Please help me fish are dying for no reason

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bucksfan1976

Guest
Ok here is the deal. I have a 65 gallon tank here is what is has
2 175 Halide lamps
15 gal sump
euro reef rs135 skimmer
Wavemaker
100 lbs of liverock
This tank has been running aprox 3 months.
Livestock
(Please be advised all these fish are small) 3 inches or less
Yellow tang
Tomeni tang
Blue Hippa Tang
2 clowns
Coral Beauty
10 snails
2 emerald crabs
2 fire shrimp
About 4 weeks ago i had a royal Gramma, it died (i think it got beat up) It wasnt dead long bc its eyes were not even cloudy when I found it. Then about 10 days ago I had a anthesious(no clue on spelling) it died I do not know how , however I believe it sat in the tank aprox 4 days and when I found it , there was only about half of it left as i feel my crabs got to it. This is when all the problems began.
I had a small powder blue tang. I went to work everything was fine came home and it looked like a thin layer of skin was peeling off of it. Even after i got it in a hospital tank it only lasted 3 hours and died. Then I noticed my blue Hippa is getting clowdy eye. And then to top it off I had a lemonpeel angel and i noticed she was not swimming just kinds sitting there head facing up. I bagged her up and tok here to my LFS. He stated it had Dwarf Angel Disease. He said he could see the hemoriging in the belly. I do water changes every week normally 20 gallons. Every piece of rock Ive gotten ive washed it in saltwater to get all the debirs off of it.
Before my last water change we noticed that the Nitrates were high, the LFS thinks its bc of the fish being dead for 4 days. My question is that do you agree.
Ive also heard by adding a UV Sterilizer this can help alot with the ICK and such because it does something to the light that promotes bacteria growth.
Is this true please help Im trying to avoid a crash.
 
bender77

bender77

Member
What are your tank parameters, specifically
pH
Nitrite
Ammonia
Nitrate
Specific Gravity
Temp
How ofter and how much water are you changing?
Are you sure you don't have a tank bully killing or stressing everyone?
 
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bucksfan1976

Guest
I will be honest I dont know the numbers, just when i went in they said the Ammonia and Nitrate level was high.
Specific Gravity? Salinity lol thank god for google. I have a simple hydrometer, its around 29. I have been told 29-30 is good, my temp is right at 78 all the time.
I do a water change weekly. I have watched for a bully but cant see one, I would think the yellow tang was the bully but I have never seen it act mean and I watch it for hours.
However the anthious died between water changes
What do you think about the UV Sterilizer? Would this help?
 
bender77

bender77

Member
Ammonia= Bad. It sounds like your tank is still in the process of cycling and that could be what is stressing and killing your fish. I have to leave right now so I can't type more, but you may need to do large water changes daily to save what is left of your fish. I look for this thread when I get back and if someone else hasn't chimed in I'll try to help more.
 
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bucksfan1976

Guest
Well after some consideration I feel this will be my best bet.
1. Going to pick up some Fish Vet No-Ich Marine
2. Getting a UV Sterilizer
I would rather take the risk then loose more fish , they guarantee the No-Ich will not kill corals or live rock. And i know one person will say its good the next will not. But I have to do something before I have a full crash.
Suggestions?
 
bender77

bender77

Member
First, do not treat your display tank with any chemicals. Get your fish out of the tank and into a hospital tank. If you are 100% sure they have ich, then you need to do a hypo treatment on them. This thread is about a forum members ich outbreak and treatment. https://forums.saltwaterfish.com/t/387603/do-not-do-as-meowzer-did
While your DT is empty with will have time to complete it's cycle while the ich dies. Then it will be safer for your fish.
Pick up a testing kit so you can test your own water. If nothing else get ammonia, nitrite, nitrate and pH. Make sure you have tons of water on hand, you will most likely be doing large water changes daily in your hospital tank. Also get something like prime or alpha to help with the ammonia and nitrites while doing the water changes.
Post some pictures of your sick fish so others can see and we can help confirm it is ich and not lymphocystis of something else.
Your tank in essence is not "crashing" it just sounds like you did too much too quick and your tank can't keep up, and your fish may be sick because of it. It's very likely all your fish may die. I hope someone else comes along soon to help. I'm at the end of my knowledge. I assume today may be slow due to work and Halloween.
 
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bucksfan1976

Guest
My biggest problem is this, I have several fish that seem to have ich. I only have 10 gallon tank so i could only do one at a time in there, I cannot use my tap water because of some high levels of crap in it, my LFS is closed on Mondays and Tuesday so no chance for water. I will hold off on the treatment stuff for a couple of days to see , I will however buy the UV sterilizer though because they are just helpful in general. Worse 2 are my blue hippa and tomeni. Rest of fish seem ok. This sucks. I wish I had the money to buy a bigger QT but I just dont right now.
The company that makes the FishVet No Ich is up the road from my place, Im trying to contact them because I do not want to fall into this same category as all the fish dying.
Im trying to get ahold of someone to see if they can drop a 30 gal off so i can use it for a couple weeks.
 
beth

beth

Administrator
Staff member
buck, you have a lot of problems going on and there is no easy fix. First off your tank is way to small for any type of tang, let alone 3 of them. This is no small consideration.
Additionally, a tank with any ammonia is going to result in sick or dead fish. Adding medications to your display tank will only result in furthering the problem you have. A UV sterilizer is not going to address the ich you currently have. It seems that your tank was not cycled sufficiently to support the heavy load you have put on it.
How about using the 30 gal, if you can borrow it, for your live rock and inverts, then trying to treat all these fish in your display tank. You will need to use hyposalinity.
https://forums.saltwaterfish.com/a/hyposalinity
 
