Please help me with my ALk and Calcium Levels. Please please Please

[krazekajin]

Okay, here is the scenerio:
Thanks renogaw and ifirefight for that awesome article. It has been wonderful.
I have my newest levels. It had been a while since I had done a waterchange. So I did a 50% waterchange and waited over 24 hours and retested.
My levels
PH - 8.4
Alk - 2meq/L or 5.6dkh
Cal - 270ppm
What do I need to do.
According to the article (http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/nov2002/chem.htm)
it stated that I cannot use Kalkwasser to get both of these up. It says I need to increase the alk first.
Is this true?
I also read in this article that I can use pure baking soda to increase my alk.
1. If I use a buffer like Kent Superbuffer how can I add this? can I drip it so I don't burn a coral.
2. If I use baking soda do I mix it with fresh water or mix it with my tank water. Can I drip this in so I don't burn my corals.
3. Can I use Kalkawasser?

 

[ifirefight]

Yuo need to read the article and do as it says. You are in zone 3 ..you need to move horizontaly over to zone 2 by raising you calcium...slowly drip it in top off water. Once in zone 2 you can follow those instructions and raise both levels together.

 

[ifirefight]

Originally Posted by KrazeKajin
Okay, here is the scenerio:
Thanks renogaw and ifirefight for that awesome article. It has been wonderful.
I have my newest levels. It had been a while since I had done a waterchange. So I did a 50% waterchange and waited over 24 hours and retested.
My levels
PH - 8.4
Alk - 2meq/L or 5.6dkh
Cal - 270ppm
What do I need to do.
According to the article (http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/nov2002/chem.htm)
it stated that I cannot use Kalkwasser to get both of these up. It says I need to increase the alk first.
Is this true?
I also read in this article that I can use pure baking soda to increase my alk.
1. If I use a buffer like Kent Superbuffer how can I add this? can I drip it so I don't burn a coral.
2. If I use baking soda do I mix it with fresh water or mix it with my tank water. Can I drip this in so I don't burn my corals.
3. Can I use Kalkawasser?
Yes ,you can use baking soda to raise alk. Kent supperbuffer can also be used,drip either of these in top off water.You can use kalk...but only once in zone 2.

 

[krazekajin]

Firefight,
I did read the article and I got confused. here is the quote.
"Corrections for Zone 3
Zone 3 problems are a little harder to correct, and are fairly common. It is, in fact, the problem in the real question posed at the beginning of this article (it doesn’t say so there, but the alkalinity was 3.2 meq/L). This problem is typically caused by overdosing alkalinity RELATIVE to calcium, but does not necessarily imply that calcium is either too high or too low (though it is almost always too low). To correct problems in this zone, monitoring of calcium and alkalinity values during correction is especially important.
One more word about this zone before getting to solutions: Many tanks end up here because aquarists are trying to correct pH problems by adding “buffer.” In my opinion, one should not try to correct any pH problem by simply adding an alkalinity supplement. If you are low on alkalinity, it is a fine course of action to raise the alkalinity. But if alkalinity is OK, or even high, adding an alkalinity supplement to alter the pH may simply create a worse problem. Better solutions to pH problems are discussed in this recent article6.
If this problem is extreme (i.e., you are far from the line at the right hand edge of zone 3), then water changes may be the best way to correct to the problem. In most cases, however, water changes aren’t necessary.
I would advise correcting this problem by adding a calcium chloride supplement until you have moved into the target zone (or zones 1 or 2 that you can then treat as described above) as shown in Figure 4. Almost any brand of calcium chloride will do (Kent Turbo Calcium, Kent Liquid Calcium, ESV, etc.). Certain other calcium supplements may also be OK (such as just the calcium component of the two-part calcium and alkalinity additive systems), but you do not want to add any alkalinity. You CANNOT use limewater or a calcium carbonate/carbon dioxide reactor to correct this problem. Any of the balanced calcium and alkalinity additive systems will move you parallel to the line at the edge of the zone, while you want to move over to it, and cross it."
However, the more I thought about it last night, the more I felt that a kalk drip was best. So I started one last night at around a drip every three seconds. i think that is a little too slow, but I am going to test my calcium today again. I am keeping a detailed journal about this adventure so I want to see exactly what is happening.
I will keep everyone posted.

 

[krazekajin]

after about 12 hours of my kalk drip. My levels are as follows:
My levels
PH - 8.4
Alk - 2meq/L or 5.6dkh
Cal - 310ppm
So I have a small rise in Cal but not my alk.

 

[weberian]

I agree that you need to raise BOTH. Keep it up with the kalk - I would go with a slightly faster drip (although you can only drip what you lose in evaporation). AND a water change within one week. JMO

 

[ifirefight]

Originally Posted by Weberian
I agree that you need to raise BOTH. Keep it up with the kalk - I would go with a slightly faster drip (although you can only drip what you lose in evaporation). AND a water change within one week. JMO
NO... Hold On a minute..I dont type very fast.

 

[krazekajin]

offically confused right now.
Firefight, you said in one post to raise my calcium and then in the other post to use a baking soda drip.
Am I okay by using my kalk drip until I get into a zone 2? When I am in zone 2, will a kalk drip still work?
I am so confused. ARRGGGGGG!!!!!!!!!!

