phosphates
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doodle1800
Active Member
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About Phosphates (PO4)
____________________________________
What Phosphates Are, Where They Come From, and
Solutions For Reducing High Concentrations in Saltwater
Aquarium Systems
What Are Phosphates?
Phosphate or PO4 is a compound of Phosphorus (P), one of the top 14 out of 70 trace elements found in natural sea water that are considered to be essential for saltwater aquarium and reef tank systems. However, it is also a primary nutrient source for many forms of algae, particularly green hair species, so when high concentrations are allowed to accumulate in an aquarium, it then opens the door for aggressive algae blooms to occur.
Where Do Phosphates Come From?
Phosphates are introduced into a saltwater systems in various ways, such as:
* By using unfiltered tap water for making up sea salt mixes or as top-off water.
* Through many common aquarium products used, such as some sea salt mixes, activated carbon, KH buffers, foods put into the tank, and many other sources.
o It is advised to pretest tap or any other fresh water source and new products used in your aquarium for phosphates, was well as nitrates. Why add more of something that you don't need in your tank to cause a problem?
How Do You Reduce High Phosphate Concentrations?
The optimal phosphate level, especially for reef tanks, is an immeasurable one, or zero, with 0.05 ppm-mg/l being acceptable, and an upper level of 0.1 ppm cited as well. Having a good, reliable phosphate test kit is important. FINS recommends Hach and LaMotte brands as being good choices. Sailfert seems to have a good, precise phosphate test as well, but from our understanding the Sea Chem scale measures too high. (Read Test Kits Reviews & Compare Prices)
Here are solutions for reducing high phosphate concentrations in saltwater aquariums.
* Adding a limewater or kalkwasser solution has been associated with lowering phosphate levels. "In Notes From The Lab: Kalkwasser and Phosphates", a SeaScope Magazine Reprint, it states that, "One of the theories why calcium hydroxide might produce better results than calcium chloride has been that the high pH and high calcium in a saturated calcium hydroxide solution cause precipitation of phosphate from the freshwater, eliminating this algae fertilizer from the solution." Take a look at the results of the test they did using calcium hydroxide to see what the rate of reduction of phosphates were. It is interesting that, when allowing the mix to sit, after two days there was only a 50% drop in phosphates, but after five days there was a 90% drop. The conclusion is that the drop in phosphates, when using calcium hydroxide, is slow and if the mix is used right away, any phosphates remaining in the mix will be pumped into your tank.
* Good regular maintenance care routines with water changes are always recommended for a healthy aquarium. This helps to control phosphates, DOCs, nitrates and many other unwanted chemicals elements and compounds in saltwater systems that contribute to water quality problems.
* You can use commercially available phosphate removing products, such as Sea Chem's PhosGuard, Thiel Aqua Tech's X-Phosphate, Kent Marine's Phosphate Sponge and Coralife's Phosphate Remover. Luis Mercado conducted a test on phosphate and silicate removing compounds using these four products, which concluded comparatively good results from all four of them. Poly Filter material by Poly Bio Marine Inc. is highly recommended, along with some these other Top Pick Nitrate Absorbing Products as well.
o Note that when using absorbing materials or compounds, they need to be changed or rejuvenated regularly, as once they become saturated they are exhausted. This means they can no longer absorb anything, and what you are trying to remove is just staying in your system
About Phosphates (PO4)
____________________________________
What Phosphates Are, Where They Come From, and
Solutions For Reducing High Concentrations in Saltwater
Aquarium Systems
What Are Phosphates?
Phosphate or PO4 is a compound of Phosphorus (P), one of the top 14 out of 70 trace elements found in natural sea water that are considered to be essential for saltwater aquarium and reef tank systems. However, it is also a primary nutrient source for many forms of algae, particularly green hair species, so when high concentrations are allowed to accumulate in an aquarium, it then opens the door for aggressive algae blooms to occur.
Where Do Phosphates Come From?
Phosphates are introduced into a saltwater systems in various ways, such as:
* By using unfiltered tap water for making up sea salt mixes or as top-off water.
* Through many common aquarium products used, such as some sea salt mixes, activated carbon, KH buffers, foods put into the tank, and many other sources.
o It is advised to pretest tap or any other fresh water source and new products used in your aquarium for phosphates, was well as nitrates. Why add more of something that you don't need in your tank to cause a problem?
