New to the Fish World

[chevyrulzs2010]

Hello all.
My name is Sam, and im new to this whole fish thing. Sure i have owned a gold fish as a child, but they never lived past a month. I would like to start a nice fish tank of some sort, but i have no idea what I want yet. Before some one says "search the forums" I already did, and I liked what I saw. But I dont even know where to start. Yes I did read the informative stuff. But let me just say. Im 17 years old, and never had any 'true' experience dealing with a fish tank.
I dont know if I want to go with fresh water or salt.
I like salt, because has much more color involved. But on the down side is much more maintance.
Im not opposed to fresh, but then you get to much of the ordinary gold fish and is just bland. But it is alot less maintance.
The price of salt water stuff is just scary. But if I work slow, it will be ok.
What i was thinking, is that i would go with a 40 - 60 gallon tank. Maybe a 55.
Once i buy my tank and basic equipment(and decide what im going to go with, salt or fresh) i would start dealing with my live rock and live sand. and get that established. Next I would by my 'cleaners' and let them get established. Then I could add my fish. I would like to go with a reef tank, i do like having the plant life too. I would like to have some soft coral and other plants, as well as my fish. I have charts for both salt water and fresh water on compatibility of fish.
Am i headed in the right direction? Any advise for a new guy. I really dont want to start into this and have it start failing on me and just throw that kind of money away.
Thanks in advance for any help.

 

[sueandherzoo]

Hi Sam, and welcome to the forum. It sounds like you've done a good deal of research and are very wise to think about all this BEFORE jumping into the hobby. The only suggestion I have for you at this stage is to not even buy the "tank and basic equipment" until you've decided if you're going to go fresh or salt. The equipment (and possibly the tank) will differ depending on which way you go.
Good luck whatever you decide.
Sue

 

[rgaynor81]

Well first of all welcome to the boards. Im fairly new here myself but ill tell you, any questions i have ever had form start to finish were always handly fast on the boards. I started with a fresh water tank like most and know have been in the salt water tanks for about five years know. Salt water tanks are more money and time for sure but is diffently worth all the time and money when you get them up and running. Just need to take your time go slow and always ask questions. GOOD LUCK

 

[tank a holic]

Originally Posted by chevyrulzs2010
http:///forum/post/2988636
Hello all.
My name is Sam, and im new to this whole fish thing.welcome to the boards Sure i have owned a gold fish as a child, but they never lived past a month. I would like to start a nice fish tank of some sort, but i have no idea what I want yet.I started the same way and you'll be fine Before some one says "search the forums" I already did, and I liked what I saw. But I dont even know where to start.the threads at the top of this forum will really help you if you go with saltwater Yes I did read the informative stuff. But let me just say. Im 17 years old, and never had any 'true' experience dealing with a fish tank.
I dont know if I want to go with fresh water or salt.
I like salt, because has much more color involved.

But on the down side is much more maintance.not too bad once you get the tank established
Im not opposed to fresh, but then you get to much of the ordinary gold fish and is just bland. But it is alot less maintance.like i said above
The price of salt water stuff is just scary. But if I work slow, it will be ok. now you're talking, patience is the name of the game in this hobby
What i was thinking, is that i would go with a 40 - 60 gallon tank. Maybe a 55.

Once i buy my tank and basic equipment(and decide what im going to go with, salt or fresh) i would start dealing with my live rock and live sand. and get that established.or "cycled" Next I would by my 'cleaners' and let them get established. Then I could add my fish. I would like to go with a reef tank, 6 months or so after the fish, you want to be comfortable with water tests / stability, and water changes before you add corals i do like having the plant life too. I would like to have some soft coral and other plants,coral isn't a plant as well as my fish. I have charts for both salt water and fresh water on compatibility of fish. great idea, always research fish before you buy
Am i headed in the right direction?yes

Any advise for a new guy. take your timeI really dont want to start into this and have it start failing on me and just throw that kind of money away.you'll be fine, just keep asking questions
Thanks in advance for any help.no problem man
hope this helps

 

[scaples]

