Overcrowding?

[new jack]

I have a 20 gallon tank and am running a 330 biowheel with bio balls in the back and a 115 power head with sponge filter attached to it. I want to put a couple small damsels in it a clown a yellow tang and a dwarf lion. People have told me that i don't stand a chance at keeping the fish alive, but my friend has a similar set of fish (about the same # of inches) in a 20 gallon. Possible? What will increase my chances? Going through all my cycling trouble to keep 2 damsels in a 20 gallon seems like a waste, after all I filter my entire tank 20 times every hour and am prepared to do any kind of water change. If not with these fishes, what combination will be able to handle it? I realize that tangs and damsels get big, but I thought that i could buy them at 2" and trade them in at my pet store when they get to 4" or 5". How long does it take them to grow? What risk do I run pulling this switcheroo? Please don't just call me a moron, tell me what I can do to make it work.(filters, lr, ls, different fish) I am willing to compromise on every level. I just hope to accomplish a tank that will be somewhat entertaining to watch, but I don't want to murder innocent fish. Any and all help is woul be much appreciated. Thanks for your time.

 

[fishfood]

How about either a pair of firefish or a pair of cardinals with a six line wrasse(nice active fish), a bicolor blenny(interesting behaviors)and a tank raised false perc or yellow watchman goby(to get the yellow back in place of the yellow tang). Also go with the amounts of lr and ls that baron stated.

 

[new jack]

Thanks for the replies. I'm definately not getting the tang. Special thanks to dave who seems the be the only person to think that I can keep a dwarf lion alive in a 20 gallon. So i'll probably try the dwarf and a clown and another small fish. However, does adding things like crabs or snails further add to the overcrowding or does it help. Everyone seems to refer to them as a cleanup crew. So, will adding a couple hermit crabs and a few snails help or worsen my problem.

 

[sinner's girl]

snails, hermits, maybe a star would be a good idea. hermits will eat off the bottom and clean, snails will clean your glass (as well as bottom and lr).
ture perc's are full of fun and very playful.

 

[new jack]

I promise this is the last question I ask about what fish to put in my tank, but I have space for one more and i think i found it. Someone reccomended a goby and while I was looking around on the goby site I found a fish called a mandarin. Any info on this fish and how it will get along with a dwarf lion and a clown. Also does it need live sand because I plan to get argonite seeded with live sand.

 

[saul t. waters]

Mandarins are no no's to many people... mostly because they died of starvation...they need plenty of live rock to feed on...( live rock contains copepod and amphipods)

 

[von_rahvin]

i would never try to keep any of the dragonetts in a small tank. (these being scooter blennies and mandarin gobies, both are really dragonettes)
on to the dwarf lion, it is possible to keep on in a tank that size you just have to devote the tank to him or her. I kept a lion in a 20 for a few months untill he got to big for it , then i bought a larger tank. Now i am going to have to buy an even larger tank. If you want the lion (dwarf) you can just plan on having to upgrade in a few months. Now i would not keep a lion with other smaller fish in a tank that size. there's my thoughts

 

[jakepilot]

IMO thats a bit ambitious..but i cant fault you, at least you are eager...i have a 10 gallon with 2 small fish in it, and that is enough for me in that one, you may want to think about selling the 20 gallon on ---- and using the money toward a bigger tank that you can keep the fish you want to keep--jake

 

[fishfood]

I too would not have a mandarin in a 20g tank. As for the lion i don't know much about them but if they do get to be 5-6 inches and the are preditors than you may have problems with other smaller fish, snails, etc so it would end up being a very boring tank. Thats is why i suggested the fish i did.

 

[souljah]

In my 20 Gallon tank....
I have a 2 inch yellow tang, 1 inch Humbug Damsel, 1 inch maroone clownfish, and a 1 inch strawberry pygmy basslet. Also with 2 turbo snails, 4 blue legged hermits, 1 small sea urchin, and 1 small sally lightfoot crab and 3 pieces of live rock.
My ammonia, nitrite, are all zero.
nitrate is 1ppm, pH 8.2 Salinity 1.024
Constant Temp of 77.4 degrees
I have had my tank up and running for 2 years straight with absolutely no problems

 

[souljah]

Well obviously you are are. My tanks been running for 2 years.

 

[fishymissy]

I believe that a dwarf lionfish could do nicely in a 20g, but, IMHO it would have to be the only fish in the tank. As stated before, these fish are messy and have a high bio-load so adding more fish to the tank will cause you to have problems down the road. Also you should consider that lionfish will eat any fish that fits in their surprisingly large mouths. A small clownfish will end up being a meal.
I have a 20g too, and in it I keep a percula clown, a firefish and 2 scissortail gobies. This is a nice combination with fish that stay small and slender. I also have various mushrooms, a clam, etc......something to think about....because you might want to add corals and such to the tank later on, and you won't have to worry about the fish! One other thing, it's real easy to say that you will trade a fish in sometime in the future, but sometimes when you go to do that, you realise that you just can't! You can get very attached to these animals and giving them up is too hard to do!
Whatever you decide to do, I wish you luck!!

 

[david s]

drop the lion and tang and u would be ok i think but lion definatly not and poor tang would be smakin into the glass tryin to swim lol

 

[fishfood]

Wow! You have kept a yellow tang in a 20g for two years. IMO thats sad. Its not like a blenny or gobie that hangs around the bottom and rocks all day. Those guys swim. I've been to hawaii and during some snorkling i've seen yellow tangs that were up to 7 or 8 inches maybe more and they were darting all around the reef. I guess if I put it that way then its sad we put any fish in the size tanks that we do but a yellow tang in a 20g tank. <img src="graemlins//eek.gif" border="0" alt="[eek]" />