 

[ifirefight]

Kraze... You need to re-read that section. Its all there in front of you. FIRST You CANNOT use limewater or a calcium carbonate/carbon dioxide reactor to correct this problem. Any of the balanced calcium and alkalinity additive systems will move you parallel to the line at the edge of the zone, while you want to move over to it, and cross it." THIS is true.....follow me here.. Any balanced additive (I.E. KALK) will move you PARALLEL to the line at the edge of the zone...You want to move OVER TO IT AND CROSS IT. These are both correct statements....So you did the opposite thing recommended. SECOND:
:Quote ..I would advise correcting this problem by adding a calcium chloride supplement until you have moved into the target zone. This statement is also true....Meaning you need to add a calcium chloride supplement (I.E. LIQUID CALCIUM) Kents whatever..doesnt matter. That will move you HORIZONTALLY accross into the proper zone. THEN and only then do you add a balanaced additive ( I.E KALK). Phew :joy:

 

[ifirefight]

Originally Posted by KrazeKajin
offically confused right now.
Firefight, you said in one post to raise my calcium and then in the other post to use a baking soda drip.
Am I okay by using my kalk drip until I get into a zone 2? When I am in zone 2, will a kalk drip still work?
I am so confused. ARRGGGGGG!!!!!!!!!!
Kraze, I did say raise your calcium...Thats what you need to be doing FIRST. In another post you were asking about baking soda...I said you can use it to raise ALK. Only answering your question...Did not mean to confuse you.

 

[krazekajin]

okay, let me see if I have this straight now. Sorry, sometimes I am a little slow.
With my current levels
PH - 8.4
Alk - 2meq/L or 5.6dkh
Cal - 270ppm
I need to add a calcium additive that will get me into the 325-375ppm range. Then use a kalk drip to keep my alk and cal levels constant. (is this what I need to do)
Is kalk a balanced additive? Can I drip a calcium only additive?

 

[ifirefight]

Originally Posted by KrazeKajin
okay, let me see if I have this straight now. Sorry, sometimes I am a little slow.
With my current levels
PH - 8.4
Alk - 2meq/L or 5.6dkh
Cal - 270ppm
I need to add a calcium additive that will get me into the 325-375ppm range. Then use a kalk drip to keep my alk and cal levels constant. (is this what I need to do)
Is kalk a balanced additive? Can I drip a calcium only additive?
Ok, I think you may be getting this. Where your levels are now...you need to move directally to the right...into zone 2. YES you are correct then you can use a kalk drip (balanced additive..same thing) to raise both levels TOGETHER. Personally.. I mix my own baking soda and liquid calcium together. It seems I can regulate it better. Be careful when adding Kalk or anything else...Dont add to fast and monitor those levels.

 

[krazekajin]

well, then I shall go out and get some calcium additive so I can raise my cal level to the proper place. I shall drip that in a gallon bucket over the course of a couple of days and then voila, I shall go back to a kalk drip and all of my problems will be solved.
Well, maybe not solved, but at least I finally am beginning to understand a little better.

 

[krazekajin]

I think I just figured out this thing.
I went to the calcium calculator that is linked to that article and if my alk is 5.6dkh, then my calcium needs to be at 400.
So I will get my calcium to 400 and then start a kalk drip as needed to maintain.

 

[zeroc]

I'd say your alk is too low so if raise your calcium and then go with kalk you're alk is just going to stay too low or your calcium is going to be way too high when your alk is right. Alk should be around a dKH of 9 or 10 and Calcium at 400. I'd say you have to do calcium until you get it to 400 then a buffer to get your alk up to 9 or 10, then you can keep then level with kalk after that.

 

[zeroc]

sorry 9 to 10dKH with calcium at 420-430. Nevermind me. I just keep my tank at 10dKH/420ppm.

 

[weberian]

Alk should be between 7-11 dkH. So he is low on both. You don't raise one and then the other. You raise them both with a balanced additive. The only balanced additives are kalk and two-part additive like b-ionic. The only other balanced increase is a water change.

 

[ifirefight]

Originally Posted by Weberian
Alk should be between 7-11 dkH. So he is low on both. You don't raise one and then the other. You raise them both with a balanced additive. The only balanced additives are kalk and two-part additive like b-ionic. The only other balanced increase is a water change.
With all due respect..you are incorrect. If he raises them both right now at the levels he is at by the time his calcium is at 400..his alk would be roughly 6 mequ/l. You do raise them both..Once you get a balanced level. He Does not have a balanced level. For a balanced ALK of 2.0 mequ/l he should have a reading of 400 on calcium....which he does not.https://www.saltwaterfish.com/vb/showthread.php?t=175205

 

[krazekajin]

so firefight,
Am I correct in my understanding. Raise just my calcium up to 400 or balanced with my alk and then I can use my kalk dripper to maintain?

 

[weberian]

I would assume he is not going to get to 400 Ca with additives alone. He is going to have to do a water change.
When my Ca was below 300, I had to do at least a couple of water changes to get things back to normal.
Additives are really just for small adjustments or to maintain levels.