Researching electrical before hiring

fishy7

Active Member
I have installed a new tank and it has completed it's cycle. NOW it is time for a little electrical work and need some advice and possible rough estimates.
My new tank will have a about 1100 Watt draw with all running.
The issue: The tank is on the same circuit as the TV equipment. I am not sure how much it draws but here is a list: TV/amp/cable box/infrared/sub and a few other pieces I am not 100% sure of.
Possible solution

I wired my house for a hot tub and the 220 line is in the wall behind the tank. The Green box shows where the hottub box is located on the outside. Can I use the 220 line for 2 110 20 AMP dedicated lines? This way I do not have to run any extra wires
If so any one have a rough extimate of how much?
Thanks for the insight...

 

michaeltx

Moderator
220 is 220 and 110 is 110 I really dont think your going to be able to get away with running everything off the 220. but maybe someone with alittle more electrical no how says so LOL
Mike
 

fishy7

Active Member
My current tank runs on 2 110 dedicated 20 amp circuits so I assume that is 220? As you can tell I an not savy on electrical.

Thanks for the compliment!
 

michaeltx

Moderator
I think if you hooked 110 devices up to a 220 line it will overdrive them and cause failure.
I dont think it will work because the 220 line has breakers already so adding another set of breakers is going to redunant I think you pop your breakers over and over again.
Mike
 

tankkeeper

New Member
Hello I'm new to the hobby but I've been a master electrician for 17 yrs now, and to answer your question about the 220 is no you can't run your equipment on 220 because it will blow apart. If you want to use the 220 you have for your hot tub you will have to convert it to 110 by changing the breakers in your panel from double pole breakers to single pole breakers. Also your hot tub is probably on a 50 amp breaker and your (2) new breakers would need to be 20 amps, also you won’t be able to use your hot tub anymore if you convert it.
As far as the cost of converting it or for running a new circuit? It can vary from place to place. I would call around and ask your family and friends for companies they have used before, and get them to give you a ****free**** quote!!!! Don’t pay for them to look at it! You can email me with any other questions at mrelectric.nga@gmail.com
 

ameno

Active Member
that's right, you can not hook up 110v to 220v, you could use one pos. leg of the 220v which would be 110. but I would probably not try to run the tank off the same line as the hot-tub, the hot tub breaker should be rated for the hot tub and the extra load could case a trip when the tub is on full load. If you have a 20 amp breaker I think it would work fine to use what you have because your tank won't be pulling but 9 -10 amps.
 

scsinet

Active Member
The answer to your question is yes and no.
Residential single phase power works like this... you have two hot wires and either a neutral/ground or a separate neutral and ground. For now, we'll forget about the ground, so you have two hots and a neutral. The neutral is electrically centered between the two hots.
In the breaker panel, 120v branch circuits connect to one hot and a neutral, giving you 120v. When something like an air conditioner, dryer, stove, or hot tub requires 220v, it connects to the two hot wires, giving it 220v.
Now here is where things get tricky...
Certain appliances require BOTH 120 and 240v internally to operate. For example, in a stove, the oven's elements are 240v, but the burners are 120v. In a dryer, the heating elements are 240v but the drive motor, drum light, etc are 120v. In these setups, the circuit brings all 3 wires (4 if there is a separate ground). Then the appliance breaks it out internally and connects internal components as appropriate.
Other appliances, such as air conditioners, only require 240v. In those cases, only the two hots and a ground are brought out to the unit, as the neutral doesn't get connected to anything so it would be a waste of wire.
Your hot tub... I have no idea whether it's 240 only or 120/240. If it's 120/240, there is a neutral conductor present in the box and what you want to do is possible. If it's only 240, then you are SOL, EXCEPT if your house's service entrance (the main wires from the power company) is a 3 wire (which gives you 2 hots and a ground/neutral shared).
See, the hot tub will definitely have a ground there. If your house has a separate neutral and ground and a neutral wasn't run to the tub, you CANNOT use the ground as a neutral. It might technically work, but it's dangerous and a very serious code violation. If your house uses a shared neutral/ground, then you CAN do it because the ground will definitely be there, and it's legal to use a ground as a neutral in this scenario.
I hope I'm still making sense.
Long story short, if you aren't up to snuff on electricity and the electric codes, then you probably want to have an electrician come in and evaluate your setup. He (or she) will need to look at your service entrance panel and your hot tub wiring. If it's possible to do, a sub-panel will have to be installed outside. Your hot tub probably has a 30-50a breaker in the main breaker panel. You can't just tap off of a 50a circuit and install a 20a outlet, as a 20a circuit needs a 20a breaker. So, new breaker will need to be installed outside for the hot tub, along with branch breakers for your tank. All of this will be expensive, perhaps more expensive than just running a new circuit for your tank.
That said, 1100w is not bad. A 15 amp circuit can supply around 1875w, and I doubt your entertainment center draws more than 700w, at least not continuously (bass punches during loud movies and such pull little spikes, but circuits are designed to handle that).
 

