over flow or drilled? mr x
- Thread starter corallover23
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mr_x
Active Member
well, that's one way. internal overflows are another. external overflows are yet another, to save space.
i believe these can make a bit of a slurping sound, so this is why people go with the durso setup. mine, however, is pretty quiet.
i think you only need 1 drill hole though...thistank pictured has either 2 drains, or the return coming through the side too. i'd suggest 1 drain and the return coming over the top, on the other side of the tank.
i believe these can make a bit of a slurping sound, so this is why people go with the durso setup. mine, however, is pretty quiet.
i think you only need 1 drill hole though...thistank pictured has either 2 drains, or the return coming through the side too. i'd suggest 1 drain and the return coming over the top, on the other side of the tank.
corallover23
Member
Originally Posted by Mr_X
http:///forum/post/2560269
well, that's one way. internal overflows are another. external overflows are yet another, to save space.
i believe these can make a bit of a slurping sound, so this is why people go with the durso setup. mine, however, is pretty quiet.
i think you only need 1 drill hole though...thistank pictured has either 2 drains, or the return coming through the side too. i'd suggest 1 drain and the return coming over the top, on the other side of the tank.
wow this is really confusing not knowing what half of the stuff is , ok when i get 1 hole put in what parts do i need to make it so it dont leak, my lfs dont sell diy parts.
http:///forum/post/2560269
well, that's one way. internal overflows are another. external overflows are yet another, to save space.
i believe these can make a bit of a slurping sound, so this is why people go with the durso setup. mine, however, is pretty quiet.
i think you only need 1 drill hole though...thistank pictured has either 2 drains, or the return coming through the side too. i'd suggest 1 drain and the return coming over the top, on the other side of the tank.
wow this is really confusing not knowing what half of the stuff is , ok when i get 1 hole put in what parts do i need to make it so it dont leak, my lfs dont sell diy parts.
sly
Active Member
Before we can tell you what parts you will need, you need to tell us what you plan on doing. Let's start from the top. What size tank do you have? Does it already have any holes drilled in it? Will you be using a sump system or a hang on back filter system?
You can get all your plumbing parts from Lowe's or Home Depot.
An overflow is simply a device for getting water out of your tank and into your filter system. There are several designs and the main differences are noise, reliability, cost, how simple they are to install, and maintenance. Overflows can consist of an elaborate siphon system or just a hole in the bottom of your tank. Obviously the siphon is the easiest to install if your tank already doesn't have holes but the "hole in the bottom" is the most reliable. Siphons can stop working if not designed properly and when that happens, your tank can overflow.
With that said, I use a "U tube" siphon to take water out of my auto top-off system and into my sump. I find that if you design it properly and keep it maintained, a siphon can be very reliable (and is fun to build).
My tank has a bulkhead. This is a water dam that sits in a corner inside the tank. Water spills over the top and goes down into a drain hole behind the dam. This drain hole is the overflow. A bulkhead is simply a wall that is used to hold back water. These are used so that the tank water will be held back and kept at a certain depth (like a regular dam). People without bulkheads often have the problem of their tank water surging up and down because of the irregular flow of most overflow systems. However I said most... That is where different designs come into place. If your tank doesn't have a bulkhead you can still design an overflow system that keeps your tank water at a constant depth... Like I said, the bulkhead is a way to keep the tank at the same depth while the water is free to vary in height in the overflow behind the bulkhead. Water can surge up and down behind the bulkhead all it wants, it will not affect the main tank...
When water spills down a bulkhead it can create a lot of noise and gurgling. That is why I use a durso standpipe. This is basically a tube shaped like an upside down "J". The tube is a way to mask the noise of the water going out the overflow. By its design, it eliminates gurgling and raises the water level behind the bulkhead (dam) so that it doesn't splash as loudly. Think of the dam as creating a waterfall. The higher a waterfall, the louder it is. A standpipe raises the water level so that the water doesn't have as far to fall behind your bulkhead. That makes it quieter.
Bulkheads can also be used in siphon systems to keep the siphon from breaking when the power goes off. If a siphon gets air in it it will stop and your tank could overflow. Putting a bulkhead in the system keeps air from getting into the siphon which increases it's reliability. Basically people can put bulkheads anywhere from inside their tank, to outside it on a hang on back siphon system. They all have the basic principle of regulating water level.
There are other types of overflow systems and differing designs of standpipes... but before we get into the "infinite" possibilities, we need to know what you have so that we can narrow it down. There are threads here which show pictures and how to information for each of these systems... Some of them you can buy, some of them you can build yourself. It's basically up to you and how comfortable you feel working with your hands.
You can get all your plumbing parts from Lowe's or Home Depot.
An overflow is simply a device for getting water out of your tank and into your filter system. There are several designs and the main differences are noise, reliability, cost, how simple they are to install, and maintenance. Overflows can consist of an elaborate siphon system or just a hole in the bottom of your tank. Obviously the siphon is the easiest to install if your tank already doesn't have holes but the "hole in the bottom" is the most reliable. Siphons can stop working if not designed properly and when that happens, your tank can overflow.
