New tank setup, the right way this time

[nca989]

:help: :help: :help: :help:
Hi all, like many other here, I need some first timer help. Let me start with the story, and what I have, then my questions.
This past weekend I bought: 72g bow front glass tank, two part glass top, 48" Coralite #53008 50/50 lighting, Magnum 350 deluxe, Seaclone 100 skimmer, 60lbs of coralite (the black stuff), 20lbs of live sand (still sealed in bag), a 300watt heater, digital therm, several clean 5g buckets, and dry salt (Red Sea).
Ok so I set up the tank filter and heater,and mixed the salt water in the tank with hose water, and used something to take the cholrine and chloramine out. Well I made a vital mistake at that point (temp 80, 1.022) and dumped the coralite in unrinsed. So I've fought with that for a few days, and decided to dig the crap back out and wash it and siphon the silt and let the filter do the rest. I left the magnum on with the chem. filter while I went to work, only to come home to the filter so clogged the canister started to dribble water on my floor. :scared:

At the end of my wits I emptied the darn tank cleaned it, and am waiting for my carpet to dry. Now I am interested in doing it the RIGHT way!
So my questions after this long book of a post! I have dry salt, it's just not feasible to transport 70g of water from the lfs. Is it better to mix it all in the tank as I did before? or Mix it in 5g batches and dump into the tank? Also since the water would need to be treated for chlorine, the live sand and rock (I have yet to get) should go in after the treated and salted water? Say I have the treated salted water in the tank, temp is perfect: Should I add the LR, LS, and Coralite in that order? or do you all wonderfully knowledgable ppl have some better insight? Keep in mind I've already put probably $1300 into this stuff, and the budget is wearing thin.... and the LR is going to cost me another $200-$300?
OH, shall I wait to buy the LR till the temp and gravity is right? How much LR do I need to start (I can always add later right?) Is there something that you use to notify you of leaks, or at least prevent them from getting to the carpet(rental house!)again? I was thinking of getting a 10g tank and putting the canister in it with something under it, so there is at least 5g of space if the thing decides to start puking water again.
Also, is there any questions I may have missed asking, something relevent that I'm not seeing?

 

[hot883]

Tap water to me is NEVER acceptable. It's a pain, but do it right. Get ro/di water or you will battle algeas from the beginning. I mix my water in a large rubbermade container, add salt and aerate it with a powerhead for a day and of course is heated. I place my live rock on the glass then the sand then the water. If you place a plate on the sand and pour the water SLOWLY onto the plate there will be very little cloudiness to the water.

 

[rcdude1990]

heres wat i did
i have a 55 gallon, 20 lbs of LS, a wet/dry filter wit skimmer and heater
heres wat i did step by step
put up my tank as in put tank on stand make sure its level and put overflow box in place
then i filler my tank up wit hose water like u did. (WEN DOIN THIS U SHOULD PUT A OLD SHIRT IN FRONT OF THE HOSE SO IT COLLECTS THE METALS AND STUFF)
added dechlorifier and mixed for 10 min.
then i started the filter to filter out the dirt stuff in water and let it do that the rest of the night
then in the morning i stopped everything and added my salt and mixed for like 15 min.
then i started the filter again and waited at least 5 hours
after that i checked my salinity, if it was to low i added more salt if it was to high i added some fresh water
then wen everything was ok i let it sit for the next day
then in the morning i measure my salinity again to make sure it was still good, then i added my LS (wen doin this dont dump the whole bag like nothing, u gotta do it nice and slow so u get even amount of sand everywere and so u dont cause a huge sand storm makin ur skimmer and filter go crazy.
then i waited like a week and i added my LR

 

[joncat24]

DO it just like 883 said.....mix your water get it at right salinity and temp.
Put your rock in on the glass them pour the sand around it
then slowly add the water to avoid the cloudiness.
As far as tap water goes ...NO WAY!!
Believe me, I thought about it, cause it seems easier to use it. But in the long run, you will wish you didn't.
Even though I probably looked kinda goofy walkin out of walmart with two grocery carts full of gallon jugs of water>LOL

 

[nca989]

Ok so did you buy distilled or??? If I were to mix the water in some large tubs, it may take me more than one session to get 70 gallons... do you think it's possible or a good idea to use to intake hose from my magnum in the tub and put the output in my tank and pump the water in that way? cause there is NO way I would be able to lift a bucket higher than the tank to be able to siphon. Also, how much live rock do you think I should use for 70 gallons, even if it's just enough to cycle the tank and lay a firm ground layer leaving me able to stack more on top of it later. I would like to eventually have some sand bed and some rock bed, rocks at the back obviously. Oh one more thing, say I'm stacking the rock in my tank, do I need to put the heater and pump tubes in front of, behind, or somewhere between the rocks?
Oh last thing for now, the output tube of the magnum, that's supposed to eventually be in the water right? otherwise it forces too much air into the water? or is the air a good thing????
So lost, the help from you guys is WONDERFUL! :joy:

 

[doglvr]

When the half cured & half uncured 40lbs of LR went in to my 30 gallon, I turned on the new Seaclone skimmer. By the next morning, I was so disappointed with the performance on the Seaclone, I washed it, dryed it, and took it back to the LFS in exchange for a Coralife Superskimmer 65. In the first 24 hours, the CL65 had much better performance.