I agree with Sue....decide if you want fresh or saltwater before you buy the tank and equipment. Fresh water is probably a good start if you have never had a fish tank before...as they are inexpensive compared to salt water, and you wont feel as bad in your 'learning' stage when you lose your first couple of fish! I had a fresh water for a couple of years before going over to salt and im glad i did cuz i learned alot of things about maintaining a tank in general, without spending tons of money on saltwater fish, chemicals, etc... Sure there are some different mainentance issues between fresh and salt water, but he fundamentals are pretty much the same.
Im not trying to scare you away from saltwater right now, as you can do whatever you want. Just beware of the time and money that goes into a saltwater tank, as even the intial setup price will probably be more than you would originally think...and thats even before you get any livestock into your tank! It's also good to remember that bigger is better when it comes to saltwater....but i think your idea of a 55 is a good starter size.
Good luck with whatever you decide to do and welcome!

 

[indy2009]

You could also try starting with a brackish tank, I have 6 tanks from freshwater to saltwater and everything in between, it can get you alittle involved with saltwater, not exactly the same, what I did before I did the plunge into saltwater..be prepared to spend a pretty buck if you go saltwater, but I'm not sorry that I did, well worth it...Good luck with whatever you decide.

 

[eric b 125]

welcome to the boards: i understand that some of the price tags look a little intimidating on some of the equipment we use, but there are ways to cut costs w/o sacrificing quality. the best way to cut the cost of your experience is to start off with saltwater, since it sounds like youre going to end up on this side of the fence eventually. why waste $ on fresh when you're just going to put that equipment in the garage later? i had freshwater, but never really cared enough to clean or test it. so really, everything i know about fishkeeping i've learned throughout my swf experience. my vote: go saltwater.

 

[flower]

Hi Sam,
When I was 16, I got my very first fish tank, it was a freshwater 10gallon tank. I spent my first paycheck on it. That was a long time ago. I was making $1.75 hr back then.
The point is that it wasn't much to start with, but I had lots of fun and learned allot. I had black mollies and swordfish, a Beta named Gollum and big orange snails! I loved it and have had a fish tank ever since. I am 50 now.
So, instead of breaking yourself to go big, not to mention saltwater. Try the 10g, you could even try a 20g saltwater if you like. A 30g LONG is really pretty for salt or fresh.
A 55g to set up NEW for a reef tank will go well over $2000.00 just for the equipment. There are bargains out there, but if you don't know what you need and no idea of the age of the equipment it will complicate things that are already complicated.
A freshwater fish runs about $5.00, a saltwater fish on the cheap side runs $18.00 If you buy a freshwater fish, get it home and it dies within 3 days, the store will refund your money or replace your fish. In saltwater stores, (not online) the is no guarantee. You can buy a nice $100.00 fish, get home, it goes belly up in two hours, and you are out $100.00
I am not trying to discourage you. You seem really bright and willing to do your homework on what you want. But you did say you can't keep a goldfish alive. So maybe try the 10g or 20g first. These can be used as QT or hospital tanks if you go saltwater later.
Welcome to the world of fish!

 

[naclh2o nut]

Great Job on the research. It has been stated many times in this thread already. Be prepared and decide before you buy. I do like flowers thought on a 10 or 20 gal. for a while. This way you will have your QT tank if and when you go salt.

[hr]
Just remember once you go salt you are hooked for LIFE.

IMO put together a set up on paper find the prices and post just your list of items. Tthen we can help with missing/ unneccessary items. It will give you a true cost.
Second spend some time at your LFS and talk to those that have salt, you will find some wonderful people that will help, you may even find a local club. Also see if the LFS will let you volunteer and help with thier salt. Get the dirty jobs out of the way.

Then see if the salt is as pretty.
Good Luck and let us know what you decide and if we can help.

 

[chevyrulzs2010]

Originally Posted by scaples
http:///forum/post/2988674
(edited to shorten the topic length)
Im not trying to scare you away from saltwater right now, as you can do whatever you want. Just beware of the time and money that goes into a saltwater tank, as even the intial setup price will probably be more than you would originally think...and thats even before you get any livestock into your tank! It's also good to remember that bigger is better when it comes to saltwater....but i think your idea of a 55 is a good starter size.
Good luck with whatever you decide to do and welcome!

