Republican Candidates

[1journeyman]

Originally Posted by stdreb27
But that begs the question, why would any logical person vote for any of the Democratic candidates?

Because a large segment of America has decided it's better to receive from the government than to do anything for yourself....
The Democrats are promising to take care of everyone and to punish the richest portion of our country and "big" business by making them pay for all of these entitlements they are promising.
Now Hillary is apparently going even further in her "redistribution" ideology...
Either way, it's clear none of the Democratic candidates have ever bothered to read the Constitution, or else they have no regard for it.

 

[rylan1]

Originally Posted by 1journeyman
False... false, and false... Once again; Obama's plan is a "Universal Plan".
"… My plan begins by covering every American. If you already have health insurance, the only thing that will change for you under this plan is the amount of money you will spend on premiums. That will be less. If you are one of the 45 million Americans who don't have health insurance, you will have it after this plan becomes law. No one will be turned away because of a preexisting condition or illness" (Taken from Obama's webpage)
Rylan, have you even read his plan?
*"The Obama plan will create a National Health Insurance Exchange to help individuals who wish to purchase a private insurance plan. The Exchange will act as a watchdog group and help reform the private insurance market by creating rules and standards for participating insurance plans to ensure fairness and to make individual coverage more affordable and accessible. Insurers would have to issue every applicant a policy, and charge fair and stable premiums that will not depend upon health status..." (taken from same webpage)
He is for the Government's complete control of the private Insurance industry in health care.
His plan is not a universal plan because it is not a mandate, meaning if you choose not to have insurance than you are not obligated to have it. It allows you to have a private plan... which is not universal... Hilary Clinton even said his plan is not a universal plan. I also think standards and rules are necessary in making insurance more accessible and affordable.

 

[rylan1]

Originally Posted by 1journeyman
Because a large segment of America has decided it's better to receive from the government than to do anything for yourself....
The Democrats are promising to take care of everyone and to punish the richest portion of our country and "big" business by making them pay for all of these entitlements they are promising.
Now Hillary is apparently going even further in her "redistribution" ideology...
Either way, it's clear none of the Democratic candidates have ever bothered to read the Constitution, or else they have no regard for it.
Why is it punishment to pay your fair share of tax? I don't think its punishment, it just gives people who earn less a break.

 

[rylan1]

Originally Posted by 1journeyman
Because a large segment of America has decided it's better to receive from the government than to do anything for yourself....
The Democrats are promising to take care of everyone and to punish the richest portion of our country and "big" business by making them pay for all of these entitlements they are promising.
Now Hillary is apparently going even further in her "redistribution" ideology...
Either way, it's clear none of the Democratic candidates have ever bothered to read the Constitution, or else they have no regard for it.
Whats clear is that the current Republican Admin has not read the Constitution. What do you all think about Bush saying he is going to est permanent bases in Iraq w/o the approval of Congress and that he doesn't need it to move forward w/ the plan.

 

[mfp1016]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
Why is it punishment to pay your fair share of tax? I don't think its punishment, it just gives people who earn less a break.
Fair share? You have got to be kidding me.
If Democrats are all about helping out the poor, why don't they pay more in taxes? As far as I know there is only a minimum on how much you can pay in taxes, but no maximum. Rylan, did you pay more than the minimum?

 

[mfp1016]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
His plan is not a universal plan because it is not a mandate, meaning if you choose not to have insurance than you are not obligated to have it. It allows you to have a private plan... which is not universal... Hilary Clinton even said his plan is not a universal plan. I also think standards and rules are necessary in making insurance more accessible and affordable.
If I choose to seek a private plan, will I still be taxed for Obama's plan?

 

[rylan1]

Originally Posted by mfp1016
Fair share? You have got to be kidding me.
If Democrats are all about helping out the poor, why don't they pay more in taxes? As far as I know there is only a minimum on how much you can pay in taxes, but no maximum. Rylan, did you pay more than the minimum?
Why do rich people need tax cuts as opposed to moderate or low income people?

 

[stdreb27]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
Why is it punishment to pay your fair share of tax? I don't think its punishment, it just gives people who earn less a break.
But what is your "fair" share of tax? Who decides, does the socialist politician? This argument is so contingent on perception. I'll bet the poor guy living in the shot gun house would say any taxes would be "unfair" but would say tax the "rich". While the Rich don't use the social services that the poor do. So maybe fair would be the rich not pay taxes while the users of the system pay for the system...

 

[1journeyman]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
His plan is not a universal plan because it is not a mandate, meaning if you choose not to have insurance than you are not obligated to have it. It allows you to have a private plan... which is not universal... ....
Wrong...
Read the plan. It directly affects EVERYONE; Therefore it is universal. Read the quote Rylan... He says "My plan begins by covering every American".