How Do You Reduce High Phosphate Concentrations?
The optimal phosphate level, especially for reef tanks, is an immeasurable one, or zero, with 0.05 ppm-mg/l being acceptable, and an upper level of 0.1 ppm cited as well. Having a good, reliable phosphate test kit is important. FINS recommends Hach and LaMotte brands as being good choices. Sailfert seems to have a good, precise phosphate test as well, but from our understanding the Sea Chem scale measures too high. (Read Test Kits Reviews & Compare Prices)
Here are solutions for reducing high phosphate concentrations in saltwater aquariums.
* Adding a limewater or kalkwasser solution has been associated with lowering phosphate levels. "In Notes From The Lab: Kalkwasser and Phosphates", a SeaScope Magazine Reprint, it states that, "One of the theories why calcium hydroxide might produce better results than calcium chloride has been that the high pH and high calcium in a saturated calcium hydroxide solution cause precipitation of phosphate from the freshwater, eliminating this algae fertilizer from the solution." Take a look at the results of the test they did using calcium hydroxide to see what the rate of reduction of phosphates were. It is interesting that, when allowing the mix to sit, after two days there was only a 50% drop in phosphates, but after five days there was a 90% drop. The conclusion is that the drop in phosphates, when using calcium hydroxide, is slow and if the mix is used right away, any phosphates remaining in the mix will be pumped into your tank.
* Good regular maintenance care routines with water changes are always recommended for a healthy aquarium. This helps to control phosphates, DOCs, nitrates and many other unwanted chemicals elements and compounds in saltwater systems that contribute to water quality problems.
* You can use commercially available phosphate removing products, such as Sea Chem's PhosGuard, Thiel Aqua Tech's X-Phosphate, Kent Marine's Phosphate Sponge and Coralife's Phosphate Remover. Luis Mercado conducted a test on phosphate and silicate removing compounds using these four products, which concluded comparatively good results from all four of them. Poly Filter material by Poly Bio Marine Inc. is highly recommended, along with some these other Top Pick Nitrate Absorbing Products as well.
o Note that when using absorbing materials or compounds, they need to be changed or rejuvenated regularly, as once they become saturated they are exhausted. This means they can no longer absorb anything, and what you are trying to remove is just staying in your system
beaslbob
Well-Known Member
this is an excellent article and I agree 100% with what is stated. The question now is what can be done to prevent such negative things as algae blooms associated with elevated phosphate levels. My analysis is:
all sources except the food added for the this are relatively constant. As fish bioload increased then more phosphates are added. Therefore, when a tank is first started plant life desirable and undesirable will grow from the constant phosphates being added. Adding desirable plant life to the system will crowd out the undesirable plant life. So adding such things as corraling algae, macros or marine plants like turtle grass will reduce phosphates while controlling the hair algae. Increasing this phosphate load by using tap water instead of ro/di will only result in more of those plants.
After the phosphates are reduced during the initial cycle the increase in phosphates are from the food being added. Again increasing the plant life growth. So again the result is increased plant life. So by maintaining optimal conditions for the desirable plant life you crowd out the undesirable plant life like hair algae.
a 10% weekly water change will only reduce phosphates 10%. Plant life could consume that much in a matter of hours. So the bottom line is to establish plant life you desire. Whether in the display or a refugium, establishing plant life you desire right from the start is the most effective phosphate control.
all sources except the food added for the this are relatively constant. As fish bioload increased then more phosphates are added. Therefore, when a tank is first started plant life desirable and undesirable will grow from the constant phosphates being added. Adding desirable plant life to the system will crowd out the undesirable plant life. So adding such things as corraling algae, macros or marine plants like turtle grass will reduce phosphates while controlling the hair algae. Increasing this phosphate load by using tap water instead of ro/di will only result in more of those plants.
After the phosphates are reduced during the initial cycle the increase in phosphates are from the food being added. Again increasing the plant life growth. So again the result is increased plant life. So by maintaining optimal conditions for the desirable plant life you crowd out the undesirable plant life like hair algae.
a 10% weekly water change will only reduce phosphates 10%. Plant life could consume that much in a matter of hours. So the bottom line is to establish plant life you desire. Whether in the display or a refugium, establishing plant life you desire right from the start is the most effective phosphate control.
reefnut
Active Member
Nice article you found doodle!!