Thank you for your help, from this i think i might start with fresh, i will expain in a moment...
Originally Posted by Indy2009
http:///forum/post/2988735
You could also try starting with a brackish tank, I have 6 tanks from freshwater to saltwater and everything in between, it can get you alittle involved with saltwater, not exactly the same, what I did before I did the plunge into saltwater..be prepared to spend a pretty buck if you go saltwater, but I'm not sorry that I did, well worth it...Good luck with whatever you decide.
Can you explain what a brackish tank is, Im not quite familiar with the term.

Originally Posted by Flower
http:///forum/post/2988871

Hi Sam,
(edited to shorten)
So, instead of breaking yourself to go big, not to mention saltwater. Try the 10g, you could even try a 20g saltwater if you like. A 30g LONG is really pretty for salt or fresh.
(edit)
A freshwater fish runs about $5.00, a saltwater fish on the cheap side runs $18.00 If you buy a freshwater fish, get it home and it dies within 3 days, the store will refund your money or replace your fish. In saltwater stores, (not online) the is no guarantee. You can buy a nice $100.00 fish, get home, it goes belly up in two hours, and you are out $100.00
I am not trying to discourage you. You seem really bright and willing to do your homework on what you want. But you did say you can't keep a goldfish alive. So maybe try the 10g or 20g first. These can be used as QT or hospital tanks if you go saltwater later.
Welcome to the world of fish!/>
I like your idea of starting with a 10 or 20 gallon fresh water, besides the fact im 17 and will move to college (maybe, if i dont go local) and will get my own house, and moving salt water fish just seems scary, i dont want to risk that kinda money trying to move it. I wouldnt know how to move it. A 10 gallon fresh water tank wouldnt be to bad, and if the fish die, they die...
Also i like the idea of doing it to have a QT later. That would definatly help. And yes i did say i couldnt keep gold fish alive as a CHILD, lol i had a 2 gallon tank that i never tried to balance, untill recently i never new of such a thing.
Thank you for your help.
Originally Posted by NaClH2O Nut
http:///forum/post/2988895
Great Job on the research. It has been stated many times in this thread already. Be prepared and decide before you buy. I do like flowers thought on a 10 or 20 gal. for a while This way you will have your QT tank if and when you go salt.

[hr]
Just remember once you go salt you are hooked for LIFE.

IMO put together a set up on paper find the prices and post just your list of items. Tthen we can help with missing/ unneccessary items. It will give you a true cost.
Second spend some time at your LFS and talk to those that have salt, you will find some wonderful people that will help, you may even find a local club. Also see if the LFS will let you volunteer and help with thier salt. Get the dirty jobs out of the way.

Then see if the salt is as pretty.
Good Luck and let us know what you decide and if we can help.
Well it just so happens i work at a LFS, i work part time at petsmart. I will try to get in the fish department. I will definatly go with salt sooner or later, i just dont know when.
Ok, thank you everyone for all your help. Im now leaning towards fresh water. I will work on a list as suggested. Right now what i am thinking is that i will go with a 10-20 gallon fresh water tank, that will be able to be used as a QT later on in life. My only question is does anyone know of good COLORFUL plant life for freshwater and i dont want fake... Not to be picky but i like to be as real as possible. Also what good fish could i use. I have a compatibility chart to look at, but what are the GOOD fish. Also will LR and LS work in fresh water, or is there fresh water LR and LS I will work on a list at a later time today, when im home from work at 930 pm, and i will post it up here. Any other suggestions and advise are greatly appreciated.

 

[pleasants9]

CRAIGS LIST! always search for used stuff before you buy new, and also see if there isnt a local forum where you live then you sometimes find local deals from your neighbors and not have to worry about shipping.

 

[pezenfuego]

I was 13 when I started and am 15 now. 80% of this hobby is research, 10 percent is maintaining patience, 5 percent is work, 3 percent is inspiration, and a good 2 percent is luck.
Anyway, before you purchase ANYTHING, you should research. Plan out your tank's equipment (my personal favorite part) and get it all set up. Think about getting and ro/di unit or look for a place that sells it by the gallon.
Don't trust an LFS, at least not right away. They are a business and most are in it for money rather than help. They need to earn your respect, so make them.
Figure everything out and then start the cycle. It is worth it my friend. I started with Freshwater at age 12 and loved it, but honestly, going from fresh to salt was a huge change. I don't recommend starting with fresh in order to work your way up...it just doesn't work like that imo.
Anyway, good luck with whatever you choose! The hardest part is reasearch...researching before hand is the best thing you can do. Sure, you don't have to know EVERYTHING before starting, try to learn enough before starting.
Good Luck dude...a teen can do it and quite a few do.
EDIT: Brackish tanks replicate the environments where saltwater meets freshwater creating a saline, but not marine environment...so it like a mixture.
Fish like mollys, scats, monos, etc live here.

