newbie question!!!

[saltwaterdave]

I have a new 45 gallon tank that has been running for about 3 weeks now...I am running a whisper 3 power filter and a penquin 330..also have a undergravel filter,I use crushed coral for the base,I put in about 2 pounds of "base rock" to help get things going and 1 blue damsel.....I can't seem to get the water just right and I have gotten alot of different opinions about what to do...the ammonia is about0.25 and nitrite is 5.0 and the nitrate is about 5.0 and I just check the ph and it has changed from 8.2 to 7.8 since friday....WHAT DO I NEED TO DO?????? I know the water is'nt right, and my 7 year old is driving me nuts to add some fish.... Help?

 

[wingman]

I have been told it takes longer then three weeks before your tank cycles. I would wait close to two months before you start to add things and then do it slowly. Bottom line....take your time.

 

[jhueb12]

Just be patient and your tank will cycle, you are still in the process but i promise it will happen if you give it more time, at least a few more weeks.

 

[chadillac]

There are f few things you could do to help cycle your tank. 1st you should try adding some live sand you should have enough substrate to make about 4 inches on the bottom. CC is ok but really doesn't do much as far as cycling. 2nd try putting in live rock, it's more exspensive than base rock but there again it has live algae and bacteria that will help cycle. last but not least get a few more damsels try maybe 3 more. with that your tank should cycle in a couple more weeks. Patience is one thing this hobby will teach you real quick. Kind of an oxymoron huh? lol

 

[sandy]

Well, here goes for another conflicting opinion -- I would not add more damsels. Poor things would have to live through a heck of a spike. Explain the scientific reasons why you need to wait to the seven year old. Let him or her help monitor the water quality and watch it change. Maybe use a calendar and record your bi-weekly test result on it... It will be a good lesson in patience that will last him/her a lifetime.
As everyone else said -- your tank will cycle. Give it time. Why use live fish (more damsels) when you will likely want to "get rid of them" when the cycle is through and the 7 year old wants something different? IMHO. I do like the idea of adding some live sand. There will be new critters to see -- especially when you turn out the lights and look through a red light.

 

[chadillac]

I've got a ? why is everyone so against damsels. I love my little guys didn't think I would like them at 1st. Thought how boring but after just a few days they were actually pretty cool. Got to where they are hand fed real shortly. I still have the ones I cycled with. They become part of the whole experience. evry one always says well you have to get rid of them. Nope mine are still in and doing fine. A nice bit of color and a whole lot of personality. Just my opinion though. To each his own as everyone says.

 

[sandy]

Oops... Actually, I cycled with damsels when I was spanking new and at the advice of my lfs. Since I have learned that it is unnecessary and many people either lose them to death or by "getting rid" of them -- I've become a damsel defender
My two yellow-tails are alive and well. I love em and they will stay. No one new can move into my tank anyway. (Damsels can get very aggressive to new tank inhabitants. They get more aggressive as they age.)

 

[cheryl]

Hi Saltwaterdave:
I am no expert but can share our experiences. I have two kids that were breathing down my neck to add fish when we started (7 and 9 years old). We kept a chart of the water levels, added live rock (which was fun to pick out and then to see what was growing on it), then after a few weeks added a few snails and hermits to watch. Just making trips to the fish store was fun as we learned more about the different species and planned what to stock the tank with. Our LFS held two clowns for us that we would go and "visit" until our cycle was complete! This made the cycle time pass a little easier
I have also heard alot of people do not like to cycle with damsels as they become territorial and aggressive to new additions. I have read old posts that recommend using a raw shrimp to cycle with. I would do a search!
Good Luck

 

[sandy]

Hi Again. Actually she already has 1 Blue Damsel. Please don't put raw shrimp in there! Good idea with new tank to cycle with no other critters. The LR and LS -- added slowly. Cheryl - good ideas. I'm like a 7 year old myself and am lucky 1) I found this board and 2) My fish did not die in spite of me.

 

[von_rahvin]

if i was going to do a tank i would add some LR and enough sadb be it dead or alive to have a nice 3-4" DSB. if you want o get live rock it can become a game for the little ones to see what new creatures you can find. I am constantly finding new stuff on my live rock everyday.

 

[saltwaterdave]

Thank Everyone for the valuable input..First I had 2 Damsels and one of them chewed the fins off the other 1...he could'nt swim....and we like him he comes to the top wehn we feed him....now can I just add the sand on top of my crushed coral or do I need to remove the cc??? We have been looking at live rock, it is very expensive if I go with the live rock should I consider going the reef route? or should a newbie like me try fish first? I am already putting money away for a 125gl,but that is a year away...because I have been told I should start with a fish only tank and go from there.... THANK YOU VERY MUCH!!

