refugium and sump?

[aquaman]

OK, I am felling a bit dumb asking this question, but do you need to have a sump if you have a refugium? If so what is the better way to go. Separate or as a combo of the two.
Also one more dumb question, I have read a bit about bio balls not being a good idea, however my LFS today they said it was a MUST. Is this true or not?
I am looking to do a DIY, and will be needing any help I can get, and diagrams would be nice.
To give a little info, I just bought a 125 gal pre drilled tank with overflow. This is what i will be building it for, and am a patient person, and willing to take the time it needs
Thanks in advance, for the help, and not laughing at me publicly

 

[broncofish]

Sorry look at post below.

 

[broncofish]

Originally posted by broncofish
First off nobody will ever laugh at you, for a lot of people refugiums are a new idea. Second Bio-balls have a place in this world just like everything else, but not in a SWF aquarium, I recomend double checking everything your LFS says now. Third I am currently building myself a 55g sump/refugium combo. The only reason I am adding a sump(previuosley running refugium only) is to have a high flow wate area, possible place to run carbon, or if for some reason in the future it turns out my notion of going skimeerless is crazy, I'll have a place to throw one. Her is a designe for fuge only:

 

[broncofish]

Here is sumpfugium, with a skimmer:

 

[aquaman]

Broncofish, Ok, Bio balls are out. Do you need any kind of mechanical filtration with this type of set up, or is the optional? Would you have another filter running or not?
This is what I was going to do from the start, and I was very excited about it, until my LFS said otherwise. I do believe they are knowledgeable, and it was not like they were trying to sell me one of there sumps. I told him flat out I would be doing a DIY sump.

 

[joez]

bronco...I don't see in that sumpfugium picture where the overflow line goes to...maybe I'm just blind??? It just sort of disappears when it hits the return line from what I see

 

[cbr929]

Bio balls are only needed if you don't plain to have live sand
and live rock. So my oppinion is to go with live sand/ rock and
don't get the bio balls you will have a much better time with
your water quality.
With your sump/refum if you have the room to have 2 seperate
tank under your main tank I would go with 2 one with the refum
and one with your skimmer and heater and return pump. If you
don't have the room and have to go with one put 4 chamber
so you can put every thing in their.(1st chamber for your overflow
tubs,2nd for your skimmer/heater 3rd for your micro alge and 4th
for you return pump.
That is my oppinion, good luck with your project hope everything goes good.

 

[krux]

if you plan to go with what is in most respects a far superior system of filtration, that being the use of live rock and live sand, prepare to use at least 2 pounds of live rock and 3 pounds of live sand per gallon. when you do the multiplication you can see why this is indeed an ambitious project.
my lfg has over 1000 gallons of show and grow out tanks, keeps and sells some of the most beautiful sps corals you will ever see, and has an impecable track record for livestock health, and he uses bioballs and 0 (zero) sand in his system. this has been up, running, and extremely lucritive for years and years. he sells live rock, and has probably half a ton of it, but as for sand, not everyone runs a dsb who has sucess.
julian sprung used to collect live rock for a living for an export company before he made all his money selling people on plenums and deep sand beds...

 

[josh]

Here is a pic of my new mini sump ( total of 6 gallons ) before it was plumbed up. The pvc you see is the drain line, which splits, one into the fuge and one directly into the first baffle. It works very well, with no bubbles being returned to the tank. The split also reduces the flow, allowing for less turbulence in the fuge area.

 

[toddpolish]

yeah, it's a good idea to run the LFS ideas by the board here first before implementing them. Be very weary of what they tell you...most are just out to make a $$$

 

[broncofish]

Originally posted by JoeZ
bronco...I don't see in that sumpfugium picture where the overflow line goes to...maybe I'm just blind??? It just sort of disappears when it hits the return line from what I see
If you slide the rule bar at the bottom over you can see where it goes(into refugium side)

 

[joez]

no...when you were showing the "From Overflow" I thought that was a water line, not a line for a discriptor.

 

[broncofish]

Oh I gotcha no thats coming down form a tank.

 

[joez]

Bronco, while you are here, just thought I'd tell you I got a table saw that's 8" and it works great cutting acrylic, as long as it is atleast 1/4". The thin stuff tends to crack much too easily for it.
It's a great investment I think, being only $300. The machine cuts angles very nicely. If you were to try a triangle refugium like we were talking about before, cutting 60 degree angles becomes sooo simple.
You might want to look into it

 

[broncofish]

Hey Joe thanks, I actually already built a triangle fuge 45, 45, 90, cutting it by hand(very hard). I am investing in a nice table saw with an adjustable speed motor, and 42"(18" measurable cutting surface) I can't keep up with business with out it I think

 

[joez]

I see that! Well if you need help, you can subcontract out to me and I won't charge you anything! I love working with my hands, and it'd just be another excuse to!

 

[aquaman]

Just wanted to tank everyone for the help, I started building my sump/fuge tonight.
If all goes well I will have it up and running in about a week or so. I only have a limited amount of time this week to work on it.
Thanks again