fishy7

Active Member
Thanks guys for the help with this issue.
I do not have a hot tub at the moment. I had it wired for the future knowing I wanted one. Now that I have another body of water...I do not see me getting a tub.
I was not clear with my wording but did not intend to run my equip off a 220 line but more like (2) 110 outlets on dedicated 20 amp circuits.....

All this electrical stuff is crazy to me. I will keep my desk job.

Appreciate the help
 
I think it it would probably be a lot easier for you to run a new circuit to your fishtank. This way you can use a GFCI breaker, and that will make the entire circuit safe for use with aquariums. You dont need o be too electrically savvy to do this, its just a matter of how to run the new wires to your tank.
 

fishy7

Active Member
What do you thing of this idea?
I have an outlet that is on a different circuit and could reach with an extension cord. Plug the TV equip into this and install a GFCI on the other circuit for the tank?
 
That should work fine, but I would just flip the breaker and see if anything else you didnt know about runs off that circuit too.
 

spiderwoman

Active Member
What would you estimate 2 dedicated 20a circuits cost? We are going to have those installed for our 150 tank and would be nice to know what ballpark that job is.
 

camanuch

Member
you said that you do not have a hot tub right now and you don't think you will be Getting one right? If that is the case then all you have to do is change the double breaker to two single breakers. Then take out old outlets and connect 2 single phase or 110v outlet to each line making it a 110v dedicated outlet. Hope this wasn't confusing and helpfull.
 

al mc

Active Member
Originally Posted by camanuch
http:///forum/post/2548820
you said that you do not have a hot tub right now and you don't think you will be Getting one right? If that is the case then all you have to do is change the double breaker to two single breakers. Then take out old outlets and connect 2 single phase or 110v outlet to each line making it a 110v dedicated outlet. Hope this wasn't confusing and helpfull.
This will work well. But if you do not feel comfortable working around electricity have an electrician do it. It should be less expensive for him/her to do it this way then to pull two new lines from the original breaker panel. Personally, I would pull the 220 into a new 'sub panel' breaker box near the tank and then run a couple dedicated GFCI lines to outlets strategically placed behind the tanks.
From all the posts you can see there are many ways to tackle the issue.
 

scsinet

Active Member
Originally Posted by camanuch
http:///forum/post/2548820
you said that you do not have a hot tub right now and you don't think you will be Getting one right? If that is the case then all you have to do is change the double breaker to two single breakers. Then take out old outlets and connect 2 single phase or 110v outlet to each line making it a 110v dedicated outlet. Hope this wasn't confusing and helpfull.
Yeah if you don't have a hot tub you can at the very least redo the wiring to have it serve a single 120v circuit (or even two, as I said above depending on your wiring situation). Of course by doing so you won't be able to have a hot tub anymore, but still.
 

fishy7

Active Member
Everyone,
Thanks for the helpful ideas. I am searching for an electrician. The last 2, 1 never returned the call and then the other pulled a no call no show. I do not get it

I will keep you posted.
 

robn70

Member
Originally Posted by FISHY7
http:///forum/post/2549649
Everyone,
Thanks for the helpful ideas. I am searching for an electrician. The last 2, 1 never returned the call and then the other pulled a no call no show. I do not get it

I will keep you posted.
Not to get off topic. I have the same problem here with both electricians and plumbers. I called 3 electricians and 4 plumbers for 2 differnt projects and it was either fishing or hunting seasion so some didn't showcall back and the others were either on hunting or fishing trips. I guess they don't need the work.
 

scsinet

Active Member
Originally Posted by RobN70
http:///forum/post/2549922
Not to get off topic. I have the same problem here with both electricians and plumbers. I called 3 electricians and 4 plumbers for 2 differnt projects and it was either fishing or hunting seasion so some didn't showcall back and the others were either on hunting or fishing trips. I guess they don't need the work.

It's the industry. You'll get routinely bumped for bigger jobs. It stinks, but that's the way it is. That's why I keep facilities people on staff... contractors are too unreliable.
 
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