 

[saltwaterdave]

I forgot to ask a couple more questions...my cc has turned a yellowish to a brownish color...anyone know why??? and I have at least 4" of cc on the bottom....should I add 4 more " of live sand??

 

[chadillac]

I think you might be better off in the long run to pull out the cc, it can trap alot of trash. It will wind up throwing off your water parameters down the road. You can do live rock without going full on reef. You will probably wind up with some pieces that have some really nice growth on them if your lucky. If you do just let nature take it's course and what grows, grows!!! It really is your decision when it comes right down to it.

 

[dick525]

Hello everyone.I have cycled three freshwater tanks and one saltwater tank without a single fish.
Ammonium Chloride and Stress Zime is what I used in each one and have had success with all four tanks. Just add moderate amounts of AC every three days and wait until the nitrifying bacteria do their thing. About three weeks after comencing this procedure the nitrites where already tolerable for fish to be introduced safely.
Hope this info is usefull to someone.
****

 

[fshhub]

i definitely agree with changing from cc to ls, it is hard to swallow, since you just spent that money on cc(not cheap either), it does not all have to be live though, i would not however add 4 inches of sand on top of the cc
and that is a classic example of why most of us do not want damsels, they do those things, but iif you want to keep them be sure to stock accordingly with fish that won't be a prob with them(unfortunately most are)
i can't help wiht the child factor, but like has already been said, it does take time, i cycled tanks in about 2 (or was it 2.5) weeks, i also cycled tanks that toook months, ls and lr definitley help out there(the quickest was wiht lr and ls), or shrimp can work too, and i am not sure why sandy said don't add shrimp(it may kill the damsel is why, or...) but one thing ot consider here, is that the damsel probably won't let the shrimp do it's job anyhow, more than likely he'll eat it or most of it before can do anything for your cycle
also, the wording you use, indicates that you may be battling the ammonia and trites, like with water changes, IMO(others do disagree, and some agree) water changes and things to reduce these often seem to prolong the cycle, so if you are adding thindgs to reducde them or doing water change,s i would stop, let it ride out it's course, things will come back down on their own
if you are considering the switch to sand, then this coudl help with your water quality in the long run, cc's are notorius for becomeing a problwem with water in the long run(not always, but very often), now some do use them still, but they do have the potential to become a problem later on
and yes you could make it a fowlr(fish only with live rock), it does not have to be a reef to have lr, lr is actually beneficial to most aquarium set ups, it adds food for the fish, shelter, decoration adn FILTRATION, just by being present, so using it is not a bad thing, as ling as the species you add are not too hard on it(most are not a problem, i mean like 99.9999999999999999% of them are NOT a problem), NOW, if you do later decide to go reef, it is fairly easy if you have the lr and a conservatively socked tank, so it would give more options later on as well
HTH

 

[saltwaterdave]

Ok Thank everyone for the help,I am going to go check and see how much live sand cost....might be a while before I can actually make the change though.I have not done any water changes yet...Should I change from cc to ls BEFORE the tank cycles...or if I wait until after am I asking for trouble? Does anyone know why the cc seems to be changing colors? Thank You!!

 

[flamehawk]

Go to home depot and get southdown play sand "dead sand". Will cost you much less. Tank will re-cycle if you add "dead sand". Less so if you add "live sand".Dead sand will become live sand over time. Good luck.

 

[saltwaterdave]

Thanks for all the input..I really appreciate it,I added 3 more damsels and some more live rock....not sure what I am going to do about the cc...

 

[saltwaterdave]

WOW....I put in 3 more damsels last night and about 2 more pounds of LF and when I got home from work today the water already seemed clearer,the damsels are all fighting...lol...( I got abeautiful Velvet damsel)..and I am REALLY EXCITED!!!! I just want to thank you all that gave me your valuable opinion and your experiences.....still hav'nt had anyone address the cc changing color? I figure it must be alage growing...and if anyone can tell me...should I change the cc to sand before the tank cycles? or if I have to wait until after it cycles am I asking for trouble????? again THANK YOU ALL!!!! <img src="graemlins//urrr.gif" border="0" alt="[urrr]" />

 

[orwolf77]

I'm pretty new, but I'll give it a shot. The live sand and live rock will help you to build up your bacteria. At first the rock will create a spike in your levels, but since you are cycling you might not notice. My 29 gal took over 6 weeks to cycle with 2 damsels, lr, ls, and adding the "Cycle" bacterial solution. The color change happened to my ls. This is just an algea of some sort as far as I know. I hope this helps. If I said something wrong please feel free to correct me.