New to hobby, something is wrong with my blue damsel

[ozman213]

Hello, I am new to the hobby and know (now) that I started it wrong. I went to the lfs and asked what I need to start a tank. He guided me in the wrong direction, but nonetheless here I sit.
I purchased a 75-gallon tank, crushed coral, salt, a few decorations, 2 powerheads, an undergravel filter, food, a net, test kits, and bio-spira, which was supposed to speed up my cycling.
At any rate, the lfs told me tap water(treated with chlorine remover) would be fine for my tank. I set it up and waited a couple of days, the bio-spira says it makes a tank fish-safe overnight...so I figured a couple of days would be great. I then went and purchased 3 damsels...1 yellow tail, 1 3-stripe, 1 blue. All were a little sad the first night(after acclimating them) but then ate and swam seemingly normally.
I purchased and read a book that recommended more filtration, so I purchased a canister filter with bio-wheels that came with it...and a coralife super-skimmer. The book I have seems to think that will be enough. The night(Sunday) I set up that new equipment I noticed that my blue damsel had something on his head. It was a dark spot...if it's black, but may have a greenish hue. The fish seemed fine, except for the thing on its head.
Upon further inspection I noticed that a small portion of the back fin is gone...the striped damsel may have taken that. He is nippy.
Today, the spot seems bigger, and it's flaking off. My fish is staying mainly in the corner of the tank, not doing much....but is still eating, though not as vigorously as before.
My tank seems to have cycled as my nitrites and ammonia are 0. Nitrates are testing at approximately(15ppm). My temp is at 78 and specific gravity is at 1.026. I know now that using these guys to start a new tank is likely stressful and bad, but forgive me as I was misinformed.
I will attach an image, but he's a blue damsel, so it's hard to take a good picture of a 1.5" fish.

 

[beth]

He is likely experiencing the extreme stress, but that thing on his is certainly werid. Is that a piece of hangling flesh?
I hate to tell you that the way you set up that tank is not the best. I'm afraid you will continue to have nitrate problems. That setup is about 15 yrs old fashion.
What book are you reading? I can tell you an excellent book for beginners is Robert Fernner's The Conscientious Marine Aquarist.

 

[ozman213]

Yes, it appears to be hanging flesh.
I realize now that the way I have my tank set-up is probably not ideal, but I never intend to have a reef tank, I wish to have a fish only tank for the forseeable future. I read the book cover to cover, and went to the lfs several times, looked at what they did, and asked questions...lots of them. I thoght I was doing the right things. It's very frustrating to me that so many people have so many different opinions, please do not take that as a criticism of you or this board, the information here has helped me more than anything.
I think my tank is tempered glass so I don't think that I can even have the sump system that seems to be the choice of the pros around here. Can't drill tempered glass and all. Any other things that I can add to help at all. Is live rock absolutely necessary for filtration in a fish only system?
The top of his head has this black (possibly green hued) spot and it has flesh hanging from it. The picture is zoomed a lot, so it's not like you can see it from across the room, but it is definately there. I don't know what fish injuries look like, could it be a simple scrape? I looked through the deal at the top of this category and none of the pictures there even remotely resemble this thing. And it's on the top of his head.
Embarrassingly, the book I have(and read cover to cover) is Saltwater Aquariums for Dummies. I thought explaining in plain english what I need and such would be the way to go. Apparently not.

 

[f1shman]

Well welcome to the boards and I'm sorry that you had a bad start. The filtration you have is not ideal, but I'm not going to go into that because you seem to understand. I will however answer your questions! #1 always remember, do your own research and IMO listen to this board before you by anything, we are talking from experience and we don't want your money! Anways, for a "sump" system you do not need to drill the glass, you can simply have an overflow box in the tank in which the water flows into by gravity. In that overflow box (half is in tank, half is on back of tank) there is a plastic tube that constantly siphons the water from the half in the tank to the half on the back of the tank. The water then flows down a tube into the sump and goes through filtration media, at the otherside it is pumped by a pump out of the sump back into the tank. So a sump system is an option. Live rock is not absoultely neccesary for filtration. The reasons people on here use it (including myself) is because it helps filtrate the water, it has beneficial bacteria on it, it easily grows stuff the fish like to eat, and it looks the most natural!

 

[ozman213]

Thank you for the replies. I will certainly have to look into a sump system. And maybe I'll have to change my grim views on live rock, I don't really think it's pretty(but the fish may), and it's really expensive. According to what I've read, to get the "proper amount" of live rock, I'd need to take out a

[hr]
.
As far as my damsel, if it's not obvious, I don't have a QT tank and really don't think I could get one in time. Further, he doesn't seem to have any of the diseases that I've found on this board. Should(or even can) I take him to a fish store for proper care? He was a $3.00 fish so they may think I'm being silly. Is there anything I can or should do to treat him. Again, he was $3.00, but he is a living pet, so I feel for the guy. My other 2 damsels seem fine and that's all that's in there.
One further question while I'm here. During my water change, I took about 20 gallons and changed it. I made the saltwater before hand and let it mix for a day as I've heard I should do. then I used the vacuum sucker siphon device to remove 20 gallons from my tank. Tested the salinity and temp of the new water and put it in the tank. It seems simple, but my fish didn't particularly think it was all that fun. Seemed to stress them out for a while. Did I mess something up there...it seems like such a simple process, but at this point, seems like I should not do things that stress my fish.

 

[ozman213]

A possibly better picture

 

[beth]

Sump, what's that? LOL I have never used one either, yet, I managed to keep a decent system.
http://hometown.aol.com/e0406/BethSWF.html
The lack of sump is not really the problem. Don't worry, I'm not critizing you.
As for the damsel, keep an eye out for him and see of those areas start healing up. Commonly, though, with more than one damsel in the tank, you will likely have causalities.

