Really Frustrated with the hobby

[piccasotrigger]

I have a juvenile emperor angel and also a yellow long nose butterfly with ick. Its doesnt seem to be to far along as there still eating and seem somewhat healthy. I put them 2 days ago in the quarintine tank and they seem to be doing no better, Im using rid ick and am wondering if anybody has used this before. Also im wondering if i should get a uv sterilizer i have had several fish in the past get ick. My tank is a 60 gallon with LR and LS 2 Xp3 filters a marineland 400. I have heard mixed reviews on Uvs but im getting so upset with losing fish to ick.
thanks for any help

 

[piccasotrigger]

Sorry i forgot one thing if anyone can tell me what would be the best thing to feed the angel and butterfly to get there immune system up. Right now they are eating brine shrimp but im not sure if that has the most nutritional value. I really need help i have a couple thousand dollars invested in this tank and am starting to have a tough time explaing to my wife why im spending 100s of dollars on fish that are dieing. Lastly i know 60 gallons is to small for full grown fish all fish are babys right now and have plenty of room.

 

[ophiura]

I am sorry to say but one reason you may have the ick, is because of the fish choice and tank size. Those are big fish for that tank.
You can have all the money and equipment in the world for this hobby, but you can fail, without patience, research and discipline. That is not meant to be a flame.
While they may be "babies" they still may need room.
Please provide specific details on your tank -
Age
filtration
dimensions
inhabitants
SPECIFIC water parameters
A UV will not help with diseases, if the tank simply is not suitable for what you are trying to keep.

 

[nicetry]

Originally Posted by ophiura
I am sorry to say but one reason you may have the ick, is because of the fish choice and tank size. Those are big fish for that tank.
You can have all the money and equipment in the world for this hobby, but you can fail, without patience, research and discipline. That is not meant to be a flame.
While they may be "babies" they still may need room.
Please provide specific details on your tank -
Age
filtration
dimensions
inhabitants
SPECIFIC water parameters
A UV will not help with diseases, if the tank simply is not suitable for what you are trying to keep.
I'm in full agreement with this. A couple other observations; I'm sensing you are not quarantining all of your fish, which will dramatically reduce your losses. You also need to research the specific dietary needs of these fish. Brine shrimp is akin to us eating ice cream every meal. Eventually, it's going to take a toll being totally void of nutrition. These fish have specific feeding requirements including a variety of quality meaty foods and lots of greens.
I'm interested in what fish you have lost thus far.
The Rid Ich is pretty much worthless so don't waste your money. Check out the FAQ's in the Disease forum and read up on hyposalinity and quarantine. These are going to be your best options for treating the sick fish. Circumstances like yours are a main cause for people leaving the hobby, but if you're willing to put the brakes on and re-group, there is info to help you get a lot more enjoyment out of the hobby.

 

[piccasotrigger]

Thank you both for you reply unfortunatly last night i lost my butterfly but the angel is still kicking. I took your advice and ditched the rid ick and have started hyposalinity. Im feeling kind of optomistic about the angel fishes survival he looks bad but is not breathing to hard and is foraging for food, which is better than yesterday so im hoping the treatments working. Im wondering as to how i should rid my main tank of this ick problem i have 3 assorted chip stars 1 searpent star some small hermits and small lionfish along with 40lbs live rock. Ive heard about hyposalinitying the whole main tank but i really dont have the money to buy another huge quarintine tank to put all the inhabitants, any other suggestions? and in response to the question of what ive lost from ick it was two yellow and one blue tang.

 

[ophiura]

Hyposalinity will kill the inverts, case closed (which is why it is used to treat parasitic infections).
You don't need a full tank set up for a QT. You can use a good size rubbermaid container with hang on filter.

 

[sfoister]

The ick will continue to look for a host. The only realy proven way to get rid of ick in all of it's growth stages is to leave the tank unoccupied by any fish for 90 days. The ick will attempt to find a host, fail, and die. Ick can live in water and substrate for up to 60 days without a host. 90 days ensures that it is completely dead.
It sounds like a long time, but it's either that or risk throwing money at a problem and being disappointed again.

 

[piccasotrigger]

Can ick live in inverts? can i take the lionfish back and leave the inverts in, while leaving the angel in the 10 gal quarintine tank for 90 days?

 

[sfoister]

ick will not attack your inverts. Just fish.

 

[piccasotrigger]

So it would be safe to just take out lion and leave crabs,stars,snails in there with same salinity for 3 months?

 

[browniebuck]

you should really try to see if your LFS will take the angel, as it will get WAY too big for your tank and having it live in a 10 gallon for 90 days will almost certainly kill it.
I know your frustration, as I too lost many fish when I first started (blue tang, naso tang, longnose butterfly, heniochus) due to my tank being too small. I have since stepped back and done some research and found smaller fish that thrive in my 55 gallon. I am probably still overstocked, but everyone has been doing very well for the past 3 to 4 months (4 green chromis, maroon clown, mandarin, keyhole angel, eibli angel (they get along...I know they normally don't, but these guys are weird that way), yellowtail damsel, and foxface (thinking of taking him to LFS, he is going to get too big for this tank and my upgrade won't be coming as soon as had originally planned).
When researching, look at several sites in order to find a general opinion as to minimum tank size (not looking for one that states that your tank size is good enough). This will help you find fish that you really like as well as ones that will do well in your tank. I found that adding inverts (porcelain crabs, anemone crabs, emerald crabs, peppermint and cleaner shrimp) and coral (if that is your plan) helps to add to the character of the tank without adding too much to the bioload or creating too many problems with compatibility (again, you need to research before buying).
Hang in there, regroup, do some research, and enjoy.

 

[piccasotrigger]

Thanks for the reply i will look into getting rid of the angel but i highly doubt the lfs will take it in its condition. But as far as the ick in the main tank goes if i leave the tank with just inverts and no fish will the ick all die out even at normal temp and normal salinity.?

 

[sepulatian]

Originally Posted by piccasotrigger
So it would be safe to just take out lion and leave crabs,stars,snails in there with same salinity for 3 months?
Ich does not host inverts. You do not need to leave your display fishless for three months. 6 weeks is all that is needed for the ich to reproduce and die from lack of host. You have a 10 gallon qt? What fish do you currently have? How long have the fish been in hypo? What are you using to measure SG?Please post over in Disease and Treatment, we will be happy to walk you through this.

 

[browniebuck]

Being relatively new, I am not 100% sure of this, but if you were to purchase and run a UV sterilizer, the ich should go through that and be killed rather quickly. I had an ich problem when I first started out and purchased a Coralife UV Sterilizer. I wasn't able to get all of the fish out, as my qt wasn't ready yet, so I simply ran the sterilizer constantly for couple of weeks. Since I bought the sterilizer, I have seen NO signs of ich on anybody (for the last 4 months or so). I am not saying that this is the ideal way to get rid of ich, just giving an alternative method that worked quite well for me.
The downside of the sterilizer is that they kill good and bad critters that go through, which could have a negative impact on your pod population. Constantly running a sterilizer can be especially detrimental to corals that you may have as well, as it will also kill some of their food sources. After running it initially, I have had it turned off with no further problems, though it is ready to go any time that I see the first hint of any problem.

 

[seattle]

Yellow Longnoses can fit in a 60-gallon.But if that is wrong replace the fish with a Copperband Butterfly!