry Psuedo, Starfish (2), Bi-Color Angel, Formossa Wrasse, Yellow Tail Damsel, Crab-Sally Lightfoot & Slug. All were added slowly (1-2 at a time with 2-3 weeks in between)
 

puffer32

Active Member
Your salinity is fine, fish only tanks do not need high salinity, but if its 1.019, that can kill inverts, 1.21 is fine, But, you must keep everything stable in your tank. No jumps are tolerated well. Do daily top offs , with preferably your own RO water. Keep PH stable at 8.0 or higher. Your ammonia should be 0, could be up cause of dieing fish, water changes will help, do a large one now, then small ones weekly/bi weekly. Try a clown, or cromis and if they live for a month, add another, but add slowly, but only when water is stable.
 

mandarin w

Member
Originally Posted by Jon in Tx
Thanks for the info! I'll check into the RO filter system. The fish that died were Cleaner Shrimp, Foxface, Yellow Tang (3), Strawberry Psuedo, Starfish (2), Bi-Color Angel, Formossa Wrasse, Yellow Tail Damsel, Crab-Sally Lightfoot & Slug. All were added slowly (1-2 at a time with 2-3 weeks in between)
The cleaner shrimp, sally lightfoot and the slub probley died because the salinity was to low, and if the slug is what I am thinking, the pretty blue or purple one, those need a very mature tank, and some can be toxic when they die, those should be for very experienced hobbist.
The starfish- starfish need to be acclamated very slowly like for about two hours, and they also need a very mature tank. When we say mature tank, that usally means over a year old.
The Foxface, Wrasse and the tang, they seem to stress easier than the other fish, and once they get to stressed they can easily develope ick.
The strawberry and the damsel are usally pretty hardy fish, but with things being so off, and they other fish dieing that may have just been to much.
It appears to me, that your LFS is not looking out for your best interest. If so they would have never let a new hobbist have a starfish, sea slug, wrasse in a new tank. They definately should have never sold you the slug. They should have told you, that they are very hard to keep, and some (I don't know which one you got, when they die release toxins into the tank, that will kill your tank. I wonder if your LFS even told you that the Fox face is venomous?
For right now you need to get your tank stable. Work on that first. While you are waiting for your tank to stablize, buy, find borrow a book and marine fish. This book will tell you about all the different fish, their needs and about any problem that can arrise from these fish.
I learned my lesson the hard way about the Foxface. When I was new to the hobby and just started up my tank, my LFS sold me a foxface, I wasn't even looking for that, but he said if you buy a big fish, you have to get a second big fish, so they will fill comfortable in their new envoriment. Since I just got a Sailfin tang, he suggested the fox face. Never told me any thing, My daughter (who was 15 at the time) always enjoyed helping my with the tank, she would aqua scape the rocks, move this and that. Any time there was something to do inside that tank, she was there. It was the closest she was going to come to swimming in the ocean, in her words. After we had the Fox Face for about 4 months, that is when I learnd that they were venomous. Which was an extra important fact I should have know. My daughter is deadly alergic to bee stings and spider bits, She has to carry around an epi pen just in case she ever get stung or bitten. If that foxface would have stung her, she could have died. I would not have had any ideal why she was getting so sick. That is why I get so upset when a LFS does not stand up to their responsibility and tell people about such things. Yes it is your responsiblity to research. But the LFS that a newbe goes to, is usally the same one. They know what you know and don't know and like to take advantage of that. I have seen them also try to get newbies excited about things and get them to buy more than they should.
Sorry about ranting, I just want to stress the importants of learning everything about the hobby, and KNOW what it is you are putting into your tank, and what they can do.
 

slugg3r

Member
Originally Posted by Jon in Tx
Thanks for the info! I'll check into the RO filter system. The fish that died were Cleaner Shrimp, Foxface, Yellow Tang (3), Strawberry Psuedo, Starfish (2), Bi-Color Angel, Formossa Wrasse, Yellow Tail Damsel, Crab-Sally Lightfoot & Slug. All were added slowly (1-2 at a time with 2-3 weeks in between)
First Bring your salt level up slowly. Your inverts are dieing from that low salinity, and you still have snail left at least that need the higher salt level.
I think I see from your picture you still have a Yellow Tang, and you say you have had 3 yellow tang's die. How many were ever in at one time. Your tank is too small for 3 or more of them and if you had only 2 they would probably stress each other out until one died.
Also it might be worth it to add a powerhead to push some more flow through your live rock. It should help to keep the tank more stable. Even though it is FO you need a certain level of flow to let the LR do its job.
 

garnet13aj

Active Member
Cleanup crew includes snails crabs and other organisms that don't add very much to the bio load but do a lot to clean up the tank.
 

1journeyman

Active Member
How are you testing your water? Specifically ammonia and salinity?
I agree that your salinity is too low. It could be way off though, depending on how you are testing it.
 

jon in tx

Member
Originally Posted by 1journeyman
How are you testing your water? Specifically ammonia and salinity?
I agree that your salinity is too low. It could be way off though, depending on how you are testing it.
For salinity, I test on hydrometer. I usually do three dips and take avg - sometimes one can be slightly different. For Ammonia, I have a test kit with test tube to put water in, add drops and compare color vs guide. I didn't realize there are different ways to test these - are these OK?
 
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