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bucksfan1976

Guest
Thanks for all the help.
1. I know i cant keep these tangs forever, however thats why we bought them small. So we could keep them for a year or so.
2. My tank when I set it up I had the company http://reefsystems.com/ come and set up the tank, All my rock 100lbs came from there and all of my water aprox 75 gallons including the sump all came from the same system. The system (in which I got used) was owned by a employee from reef systems and so all the water and rock were all cycled from the same place since it was 1st put up. Only thing I did was add some sand, very small layer aprox .75 of a inch Im more worried that I brought a fish into the system that caused this.
I just dont think i have the ability to do all of the changes, its sad and I feel horrible. Im going to pick up a ammonia kit today so I dont have to go to the local fish store to have them test, we are looking into a simple RO kit so i can make my own water.
Im gonna take this slow and not jump into everything because over reacting will only make things worse.
 
meowzer

meowzer

Moderator
Totally agree with Beth....BUT would like to add....You can go to the store and buy a 30G rubbermaid container for $5...and use that for a qt....or to house your rock as Beth suggested
DO NOT USE ICH MEDS.....Do you think the compnay is gonna tell you that...LOL...NOOOOOO....take it from someone who learned the HARD way....ich meds do not work
 
travelerjp98

travelerjp98

Active Member
Hey buck... I'm agreeing with Beth here. The tank is WAY over crowded and you put on a very high bio load really fast... not good.
Well... I see you are on your way to recovery, so any more questions... just let us know.
 
beth

beth

Administrator
Staff member
buck, it doesn't matter how small you tangs currently are. They do not belong together crammed into a tank that is too small for even one of them. Tangs are highly territorial, and generally do not get along well enough except in rather large tanks.
Whoever set your tank up either doesn't know better, or is selling you a bill or goods--if they are responsible for putting all those tangs together in a 65.
Anyway, it sound to me like you have your own notion about what needs to be done. Wishing you luck, and we will be around to help you out when you want it.
 
mikeo5422

mikeo5422

Member
I would advise to get a water test kit asap and do frequent water changes and tests. Maybe make a log of the parameters. You can fix this just take care and stick to the basics. Fix the problems and not the symptoms. You said a company came and setup the tank? Maybe there was a lot of die off in the transport of the 100lbps of rock. I am not too familiar with fish and disease treatment but I did read that major causes of ich are ammonia, stress (such as fighting fish), and temperature fluctuations. Sounds like you have at least two of those.
 
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bucksfan1976

Guest
Well a update. I picked up a UV Sterilizer just for future use and I did pick up some of the fish vet no ich marine. I treated the tank yesterday afternoon. All my inverts are still alive and kicking and moving around so that is a wonderful sign. I spoke to the company that makes it and they told me they would work with me if it killed my inverts and such. However, I woke up this morning and found my blue hippo tang dead. I do not beleieve the stuff i put in the tank had anything to do with it seeing as though she had something bad (cloudy eye and such) I spoke with my fiance and we are unable to get a hospital tank going so we are going to ride the storm out. Keeping a eye on the tank doing 20 gallon water changes per week for at least 6 weeks then going back bi weekly. We are not going to add any fish until the new year. That gives it 8 weeks to cycle without any new livestock. Only thing left in the tank is
2 Clowns
1 Yellow Tang
1 Tomeni Tang
Coral Beauty
Snails, Crabs, 2 anemonies, 2 fireshrimp, starfish
Thats good enough for me. Not much you can do in this situation when space is limited and such. However on a brighter note my clowns have decided to host or play in my pink tip anemonie , its been in there 2 months and they havent looked at it.
Thanks for all the help.
 
mr. limpid

mr. limpid

Active Member
Bucksfan, I've been reading this post. What I get out of this is every time you post another creature appears in your tank from your original list. Please post all the living creatures that reside in your tank. You also need to get the basic test kits ammonia, nitrate, nitrite and PH, then post results. And lastly if you have ick on one fish all fish have it, riding the storm out will only lead to all fish dead. Reef med's will not work (if it doesn't kill invert it won't kill ick) because ick is a invert. You need to QT all fish and follow Beth's advise on how to kill ick. I feel for you, you are learning the hard way, hang in there are people that are trying to help.
 
mr. limpid

mr. limpid

Active Member
Your right traveler, first I read PBT then a lemondpeel (those died) and then when read about the clowns hosting the anemone. Well just one two many, I retracked my request for a list.
 
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bucksfan1976

Guest
Ok well here is a update.
1. Got Tomeni Tang in a 10 gal hospital tank. It is looking better already.
2. Removed my sump and cleaned all the crap out of it (had alot of debris in the bottom)
3. Did a 35 Gallon Water Change ( I only had 7 buckets)
4. Added some better filtration
So hopefully this will help with my problems, Ill give it probably about 5 days then do another water change. Im gonna try to get ahead of this issue. I did notice after the change the fish seemed more active. So maybe they liked the new water. I will just keep up with the water changes and keep all my filtration product cleaned and in great working and cleaning condition. So hopefully I can get through this slowly.
 
mr. limpid

mr. limpid

Active Member
If you have ick you need to QT all your fish, only doing one will not help. As soon as you put him back with others he will be effected again. You will also need to leave your DT fish less for 8 weeks, this will end the ick life cycle.
 
travelerjp98

travelerjp98

Active Member
I agree with Mr. Limpid... there is no point in only qt'ing one fish. The ich is still in the tank.. in diff. parts of it's life cycle. And... leaving the tank fish less is also a must.
 
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