 

[chevyrulzs2010]

Tank: 50 Gallons, 36x18x17, Reef-Ready (Comes standard with 1 Glass Wall Overflow (located on back panel of aquarium) Comes standard with 2 holes for the overflow), Regular Glass, Hinged Glass Top (Comes with plastic section that can be notched out for extra hoses. Midsection is two glass panes hinged together. Comes with handle to easily open hinged half.), 2 bulk heads correct size for the over flow. Base price $222.00 + Shipping.Link to website: Clicky
Pump: (I need help here, what should i go with? what is the best, what would be the most universial?)
Power Head: (Im thinking a wave maker, or no? I read something about a powerhead system that uses 4 small powerheads and randomly turns one on.)
Heaters: Rena Smartheater Aquarium Heaters, 100 watt x2, Base Price: $60.00 + Shipping.
Link to website: Clicky
Lighting: 36" Deluxe 4 x 95W Fluorescent VHO Fixture by Hamilton Technology, Base Price: $489.95 (Not sure with lighting)
Link to Website: Clicky
Live Sand: 4" Deep
Live Rock: 75 Lbs
I also would get a 10 gallon tank to store my heaters and other equipment in. What else would i need, or am i missing? Am i headed in the right direction?

 

[naclh2o nut]

Originally Posted by chevyrulzs2010
http:///forum/post/2989874
Tank: 50 Gallons, 36x18x17, Reef-Ready (Comes standard with 1 Glass Wall Overflow (located on back panel of aquarium) Comes standard with 2 holes for the overflow), Regular Glass, Hinged Glass Top (Comes with plastic section that can be notched out for extra hoses. Midsection is two glass panes hinged together. Comes with handle to easily open hinged half.), 2 bulk heads correct size for the over flow. Base price $222.00 + Shipping.
Link to website:
Pump: (I need help here, what should i go with? what is the best, what would be the most universial?)
Power Head: (Im thinking a wave maker, or no? I read something about a powerhead system that uses 4 small powerheads and randomly turns one on.)
Heaters: Rena Smartheater Aquarium Heaters, 100 watt x2, Base Price: $60.00 + Shipping.
Link to website:
Lighting: 36" Deluxe 4 x 95W Fluorescent VHO Fixture by Hamilton Technology, Base Price: $489.95 (Not sure with lighting)
Link to Website:
Live Sand: 4" Deep
Live Rock: 75 Lbs
I also would get a 10 gallon tank to store my heaters and other equipment in. What else would i need, or am i missing? Am i headed in the right direction?
This sounds like a saltwater list. If you are going freshwater then you will be way ahead.
The 10 gal as a sump you can use just about any pump. Look for a 500-600 gph. Thatway withhead pressure of 3'-4' you will still be moving 200-300 gph.
Lighting is ok.
LR/LS is notfor fresh. Most fresh water fish like a lower Ph. Go with gravel and what ever you have at work.
Just a note don't link to other websites, this is not allowed here.

 

[chevyrulzs2010]

Originally Posted by NaClH2O Nut
http:///forum/post/2990110
This sounds like a saltwater list. If you are going freshwater then you will be way ahead.
The 10 gal as a sump you can use just about any pump. Look for a 500-600 gph. Thatway withhead pressure of 3'-4' you will still be moving 200-300 gph.
Lighting is ok.
LR/LS is notfor fresh. Most fresh water fish like a lower Ph. Go with gravel and what ever you have at work.
Just a note don't link to other websites, this is not allowed here.