Although a lot of things contain Phosphates, tap water can be the worst. As you can see that was the first things mentioned.
Also Phosphates can harm corals... Good quality RO/DI water, water changes, prevention and macro algae are the best controls IMO.
Although a lot of things contain Phosphates, tap water can be the worst. As you can see that was the first things mentioned.
Also Phosphates can harm corals... Good quality RO/DI water, water changes, prevention and macro algae are the best controls IMO.
beaslbob
Well-Known Member
Originally posted by dzones
What do you base that information on? There are way too many factors involved for you to make this assumption.
I am curious how you derived at such a satement.
Experience. And with the way it was worded, the only question is how much plant life would be required. My experience tells me a lot less than most people think.
doodle1800
Active Member
I was curious on how much phosphates were in my tank - a 55 that is 6 weeks old and has some algae, but going away slowly. So I ordered a test kit and tested it last night and had a zero reading. Not what I expected.
I used a Amer pharm tap water filter to fill my tank, thats why I was sure I had high phosphate levels. So.... what I'm going to do is use the tap water filter again and immediately test the water for phosphates.
I used a Amer pharm tap water filter to fill my tank, thats why I was sure I had high phosphate levels. So.... what I'm going to do is use the tap water filter again and immediately test the water for phosphates.
beaslbob
Well-Known Member
Originally posted by dzones
beaslbob:
Well what size tank do you have and how much plant life do you have in it?
What phosphate levels are you running?
Is it a Fish only? reef system?
(this doesn't count
) 10g fresh, 30 fish , bunch of snales, several plants, no circulation (open top) 1 NO tube. Never test phosphates or nitrates. maintenance replace water that evaporates with tap, feed fish.20g macro algae culture tank. nitrates 0.0 for 9 months except the week I documented here. sand, macros/plants, 1 powerhead. Maintenance replace evaporated water with tap. harvest macros for display.
55g with 15g refugium. 4 no bulbs, tetratec pf500 HOB filter. 1 yellow tang royal dottie back, madran gobie, 5 turbo snales, 10 or so hermits, 2 crabs, 1 banded coral shrimp, 1 bahama starfish, 1 green birttle starfish, a bush like anemone, small amount of corals. nitrAtes unknown (test kit) but under 40ppm, phosphates untested. Maintenance replace evaporated water with tap, feed fish 1/day, feed filter feeders 2/week, clean filter pads 1/week. I do scrape a small amount of algae of the glass each week. (Tank is still extablishing itself).
I do not test phosphates nor do I actually care too. I might in the future though. In the 55g there was brown algae during the first month of operation and for a month after I added 2 NO bulbs. The brown indicates that phosphates are present and both times it turned to green as phosphates were consumed. Additionally, when I reduced feeding, all the algae in the 55g on the rocks started to dissipate. Corraline was uncovered under a golf ball sized piece of live rock (only LR in system), and has remained for two months.
All tanks are clear with active plant and animal life. As long as that is true, then I really don't care what a phosphate test kit says.
doodle1800
Active Member
Sorry about that moderator, oops... I was trying to say by adding that link that they were not my words...
Here we go again - huh Bob?
Here we go again - huh Bob?
doodle1800
Active Member
Bob - did you use tap water when you filled your tanks?
doodle1800
Active Member
Does anyone have anything factual to dispute Bob? So far what I've read from him makes sense to me for the most part. I'm no expert however. But when someone says that a 10% change in water reduces phosphates by 10%, I have no reason to question that. And when someone says that plant growth reduces phosphates, what experts out there argue with this, where's the facts? I'm a little bewildered of everyone taking on Bob for whatever reasons. Is it because he doesn't put IMO after his posts? I'd like to know what annoys everyone when he posts? Its amazing he keeps his cool and sticks around - IMHO
beaslbob
Well-Known Member
Originally posted by doodle1800
Bob - did you use tap water when you filled your tanks?
yep.
and now i know what IMO stands for.
Gee kinda thought everything said here was that person's opinion.
I do find it amazing that unless we test for parameters the entire conversation is moot. Regardless what happens in the tank.
doodle1800
Active Member
Bob - you're losing your cool - stop it..