Puffer fish not eating *video*

j0hn rambo

j0hn rambo

Member
My stars and stripes hasn't ate for nearly two weeks, any suggestions to help him eat would be great.
I've had him for nearly six years (he was 5 when I adopted him from my local shop). The puffer was with an emperor angelfish for 3.5 years but I donated the angel to the Newport Aquarium in Kentucky last week. His diet mainly consist of mussels. I sometimes feed him other meaty foods (squid,oysters,scallops,shrimp). I've recently tried soaking his food in garlic with no success.
I've attached a link to a video on youtube of me attempting to feed him. I'm starting to wonder if he has some type of swallowing issue. I will occasionally notice him looking like he is coughing. I'm no expert at telling if he has any air trapped in him but he doesn't appear to have any bulges on his underbelly.
Trying to feed video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E7hEnmNPwLU
Aquarium Set-up
125 FOWLR
Ammonia - 0
Nitrite - 0
Nitrate - 80 ppm (I've had problems with Nitrates ever since I set up this aquarium, I'll admit I'm not the best at regular water changes)
PH - 7.8
Salinity - 1.018
Temperature - 78

Overflow box
Wet/Dry Filter (All Glass Aquariums Mega Flow Model 3)
Mag 12 return pump
Coralife 220 Skimmer
Koralia power head ( middle rated gph version)
As far as the filtration the water first enters the overflow box and hits two cylinder shaped sponges before entering the wet dry. I tried to turn the wet dry into a refugium two years ago. The first tray the water comes into contact with is a sponge filter, the water then enters the bio-balls chamber. I removed the bio balls years ago and replaced this chamber with live rock. The water then flows through the lower section. I added "live reef mud" to this lower section two years ago (cant remember the brand). It then hits another rectangular shaped sponge right before the return pump. I also have a small light over the wet dry with a cluster of cheato I picked up at a LFS years back in hopes to reduce nitrates.
I think from the start there has been a flaw in my filtration set up. The tanks been running for over six years and Nitrates have always been an issue. I tried doing weekly water changes, I noticed very little difference in my nitrates. Its been close to two weeks now since my puffer has ate, he still appears to have color and doesn't seem stressed, but his breathing seems heavy.
Thanks!
 
beth

beth

Administrator
Staff member
Is his teeth getting too big? Puffers need hard shelled food in order to keep their teeth filed down. A diet of mostly one item is not really the best nutrition.
Does he look or act differently?
If you dump smaller sized food in the tank, will he not go for anything?
Wet dry systems are always challenged by higher nitrates, especially in a tank with big fish eating a lot of food. The filters can not break down nitrates fast enough to equalize, so you get higher nitrates.
 
j0hn rambo

j0hn rambo

Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beth http:///t/392471/puffer-fish-not-eating-video#post_3485123
Is his teeth getting too big? Puffers need hard shelled food in order to keep their teeth filed down. A diet of mostly one item is not really the best nutrition.
Does he look or act differently?
If you dump smaller sized food in the tank, will he not go for anything?
Wet dry systems are always challenged by higher nitrates, especially in a tank with big fish eating a lot of food. The filters can not break down nitrates fast enough to equalize, so you get higher nitrates.
Thanks for the reply.
His teeth don't appear to be getting to big. He is still able to open and close his mouth and his beak doesn't appear to stick to far from his upper or lower lip. I posted a link to me trying to feed him in my first post, if you missed it could you please view it? I really want to get this guy back to being happy. As far as his behavior he is still swimming and occasionally resting on the bottom. His breathing is heavy however and he has lost weight (hasn't ate for over two weeks). Does anyone have advice or experience with force feeding a puffer? I'm going to try soaking some food in vitamins but am unsure if I should try sedating him or try holding him firmly while in his tank and putting a syringe down his throat.
 
beth

beth

Administrator
Staff member
John, I did see the video. I can not tell that anything is wrong with him in that video. What happens if you add food to the tank, without trying to hand feed? What about smaller pieces of food? Try using a bird syringe to feed him, with much smaller pieces of food that he can just suck in rather than comp down on.
Do you have a quarantine tank? If so, it may be time to move him, and try a course of antibiotics.
 