Sorry about the linking i didnt know i will destroy them when i get home. I am still leaning toward salt water, im just pricing right now, still trying to get a feel for the money involved. On the lighting is there anything i can do that is cheeper? I did see on ---- for about $150 i could go with LED pannles, they make them in white, blue, red, and blue and red. They said the blue would be best for quick growth while red makes things bloom faster. The blue and red is supposed to be the best of both world, and white is supposed to be your daylight. Any suggestions on leds? I like them, they are bright, realitively cheep and power saving.
Also another issue i thought of that i need input on is the fact that if i start even a small aquarium (20-60 gallons), will it be something thats almost impossible to move. Because im not going to live with my parents forever

. And i can promise you that they wont take care of my aquarium forever either. Maybe when i go to college they will take care of it once or twice a week, but the rest is on me. But when it comes time to move, how to you move it with out stressing or killing the fish and aquatic life?

 

[naclh2o nut]

As far as lights yes you can go a little cheaper, don't go led.

The good LEDs will not be cheaper!
As far as the move it depends on how soon the move has to take place and how far. If you would have the ability to set up a tank and give it several weeks to cycle, then move fish that would be like bringing them home from LFS. But you would have two tanks at that point!!

Tough one!

 

[chevyrulzs2010]

Originally Posted by NaClH2O Nut
http:///forum/post/2990878
As far as lights yes you can go a little cheaper, don't go led.

The good LEDs will not be cheaper!
As far as the move it depends on how soon the move has to take place and how far. If you would have the ability to set up a tank and give it several weeks to cycle, then move fish that would be like bringing them home from LFS. But you would have two tanks at that point!!

Tough one!

Ok, so what would be a good light for me to use? I really dont want to spend $400 dollars on a light that seems insane. Is there something i can get for around $100 or $150?
Also on the move. I dont know how far out it will be. It is over a year away. Im going to try to get on omaha fire department out of high school. If i get on right away i will be looking for a house. If i dont get on right away i will be attending UNO for 2-4 years, at which point i will probably stay living at home to save on some money. The move shouldnt be more than 30 min. away. But i dont have 2 tanks, i would probably have to attemt to do it all at once.
Update:
Here is whats going on with my thoughts.
I am still researching and planning stuff. I found the tank i would like to use. The problem is that i have my EMT-B class which will cost me $650 and a motorcycle riders ed class that will cost me $500, and i need to buy a scuba tank that will cost about $150. So as you can see this summer i need to spend alot of money. And i dont know about putting fish on top of all that. Dont get me wrong im still interested and if i move very slowly and buy all my stuff i might be ok. As far as an update for what research i have done. I used google sketchup 6 and made a tank that matches the dimensions of the one i will buy. And i started designing a stand. I will make my own stand to cut down on costs. And i will post pictures for what i have done later when its completely done. It puts the tank at 3.5 feet off the ground, and will be have an exterior shell of oak wood

 

[chevyrulzs2010]

Doing more research, this is what i have for fish, they seem to be the best for my needs, i didnt think i could put much more in 50 gallons, but this is stuff i like, i would like to get some more variety in color, but i didnt see much that i liked, besides damsels but i dont want to deal with the aggressive yet. Tell me what you think
Royal Gramma: x5 $9.99
Size: 1-2 inches
Care Level: Moderate
Temperament: Peaceful
Diet: Pellet, Flake, Brine
Origin: Caribbean
Acclimation Time: 3+ hours
Minimum Tank Size: 10 gallons
Coral Safe: Yes
Invertebrate Safe: Yes
False Percula Clownfish - Aquacultured: x4 $15.99
Size: 1-2 inches
Care Level: Easy
Temperament: Peaceful
Diet: Pellet, Flake
Origin: Aquacultured
Acclimation Time: 2+ hours
Minimum Tank Size: 10 gallons
Coral Safe: Yes
Invertebrate Safe: Yes
True Percula Clownfish - Aquacultured x3 $28.99
Size: 1-2 inches
Care Level: Easy
Temperament: Peaceful
Diet: Pellet, Brine, Flake
Origin: Aquacultured
Minimum Tank Size: 20 gallons
Coral Safe: Yes
Invertebrate Safe: Yes
Long Tentacle Anemone x2 $31.49
Size: 3-6 inches
Care Level: Easy
Diet: Strong Light - Medium Flow
Origin: Indian Ocean
Acclimation Time: Temperature Acclimate
Duster Cluster $26.99
Size: Colony
Care Level: Easy
Temperament: Peaceful
Reef Safe: Yes
Diet: Phytoplankton
Origin: Caribbean
Acclimation Time: 1+ Hours
Maiden's Hair $20.99
Size: 3-4 inches
Care Level: Easy
Reef Safe: Yes
Diet: Low current
Origin: Indian Ocean
Acclimation Time: Temperature Acclimate
Orange Fan Sponge $20.99
Size: 3-4 inches
20-55 Gallon Reef Package $94.99
Scarlet Hermit Crab: 10
Blueleg Hermit Crab: 10
Brittle Starfish: 2
Coral Banded Shrimp: 1
Emerald Crab: 3
Turbo/Astrea Snail: 20
Cleaner Clam: 2
Nassarius Snail - Group of 10: 1
Total Cost: $427.82