 

[nca989]

Hrm, ok, well I'm supposed to be buying a guys whole setup today. Mainly because I wanted his rocks. LOL, that almost sounds dirty if you weren't following the conversation! Hopefully a different skimmer is in the group. And just to clarify, what exactly is the skimmer doing? I know the technical crap, pulling the protein off the water, but can someone dumb it down for me?

 

[chickadee]

i agree with hot, don't use tap water... i don't know who told you that putting a t-shirt over the hose will filter out the minerals, but that's not going to do the trick. That tap water conditioner stuff is crap too. all it does is coat the bad minerals in your tank so they don't show up on test kits, but after a while it wears off and you're left with an algae bloom and regret of not using ro water. Distilled water is fine too, but ro/di is the best. This is how i setup my tank:
filled with premixed water, then added dead sand and dead rock, then heated to proper temp, and added all powerheads. You should get it at the right temp before adding any live sand or rock, or else you'll kill the rock and sand. after it was at the right temp. i tested all of my water parameters - once again these have to be at the right levels, or you could kill some of the rock and sand. After everything checked out fine, i added the live sand and rock. it may be cloudy, but it'll settle after a while, and since you don't have fish yet, it's not a big deal. after everything settled, i started my filters. That worked pretty well for me. hope this helps!!!

 

[1journeyman]

NCA, the bext first step would be to buy This Book .
I say that so you can read for yourself the theory behind why we do things... Take tap water for instance. Some will say it's ok to use... countless others will say "no way". The book will explain why... (never heard of the using a shirt to catch contaminants but clearly that won't work well, if at all...)
The book will also explain to you filtration methods, skimmers, lighting, water flow, etc. Sand depth and type, rock types, Nitrogen cycle, all these things will be explained.
You've done the right thing asking here, and you'll get a lot of help. I just suggest getting some facts into your hands so that you can make educated choices to the different opinions you'll receive.
Good luck with your tank!

 

[taznut]

im new at this so maybe this is wrong... i have a 29gal and when i started the tank i justed tap water... now when i do water changes i use RO water from target... my water levels have been okay but i did get thick algae on the back glass (prob. from initial tap water) but its good for my cleaning crew...

 

[nca989]

Thanks for all the help guys (and gals). I got some weird looks but 3 carts full of water out of walmart, a ton of work and waiting and it's up and running. I need to figure out this powerhead thing. I acquired two of them both Rio's, an 800 and a 1700, I need to do some looking to figure out which to use or both or whatever. I have the filter running and it seems to be moving a lot of water and air on one side of the tank but the other side lays fairly quiet... should I be concerned? 30-50lbs of LR and 40lbs? used sand from an up and running system (didn't weigh them, got lucky with someone selling off a whole setup - guess the wife didn't think he needed the hobby anymore), I also added about 50lbs of new washed sand to it. I've heard too much sand isn't good - more than an inch I think... it that true? I've got 2x65watt 50/50's and a 38watt something or other on top of it, gonna see about adding some more lighting, and rigging up some "moon light" tomorrow. My husband is starting to regret letting me have all this, he doesn't see me anymore unless I need him to help move something. Speaking of which I pulled something in my back real bad this week setting all this up so alll the moving is up to him now, I can't even pick up a bag of sand. Tomorrow I'm out to pick up the book you mentioned journeyman, I saw it at the lfs tonight but it was like $40, I think I'll check the book store for it or amazon. Anything else I'm forgetting? I never knew there was SOOOOO much to know! I'm just starting to look into what all I want to go together in my tank now.

 

[michaeltx]

theres is a lot of debate on Deep Sand Beds some swear by it others like myself that have went through one crashing will say read and think about it first!.
Saltwater needs alot of movement for oxygen and other problems that can occur, you can never have to much water flow ** almost** I would put the power heads in where isnt much current in the tank on the other side behind the rocks and down towards the sand bed.
there is always something to learn in this hobby you will get varyied responces and different opinions to what is *RIGHT* the thing is a few years ago it was completely different than some of the things out there now. for instance crushed coral used to be the greastest thing ever well now its readily accepted that Crushed coral is bad because its to big and sand of varying sizes is best. a few years ago a Deep Sand Bed was the way to go and now there is debate on that. as technology goes up we learn more and new trends and best approaches come up. the best resource that you have is the WWW you get many opinions just remember they are opinions just cause something worked for me it may not be suitable for your situatuion so take all recomendations and make an educated decsion as to whats best for you and your tank. and above all else take your time !!! one thing I will suggest though is to invest in a RO/DI unit you can get them with drinking water tanks so that it will be able to be used on a daily thing it will get real old carrying water from walmart when you need to do a water change.
search online though and check ---- there are several options there that are fairtly inexpensive.
Mike