j0hn rambo

j0hn rambo

Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beth http:///t/392471/puffer-fish-not-eating-video#post_3485492
John, I did see the video. I can not tell that anything is wrong with him in that video. What happens if you add food to the tank, without trying to hand feed? What about smaller pieces of food? Try using a bird syringe to feed him, with much smaller pieces of food that he can just suck in rather than comp down on.
Do you have a quarantine tank? If so, it may be time to move him, and try a course of antibiotics.
Beth, Thanks for getting back to me. For the 6 years I've owned the puffer I've either dropped the food into the tank or used a set of tongs and held it for him/her. I left a small sized mussel and shrimp in the tank for several hours, neither were touched so I removed them. I will begin looking for a bird syringe.
I do have a quarantine tank, however he is the only fish housed in the 125. If the antibiotics won't effect the live rock would keeping him in his current tank be alright? Sorry to ask but what antibiotics would you recommend? I've never had experience with a fish not eating that doesn't appear to be visibly sick with a parasite or fungus.
Would you recommend just removing the reef mud thats been in my wet/dry for a few years? I've stirred it in the past to try remove dead spots but I'm not sure if it's doing any help or just adding to my nitrate problem I've had. I've done two 30% water changes in the past 4 days and my nitrates seem to be stuck around 80 ppm. I always vacuum my sand bed, and move the live rock to get every area (it's only an inch deep, maybe a deeper bed would help). I've rinsed all filter sponges in water I emptied from the tank. I also shook the live rock off.
Lastly, does anyone know the life expectancy for a Stars and Stripes Puffer ? I've searched but haven't found any concrete evidence. Mines over 10 years old.
 
beth

beth

Administrator
Staff member
Antibiotics will completely crash your live rock tank. He'll need to go in QT. What size do you have? And is an established QT? To treat with antibiotics, you will need an established QT.
When removing the puffer, you will need to keep him in water at all times. I don't know how big he is, but I'm just saying that he will need to remain in water at all times during the transfer.
Look for Maracyn Two for Saltwater Fish.
At this point, I don't know if a bacterial infection is what he has, but you should go ahead a begin the treatment. He obviously doesn't have parasites if you have had him this long.
It could be nitrate overload at this point, if you have had this long term. While the fish is in QT, you can work on display and getting the tank down to a much lower nitrate level. What is the particle size of you sand? Are you using sand, or crushed coral?
 
j0hn rambo

j0hn rambo

Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beth http:///t/392471/puffer-fish-not-eating-video#post_3485623
Antibiotics will completely crash your live rock tank. He'll need to go in QT. What size do you have? And is an established QT? To treat with antibiotics, you will need an established QT.
When removing the puffer, you will need to keep him in water at all times. I don't know how big he is, but I'm just saying that he will need to remain in water at all times during the transfer.
Look for Maracyn Two for Saltwater Fish.
At this point, I don't know if a bacterial infection is what he has, but you should go ahead a begin the treatment. He obviously doesn't have parasites if you have had him this long.
It could be nitrate overload at this point, if you have had this long term. While the fish is in QT, you can work on display and getting the tank down to a much lower nitrate level. What is the particle size of you sand? Are you using sand, or crushed coral?

Beth,
Just wanted to give you a huge thanks for the advice. He just ate for the first time in a month! It wasn't an easy process because my 46 QT wasn't fully cycled, so I was doing large daily water changes to keep the ammonia near 0 and then adding 1 additional packet or Maracyn Two to the recommended dosage to try to make up for the lost water.
The Maracyn really did the trick though, I noticed during days 3-5 of treatment he was rarely resting on the bottom, and being more active. He still refused any food I placed in the tank. This morning he looked stressed, the ammonia levels probably raised over night. His 5th day of treatment was yesterday though so I moved him back to his display tank and he ate within 2 hours.
Would you recommend doing another 5 day treatment? I'm going to tackle the filter set-up next and get my nitrates under control. I will also begin soaking his food in vitamins, would you recommend vita chem by boyd enterprises? Do you ever add the vitamins directly to the tank or just soak them in food?
Thanks!
 
beth

beth

Administrator
Staff member
No, he probably should have stayed in QT until fully healed. But since he is back in the display see how he does. Soak his food in a selcon or zeocon. Keep the QT conditioned in case he needs to go back.
 
j0hn rambo

j0hn rambo

Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beth http:///t/392471/puffer-fish-not-eating-video#post_3488236
No, he probably should have stayed in QT until fully healed. But since he is back in the display see how he does. Soak his food in a selcon or zeocon. Keep the QT conditioned in case he needs to go back.
Thanks Beth, I'll keep a close eye on him and begin treating with soaked vitamins. I'm also going to work towards improving my nitrates. The QT tank will be set up for good.

This is from this morning, eating a clam.
 
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