 

[naclh2o nut]

Originally Posted by chevyrulzs2010
http:///forum/post/2991899
Doing more research, this is what i have for fish, they seem to be the best for my needs, i didnt think i could put much more in 50 gallons, but this is stuff i like, i would like to get some more variety in color, but i didnt see much that i liked, besides damsels but i dont want to deal with the aggressive yet. Tell me what you think
Royal Gramma: x5 $9.99
Size: 1-2 inches
Care Level: Moderate
Temperament: Peaceful
Diet: Pellet, Flake, Brine
Origin: Caribbean
Acclimation Time: 3+ hours
Minimum Tank Size: 10 gallons
Coral Safe: Yes
Invertebrate Safe: Yes
False Percula Clownfish - Aquacultured: x4 $15.99
Size: 1-2 inches
Care Level: Easy
Temperament: Peaceful
Diet: Pellet, Flake
Origin: Aquacultured
Acclimation Time: 2+ hours
Minimum Tank Size: 10 gallons
Coral Safe: Yes
Invertebrate Safe: Yes
True Percula Clownfish - Aquacultured x3 $28.99
Size: 1-2 inches
Care Level: Easy
Temperament: Peaceful
Diet: Pellet, Brine, Flake
Origin: Aquacultured
Minimum Tank Size: 20 gallons
Coral Safe: Yes
Invertebrate Safe: Yes
Long Tentacle Anemone x2 $31.49
Size: 3-6 inches
Care Level: Easy
Diet: Strong Light - Medium Flow
Origin: Indian Ocean
Acclimation Time: Temperature Acclimate
Duster Cluster $26.99
Size: Colony
Care Level: Easy
Temperament: Peaceful
Reef Safe: Yes
Diet: Phytoplankton
Origin: Caribbean
Acclimation Time: 1+ Hours
Maiden's Hair $20.99
Size: 3-4 inches
Care Level: Easy
Reef Safe: Yes
Diet: Low current
Origin: Indian Ocean
Acclimation Time: Temperature Acclimate
Orange Fan Sponge $20.99
Size: 3-4 inches
20-55 Gallon Reef Package $94.99
Scarlet Hermit Crab: 10
Blueleg Hermit Crab: 10
Brittle Starfish: 2
Coral Banded Shrimp: 1
Emerald Crab: 3
Turbo/Astrea Snail: 20
Cleaner Clam: 2
Nassarius Snail - Group of 10: 1
Total Cost: $427.82
Slow down,

you haven't given a list of which lights(P/C, VHO, T-5, M/H), filter, skimmer, P/Hs, etc.... This is where your cost starts to go up. Lights- $250^, filter- $150^, skimmer - $150^, P/Hs- $50^ x ?2/3. These items alone can get you into close to $1000. Then you will need water- RO/DI $150 for your own, test kits- $50, heater- $40, return pump- $50, salt- $20.00, sand.... should I go on.
Put a list of equipement and dry goods together before you price the livestock. The equipement will need to be in house before water goes in tank then you can cycle the tank (weeks).

Then the fish list starts to come in play.
So if you are talking about collecting these items slowly over the summer(depends on what that means) 1 item a week.

You wont be ready for fish until fall.

 

[chevyrulzs2010]

I know what you mean, i was just looking at fish, and wondering if thoes where compatiable, im still researching equipment. Infact i was wondering if knowing what fish i plan to have will help me choose equipment. Still researching gear, and collection over the summer could be even longer then 1 thing per week, depending on how much money i make at petsmart, and how much money i end up spending on classes. And once again im not opposed to doing fresh water, for a while, to get used to it, so im still researching that too.