Newbie - A few (long) questions

[normis]

Hey all,
I've been a long-time lurker in these forums, but this is my first post, and I apologize that it's so long. I have about 4 years of freshwater experience. I've recently finished reading Fenner's "Conscientious Marine Aquarist" and, as you can imagine, I have a few (possibly silly) questions.
I'll be running a 46 gallon bowfront tank (I went above 40 gallons per Fenner's (and many other's) suggestions). So far, I've collected the following (merry christmas to me )
Tank (All-Glass) and Stand
Glass "versa-top" for tank
Twin tube fluorescent strip (30 inch, I believe)
Dual Temp precision heater
Hydrometer
Thermometer
"Chlorine Away" (per LFS suggestion)
Kent Marine "Essential Elements" (ditto)
Emporer 280 Power Filter with Bio Wheel
Cyclone Bak Pak 2 Bio Filter with Protein Skimmer, 9.5w Venturi Powerhead, and a partrige in a pear tree
"Arag-Alive" Argonite Reef Sand (60 lbs) (Again, per LFS recommendation)
I still need an air pump/stone/tubing, test kit and nets.
OK, so my basic questions are these:
1. The live sand was purchased upon recommendation by the LFS. Should I still use gravel of some sort, or is the live sand the only substrate I should use?
2. I'm still working on my species list, but I will be starting with a fish-only tank. Do I need an undergravel (or in my case, undersand) filter?
3. Further to #2, I was not going to add live rock until I established the system, but the LFS was really pushing the live sand. Should I go ahead and add live rock at the outset as well? Will I need different lighting?
Just so we're clear, nothing has been set up yet, and everything is still in boxes (except the tank, which I just had to look at once!!!). Research will be ongoing for the next few weeks, and I'm in no hurry.
BTW, if you've gotten this far, thanks for reading this. This forum is very truly a lifesaver.

 

[harlequinnut]

1. Live sand only, or playsand by southdown or old castle only if you can find it. you can mix live sand with playsand.
2. NO UGF!
3. Add the live rock and let it cycle your tank. Lighting is fine if you plan on keeping fish only. Might want to consider Power compact or vho in case you want to try corals later on. JMO

 

[timo]

Good, straightforward questions!
1: Place the live sand on top of a bed of natural, Aragonite sand (available at many fish stores) when you start the tank. This will cost less at the outset, and the lower, non-live sand will become infused with the critters soon enough.
2:Stay completely away from undergravel anything. They even wont work with sand, as it would clog. You are seeking the small particle size of the sand for the reason of keeping an anaerobic zone for biological filtration purposes. A filter of this sort would clearly maintain aeration at the lowest area of the sand bed.
3: Yes, get live rock when you start the tank. Depending on the price at the store, you have the option of mail-ordering. This rock comes "uncured", meaning there is an excess of decaying material still in/on the rock. The store will commonly have uncured rock, as this is how they get it. The curing process allows the unwanted stuff to die off and be cleaned by the very processes you want it to do in your tank. Placing uncured rock in a new tank allows the tank to go through the cycle along with the rock and creates a stable biological system.
There are special things one must do when cycling a new tank with uncured rock, but that's too much for now.
HTH
TimO

 

[karajay]

Originally posted by Normis
I still need an air pump/stone/tubing

You won't need these things, you will not want any bubbles in a SW tank.
I agree with getting your LR in the beginning and use it to cycle your tank.
I noticed that your LFS recommended a de-chlorinator. I would suggest you avoid using treated tap water in your tank. Too many bad things in tap water for a SW tank. Most members here would advise using RO/DI water.
WELCOME

 

[jedininja]

Welcome to the board. And all the answers above are great. I'm glad you read that book first. You off to a great start. The only thing you seem to be missing are a few powerheads for circulation.

 

[normis]

All,
Thanks for the great responses. These cleared up a lot of murky areas for me.
However, if I'm going to use live rock, won't I need some sort of cleaning crew? What do you guys recommend?