With that said, I use a "U tube" siphon to take water out of my auto top-off system and into my sump. I find that if you design it properly and keep it maintained, a siphon can be very reliable (and is fun to build).
My tank has a bulkhead. This is a water dam that sits in a corner inside the tank. Water spills over the top and goes down into a drain hole behind the dam. This drain hole is the overflow. A bulkhead is simply a wall that is used to hold back water. These are used so that the tank water will be held back and kept at a certain depth (like a regular dam). People without bulkheads often have the problem of their tank water surging up and down because of the irregular flow of most overflow systems. However I said most... That is where different designs come into place. If your tank doesn't have a bulkhead you can still design an overflow system that keeps your tank water at a constant depth... Like I said, the bulkhead is a way to keep the tank at the same depth while the water is free to vary in height in the overflow behind the bulkhead. Water can surge up and down behind the bulkhead all it wants, it will not affect the main tank...
When water spills down a bulkhead it can create a lot of noise and gurgling. That is why I use a durso standpipe. This is basically a tube shaped like an upside down "J". The tube is a way to mask the noise of the water going out the overflow. By its design, it eliminates gurgling and raises the water level behind the bulkhead (dam) so that it doesn't splash as loudly. Think of the dam as creating a waterfall. The higher a waterfall, the louder it is. A standpipe raises the water level so that the water doesn't have as far to fall behind your bulkhead. That makes it quieter.
Bulkheads can also be used in siphon systems to keep the siphon from breaking when the power goes off. If a siphon gets air in it it will stop and your tank could overflow. Putting a bulkhead in the system keeps air from getting into the siphon which increases it's reliability. Basically people can put bulkheads anywhere from inside their tank, to outside it on a hang on back siphon system. They all have the basic principle of regulating water level.
There are other types of overflow systems and differing designs of standpipes... but before we get into the "infinite" possibilities, we need to know what you have so that we can narrow it down. There are threads here which show pictures and how to information for each of these systems... Some of them you can buy, some of them you can build yourself. It's basically up to you and how comfortable you feel working with your hands.
mr_x
Active Member
i disagree with a "u" tube being very reliable. if there is a chance of it failing, then it's not very reliable. only a drilled tank is "very reliable".
as for corallovers setup, he's got 2-30 gallon tanks, one over the other, and space at the bottom for a sump.
i would drill 1 hole in each tank and run 2 pieces of spa flex, or pvc into a 7" filter sock in the sump. using the bulkhead and elbow with the strainer is the easiest way to do this.
as for corallovers setup, he's got 2-30 gallon tanks, one over the other, and space at the bottom for a sump.
i would drill 1 hole in each tank and run 2 pieces of spa flex, or pvc into a 7" filter sock in the sump. using the bulkhead and elbow with the strainer is the easiest way to do this.
sly
Active Member
I had a drilled tank overflow once. So with that chance that it can fail, is a drilled tank not very reliable either? It's all in how you set it up.
There's a chance that the silicon can fail and the tank can fall apart too...
With any setup you are taking a chance. By careful design you can minimize the chance that something bad can happen. Design your system so that if it fails, it fails in the safe mode. For example my auto topoff system is designed so that if the float sticks open, water can only fill up the sump another 3 inches. After that the water will overflow from the auto topoff bucket instead of going into the sump. Then it spill into a dike system which goes to a drain.
For my U tube I used a modified tee fitting at the top to collect any air bubbles that can develop. Air rises to the top of the tee and rises through a clear plastic tube displacing the water that is kept in the tube as a reserve. The inlet and outlet of the tube is kept low enough to almost touch the bottom of the sump. It is in a high flow area next the the system pump so any micro air bubbles that are present get pulled into the pump instead of going up into the tube. I have not had any problems with using a U tube since I made these changes.
I think the biggest risk to my system overflowing is the durso stand pipe. I keep the water pretty high behind the bulkhead to reduce the noise and so if the overflow becomes clogged for some reason, it won't take long for the tank to overflow.
There's a chance that the silicon can fail and the tank can fall apart too...
With any setup you are taking a chance. By careful design you can minimize the chance that something bad can happen. Design your system so that if it fails, it fails in the safe mode. For example my auto topoff system is designed so that if the float sticks open, water can only fill up the sump another 3 inches. After that the water will overflow from the auto topoff bucket instead of going into the sump. Then it spill into a dike system which goes to a drain.
For my U tube I used a modified tee fitting at the top to collect any air bubbles that can develop. Air rises to the top of the tee and rises through a clear plastic tube displacing the water that is kept in the tube as a reserve. The inlet and outlet of the tube is kept low enough to almost touch the bottom of the sump. It is in a high flow area next the the system pump so any micro air bubbles that are present get pulled into the pump instead of going up into the tube. I have not had any problems with using a U tube since I made these changes.