 

[ozman213]

So, I'm fairly confident that my damsel is on his way out. What started as a spot of flesh has turned into what appears to be the top part of his head missing flesh. It's white now(maybe his skull or muscle showing through). He is now not eating at all. The thing I'm most concerned about is the contamination of the rest of my tank. My other 2 damsels seem fine, completely intact and eating and swimming joyfully.
My LFS had a fairly good deal on some live rock, so I purchased it. Got about 13lbs of cured live rock for $49. Clearly I'll need more, but thought it would be a good start. Will that help my nitrates(when I get more), or am I completely up the creek as far as that, due to my UGF. Seems to me plastic grates aren't the cause of nitrates, just bad at removing them, so adding live rock seems like it might help. Of course I'm trying to apply logic on something I clearly know nothing about.

 

[tthemadd1]

Wow welcome to the site, and you have some questions.......

So, first lets just say that your cycle isnt over yet In my opinion. You will notice that the ammonia spike will happen in a few weeks and then your nitrites and finally your nitrates will slowly begin to rise. This is the reason for sumps, refugiums, and water changes. Good call on the live rock. You will notice a change in your tests because of the amount of ammonia the fish excrete (sp?) and your live die off, which should be minimal. As the next few weeks wear on you can expect to see improvement in the live rock.
I didnt catch what type of lighting you have on the tank?
As for your water changes, it is a part of the hobby and you should continue to do them until you learn more useful information on this site. I personally have a refugium which is like a sump except bigger. It is like a smaller tank with lots of Macro algae. Macro algae is like a chemical sponge. It will soak up the nitrites, nitrates, and other chemicals and convert them into nitrogen which is removed from your system by mixing air and the water. Most people do this through their protein skimmers and also the simple exhange at the surface of the water. Be sure to have a pump or something like a water return near the top of the tank, the more it breaks the surface tension the better.
In regards to the little damsel sorry to hear about it but you might think about never getting another one. Damsels IMO are very territorial and aggresive. They are stong fish which can survive the initial cycle but will nip at all other fish. The three stripe I call them convict damsels are some of the meanest little fish. I have seen them attack my old Huma Huma Trigger for getting too close. Look into returning them when your tank has fully cycled IMO. You will find that almost all fish have certain eating habits, and different environments that make them incompatible with your system and other fish. I have learned the hard way about this topic and really like to share this advice.
Take a week or so to pick out a new fish. Look into their eating habits, and ask questions here. The people here have owned probrably ever type of fish you can imagine. When you go to your LFS have the owner feed the fish in front of you a couple different times and ask how long they have had the fish in. If they have had for a day place it on hold, a week you should be ok. The amount of stress on a fish in transport will affect it for a few days. Lastly, ask where they get their supply from. Some LFS will get fish directly from the ocean, when they do this they actually use deadly chemicals to stun the fish and then scoop them up in a net. This slowly takes a toll on their internal organs and can die a few weeks after the LFS get them in. Very sad, but very true.
Other than that just research research research, I have been in this hobby for over three years and I learn something new everyday. I love the idea of keeping a healthy microuniverse for these animals and you have to look at in a way that is both educational and satisfying. You dont need to go out and buy the LR, sump, etc. Rather look around these posts to find the DIY way of making equipment even LR. Good luck to you and I hope you find this as much fun as the rest of us.
Themadd1

 

[ozman213]

Thanks for the advice, I too like the idea of having a microuniverse for my fish. I truly do want to keep things as healthy as possible. There is just so much to learn, and so many differences of opinion. I spend at least an hour a day(lately) reading the posts on this site, and more than once, I've come across mild arguements in the posts. I'm still trying to find a LFS that I even close to trust. The one that sold me the original equipment seemed to be trustworthy(in that he wanted to save me money) but untrustworthy as he apparently had no idea what he was talking about.
It's been about a month since I've set up the tank.
I did have an ammonia spike shortly after setting up my tank. I think this was because of the bio-spira bacteria additive that I was told would make it "fish-safe" overnight. Regardless, it added bacteria, of that, I am certain. Then slowly my nitrites rose, and then fell, and now nitrates are up. So if it didn't cycle totally, it at least did some. and I'm hoping that additional cycles will be mild, especially with the new live rock. The rock is very deep purple with all kinds of stuff growing on/in it. So I assume that it is fairly well cured and established.
I really do enjoy the hobby and am hoping to get the best setup that I can afford. As far as my lights, I was under the impression that, (because I'm doing a fish only tank, with live rock(I really don't find corals or the like are anything I ever want to attempt to raise)) I don't need any special lighting. I have the lights that came with my tank, I have them on an automatic timer that stays on from 8AM-9:30PM.
As far as the water changes, I'm clearly going to continue them. I know they are a very important part of the process, I was just wondering if I was doing it correctly, as it really seemed to scare my fish. Everybody seems to trivialize the water change, not really explain the procedure, moving 200lbs of water in and of itself is not trivial(maybe I should go to the gym more often).
And oh boy, do I have questions :thinking: . I'm not independantly wealthy. Losing a $3.00 fish is going to be sad, cuz I really do like him...even though he might be mean, but losing a $60.00-$120.00 fish would really be no good. That's why there are $3.00 fish in there now(just wish I would have had more knowledge, before putting even them in there). I know that patience is the key.
1 final question on this line of posting. I've seen on this site that blue, regal, or hippo, pick your favorite name tangs need a BIG tank. On another site that sells livestock, they say 70 gal. minimum size. I EVENTUALLY(when all is right with the world) want to get one. Can I? (75 gallon tank).
Thanks for all the help, you guys are way cool.