 

[lesleybird]

Hi, Everyone does not agree on the deep sand bed for nitrate reduction some say that they are nitrate traps waiting to crash. I like using the live agronite sand that is in the 1 to 2mm. size range with a shallow 1 and a half to 2 inches as I can remove the nitrates by syphening out the debris on the bottom of the tank every two weeks when I do a partial water change. Sand smaller than this tends to get sucked out of the tank when one tries to clean it with one of those vacuum syphens. If you are going to buy live rock that is not fully curred, you need to add it now during the cycle. If you use curred live rock and live sand you will get a much shorter cycle, if it even cycles much at all. Good luck, Lesley

 

[moonrs]

Originally posted by Normis
If I'm going to use live rock, won't I need some sort of cleaning crew? What do you guys recommend?
While you're cycling your tank, you wont need a cleanup crew, per se. Most, if not all of the cleanup crew would die if added while the tank was cycling. IMO, you'd be wasting your money. Get a good sw test kit, along with the live sand and live rock, and allow the tank to cycle(at least 2-4 weeks). Once your test kit is registering appropriate levels , you can slowly start adding something. A few hardy fish(I started with 3 damsels) is enough. Don't spend alot of money on these first few fish you buy. Patience is the key to this; I commend yours to date. I've got to admit, I wasn't nearly as patient or prepared as you are trying to be. Oh, one more thing; as you go along, make sure you research the fish/livestock you do get, to ensure compatibility... Good luck with your tank, and welcome...!

 

[karajay]

Originally posted by Normis
... won't I need some sort of cleaning crew? What do you guys recommend?
Some of the more common cleaner-uppers:
Scarlet hermits
Turbo snails
Cerith snails
Nassarius snails
Fighting conch
Cleaner (aka skunk or scarlet) shrimp
Peppermint shrimp
Hermits and turbos are good for algae eating.
Cerith and nass snails and fighting conchs are good for sand cleaning.
And the shrimp are good at scavenging leftover food.
Keep in mind that if you put hermits and snails together, you should provide extra shells for the hermits to grow into, or they will kill your snails to get theirs.
Do not add any livestock until your cycle is complete.

 

[scotts]

First of all WELCOME.

It sure sounds like you are starting off right. Not like me who just switched from FW to SW. :notsure:
Here is what I would suggest. First do a search on this site for cycling or cycle. There have been many posts about that before. IMO opinion you should add the water sand and live rock all at the same time. Although I will admit that I do not know if uncured LR should be added at this time, but then again it may help start your cycle. Smarter people than me can answer this question. The reason you want to add it all together is that you want everything to blend together at the same time. As has been said before you do not want an underground filter. You also do not want an air stone. Like you I have a bak pak 2 and a mechanical filter (Mine is a Penguin, but basically the same thing as an Emperor). I removed all of the blue stringy stuff from the skimmer and bio wheels from my penguin. I have heard that the bio filter stuff can actually cause problems in SW aquariums.
Once your tank has cycled and your sand starts to turn ugly then you should add a clean up crew. What I have is basically some snails, hermit crabs and a conch. This is enough to get your sand looking clean and keep it clean. The crabs and conch will not only eat the stuff off the top of your sand, but will turn it over to keep it looking good. You DO NOT want to vacuum your sand. While your sand may look better after vacuum it, you are sucking up all of the good bugs and bacteria that help LS work properly.
Another thing, if I may, research EVERYTHING before you buy it. On impulse I bought a beautiful fish. Then I found out that it changed colors and grew to over 18" long. Fortunately I was able to donate it to a local aquarium.
Also please research everything that I just said. There are many ways to set up a SW tank and everyone has their own opinion. You just need to find the way that you want to set up yours. However it sounds like you are off to a good start.
Scott

 

[normis]

All,
Thanks again for all of the informative responses. You guys are the best

Norm