 

[rylan1]

Originally Posted by mfp1016
If I choose to seek a private plan, will I still be taxed for Obama's plan?
No, we'll I guess that depends... you probably won't pay more taxes I guess is the best answer... but tax dollars will go into the program. If you are an employee... and choose to have this insurance...your premiums will come out of your check like it would for private ins. But the program itself is not going to place any extra burden or tax on your current income.
But you all have to agree that we need reforms in the ins industry... We can't count on private ins to do it alone because its not in their best interests.

 

[stdreb27]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
Why do rich people need tax cuts as opposed to moderate or low income people?
What tax cuts for rich people? It is a misnomer that the "rich don't pay taxes" and likewise that the Bush tax cuts were only for the rich. It wouldn't matter what the tax cut was actually, the dems will just say that.

 

[1journeyman]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
Why is it punishment to pay your fair share of tax? I don't think its punishment, it just gives people who earn less a break.
Hmm... ok, let's play this game; What percentage of your income do you consider "fair"?

 

[mfp1016]

If I don't plan on using it why should I pay for it?

 

[stdreb27]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
No, we'll I guess that depends... you probably won't pay more taxes I guess is the best answer... but tax dollars will go into the program. If you are an employee... and choose to have this insurance...your premiums will come out of your check like it would for private ins. But the program itself is not going to place any extra burden or tax on your current income.
But you all have to agree that we need reforms in the ins industry... We can't count on private ins to do it alone because its not in their best interests.
Dude, man your gullable, have you EVER seen a socialist program like this even not put more of a tax burdon on everyone?

 

[rylan1]

Originally Posted by stdreb27
But what is your "fair" share of tax? Who decides, does the socialist politician? This argument is so contingent on perception. I'll bet the poor guy living in the shot gun house would say any taxes would be "unfair" but would say tax the "rich". While the Rich don't use the social services that the poor do. So maybe fair would be the rich not pay taxes while the users of the system pay for the system...
We all use the system... ie military... roads ... etc..etc.. You could argue that big business are the largest benefactors because of agreements our country makes w/ foreign gov't. gov't contracts...

 

[stdreb27]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
We all use the system... ie military... roads ... etc..etc.. You could argue that big business are the largest benefactors because of agreements our country makes w/ foreign gov't. gov't contracts...
The vast majority of our federal budget does not go to roads, and infrastructure, it goes to entitlement programs. (minus the Military)

 

[1journeyman]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
Whats clear is that the current Republican Admin has not read the Constitution. What do you all think about Bush saying he is going to est permanent bases in Iraq w/o the approval of Congress and that he doesn't need it to move forward w/ the plan.
Where do you get your info? Seriously...
Here is where Congress approved it:
"The supplemental funding bill for the war in Iraq signed by President Bush in early May 2005 provides money for the construction of bases for U.S. forces that are described as "in some very limited cases, permanent facilities..."

 

[1journeyman]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
No, we'll I guess that depends... you probably won't pay more taxes I guess is the best answer... but tax dollars will go into the program. If you are an employee... and choose to have this insurance...your premiums will come out of your check like it would for private ins. But the program itself is not going to place any extra burden or tax on your current income.
But you all have to agree that we need reforms in the ins industry... We can't count on private ins to do it alone because its not in their best interests.
Of course you will pay more taxes...
Furthermore, we all DO NOT agree that the current system needs reform. If you don't want insurance Rylan, you don't have to have it (medical). If you don't like the cost of healthcare then try to figure out a way to reform that... but many of us who pay for our own insurance or take jobs for medical benefits understand our priorities.

 

[1journeyman]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
We all use the system... ie military... roads ... etc..etc.. You could argue that big business are the largest benefactors because of agreements our country makes w/ foreign gov't. gov't contracts...
Again, give us numbers.
How much do you think the "rich" should pay in taxes, and define "rich".

 

[rylan1]

Originally Posted by stdreb27
Dude, man your gullable, have you EVER seen a socialist program like this even not put more of a tax burdon on everyone?
I disagree because the tax cuts will still apply for everyone except for the highest earners.
I am gullable? You all just want to find ways to disagree w/ the policy.
I suggest you read it... It doesn't mandate coverage (except for children)... if don't want ins than you don't have to have it. What it does is it makes insurance universally affordable and gives you more options and competition... I think this is a key difference.
The plan also is supposed to save the average family $2,500 a year in premiums and expenses.
http://www.barackobama.com/issues/pd...reFullPlan.pdf
I welcome critisism of the plan, but valid critisism... This industry needs reformed... so if you don't agree with it tell me why your candidate's plan is better.