I think the biggest risk to my system overflowing is the durso stand pipe. I keep the water pretty high behind the bulkhead to reduce the noise and so if the overflow becomes clogged for some reason, it won't take long for the tank to overflow.
mr_x
Active Member
and a tree can fall on your house and crush the tank room too...then the overflow won't work either....
a drilled tank can only overflow if you do not set it up correctly. my 2 drilled systems have no chance of overflowing. there is enough room in the sump to take the pump shutting off, and the overflows cannot be clogged, without me ignoring the tank for a month or so....
if you have a strainer over the overflow opening, i don't see how it can get clogged without you knowing it. if algae or detrius clogs it, you just aren't keeping up on your maintenance.
a drilled tank can only overflow if you do not set it up correctly. my 2 drilled systems have no chance of overflowing. there is enough room in the sump to take the pump shutting off, and the overflows cannot be clogged, without me ignoring the tank for a month or so....
if you have a strainer over the overflow opening, i don't see how it can get clogged without you knowing it. if algae or detrius clogs it, you just aren't keeping up on your maintenance.
corallover23
Member
Originally Posted by Mr_X
http:///forum/post/2562159
and a tree can fall on your house and crush the tank room too...then the overflow won't work either....
a drilled tank can only overflow if you do not set it up correctly. my 2 drilled systems have no chance of overflowing. there is enough room in the sump to take the pump shutting off, and the overflows cannot be clogged, without me ignoring the tank for a month or so....
if you have a strainer over the overflow opening, i don't see how it can get clogged without you knowing it. if algae or detrius clogs it, you just aren't keeping up on your maintenance.
thanks for all the help mr x ........ As this question was directed for you any ways lol..... as i want to buy some of your frags.....I will be setting my tank up the way you suggest.........I like your way of doing this you are to the point!......
http:///forum/post/2562159
and a tree can fall on your house and crush the tank room too...then the overflow won't work either....
a drilled tank can only overflow if you do not set it up correctly. my 2 drilled systems have no chance of overflowing. there is enough room in the sump to take the pump shutting off, and the overflows cannot be clogged, without me ignoring the tank for a month or so....
if you have a strainer over the overflow opening, i don't see how it can get clogged without you knowing it. if algae or detrius clogs it, you just aren't keeping up on your maintenance.
thanks for all the help mr x ........ As this question was directed for you any ways lol..... as i want to buy some of your frags.....I will be setting my tank up the way you suggest.........I like your way of doing this you are to the point!......
prime311
Active Member
Well just to reiterate what Sly was saying. A Utube style of Overflow, setup properly, also has no chance of failing. The only way it could fail is if he drain pipe clogged, which is exactly the same way a drilled tank can fail. There is no way the utube can lose siphon if setup properly. Thats the point Sly was trying to make. A drilled tank with no durso though would certainly look nicer.
mr_x
Active Member
i have noticed in my limited experience that when the power goes out, the u tube overflows occasionally had issues restarting. 19 out of 20 times it would...and the 1 time it didn't, nothing was changed, nothing was altered, or set up differently. that's my point.
this cannot happen with a simple drilled tank.
-and thanks for the nice words corallover! it's my pleasure.
this cannot happen with a simple drilled tank.
-and thanks for the nice words corallover! it's my pleasure.
scsdlh34
Member
Mr_X - and a tree can fall on your house and crush the tank room too...then the overflow won't work either....
I like the idea of a drilled tank (the tank I bought can't be drilled). Don't see it mentioned on this thread, but if you drill your tank and do a sump setup, just make sure and do a test run with a power outage failure to see how much room you need to leave in your sump.
Even with the overflows setup properly, you can always make a mess doing water changes or do what another member did and forget to turn off the RO/DI unit
I like the idea of a drilled tank (the tank I bought can't be drilled). Don't see it mentioned on this thread, but if you drill your tank and do a sump setup, just make sure and do a test run with a power outage failure to see how much room you need to leave in your sump.
Even with the overflows setup properly, you can always make a mess doing water changes or do what another member did and forget to turn off the RO/DI unit
prime311
Active Member
Thats why I only get the Lifereef style overflows Mr.X. Those types of problems happen in a classic utube overflow, but the newer designs don't have the power outage/lost siphon issues. Theres also the issue of possible air in the U pipe if you aren't pushing water through fast enough, but again this comes down to setting things up correctly. If you're pump is that much weaker then your overflows then you have a design problem. Or you could set it up like Sly with a method of removing any possible bubbles from the U.
sly
Active Member
Originally Posted by corallover23
http:///forum/post/2562226
thanks for all the help mr x ........ As this question was directed for you any ways lol.....
So I typed all of that for nothing? You asked about different types of overflows. I tried to guide you through them and help you pick one that best suited your system. Ok...
http:///forum/post/2562226
thanks for all the help mr x ........ As this question was directed for you any ways lol.....
So I typed all of that for nothing? You asked about different types of overflows. I tried to guide you through them and help you pick one that best suited your system. Ok...