Score!

[jackie dh]

As some of you might remember I lost most of my fish back on April fools day (I wish that it had been a bad joke

) I lost a adult Emperor that I had for many years.... nearly broke my heart.

As I'm rebuilding my population I really wanted to get the same fish that I had lost or even fish that I had longed for but couldn't get. So far I have replaced my Blue Tang, a Purple Tang (his color is getting better) a Heniochus Butterfly (the one I lost was huge) and last night I scored a baby Blue Faced Angel! I realize that I probably won't be able to get another Emperor now, although I am sorely tempted when they are this small.
Apparently I'm the only person in the area that is after the more expensive fish because they had the Angel for nearly three weeks with not takers and I was offered the fish for $65 instead of the $100 that they had him priced at.

I know that they are $79 here and Emperors are even cheaper but I've had a terrible time with the fish that I've been getting here, many come in DOA, others die in a day or two, I have a Blue head wrasse (from here) that has never eaten, I thought that he had died weeks ago but I saw his poor wasted body again a few days ago. I know that it is shipping stress, especially this time of year but I just can't see wasting any more fishy lives if I can get a good fish locally.
The only down side to getting them locally is that the local store has a central system and they have ick in the system, since they inverts in the system they don't treat the fish for the ick. I pointed the sick fish out to the guy in charge of the fish and his answer was that it would be OK because all fish have ick and they would recover on their own.

He's a know it all so I can't tell him any thing. I only bought that Angel because it was in their reef tank which is separate from the other fish and I had been watching it ever since it came in three weeks ago.

 

[flower]

Quarantine is the only option you have then, I wouldn't put it in my main tank that’s for sure.

 

[srfisher17]

Originally Posted by Flower
http:///forum/post/3295525

Quarantine is the only option you have then, I wouldn't put it in my main tank that’s for sure.

That's for sure.
You can get an entire QT system for a lot less than one of your fish. The luck you have with online fish is weird; I've bought all my fish online for years (that is a lot of fish) and have excellent success. I buy from 3 sources and would never do it any other way. I would never buy a fish from the store you describe; but whatever works... BTW, if your tank is big enough (say 180+); you should be able to keep a BF with an Emperor; just wait until the BF has grown some and he would probably be fine with a juvi Emperor.

 

[jackie dh]

I wish that it was a 180, it's a 120 tall. I had a 55 QT set up in the back room but the filter died and I didn't find it for a few days, so I will have to start it up again so no QT. I plan on re sealing my old 120 long and getting it going, then I will get the other angel.

 

[rispa]

Congrats and good luck with the fish

 

[donebythefish]

OK, I'm new here but would like to offer a bit of "alternative advice" and hopefully not get slammed for my somewhat different approach(es) to disease prevention, control and remedies...
Many moons ago, before I got out of this wonderful hobby (long story) I was a published author and guest speaker at aquarium society gatherings along the eastern corridor. My wife and I would intentionally visit "pet stores" and seek out distressed marine fish with the sole intent of saving them from what would otherwise be a slow, sure demise. We had a 90% survival rate. Having said that, here's some hints...
Your LFS was correct in saying all fish have "ick" ...just like we humanoids walk around with germs and virii in our systems, so do fish and all other life on this planet. But, and this is the key point, all life also has some sort of immune system to keep all this "nasty stuff" at bay. It's when we get stressed that outbreaks occur because our immune system is compromised/weakend and then... we catch a cold or in the case of our gilled friends, your fish come down with visible signs of "ick".
So, what is stress? It can be psychological, moving from one new state to another, meeting new people, new environment, or in the case of a fish that would mean it being captured, shipped, put in holding tanks, captured again, shipped again to the local wholesaler and re-acclimated to a new temp-holding tank, captured yet again, shipped to your LFS, captured yet AGAIN when you purchase it and acclimate it to it's new, hopefully permanent home. This is "environmental stress" and does not stop there....does the tank offer enough privacy and shelter for the new fella? Too much current? Friendly, native tankmates without attitude/territorial issues? (yeah, you damsels, I'm talking to YOU!).
Food? Are you trying to raise that 7" Clown trigger on flakes? Good lord, go to the supermarket and get the thing some cherrystone clams and fresh jumbo shrimp. Duplicate what it normally would eat in it's natural environment.
Water quality - it doesn't have to come from Poland Springs, but it should be clean and I think everyone has a good handle on that here
My point in all this is that if you provide optimum conditions that will reduce the stress factors ALL the way around (food, territory, shelter, etc) the fish WILL recover on it's own, homeopathically, without dumping foreign drugs into the tank. A QT is the best way to do this, although remember that eventually you'll be capturing again and placing into a new environment and re-introducing the stress factor again, so once the fish is healthy again please acclimate slowly and carefully to keep stress at a minimum to prevent a relapse. OK, there's my first post having just signed up for these boards - pleased to meet you all

 

[srfisher17]

I don't think all fish do have ich. Their life cycle is well documented and this parasite cannot survive, anywhere, without a fish host. If a fish is treated in a ich-less QT long enough to eliminate the ich in the free swimming stage and then put into an ich-less system. Ich is not present. Ich is not like a dormant virus; it has a known cycle that can be interrupted and the ich eliminated.
To the TS: Putting ich-infected fish into your DT (with tangs, yet) is a disaster in the making. Please QT and cure these fish if you need to buy them.

 

[donebythefish]

Thanks srfish - believe it or not, we're on the same page. Ich is not a dormant virus - it is a parasite, and yes, it has a life cycle. Problem is, a fish will display visible signs of ich once stressed and, if in any type of community tank and not a QT, the ich MAY spread to other species that may also be stressed - if they are not stressed, they will be host to the parasite, just like in the wild, but not exhibit outward signs until they are stressed. In essence, you are talking simple eradication of the parasite by way of a QT. Which is cool, but there are other diseases, non-parasitic in nature, that may still cause problems even with the abscense (my gawd I stink at spelling, LOL) of ich, hence the need for a stress-free, as-close-to-natural environment and diet as possible. It's simply a holistic/naturopathic approach that I'm suggesting because it has worked well for me in the past, both personally and as a consultant helping retailers lower their mortality rate and increase their profit margin without raising prices.
Thanks again for the additional input to my reply to this post and more so, thanks for not dissing me for my opinions, being new to the boards and all. I've viewed quite a few of your posts and it's pretty obvious you have a lot of experience and love to help others enjoy this hobby as much as you do... keep up the GREAT work!

 

[srfisher17]

I agree, fish can often be infected with unseen parasites. that's the main reason I always treat fish with Cupramine (copper) & a de-wormer while in QT. I know this is controversial, but I think it would be almost impossible to buy any fish that hadn't been treated with copper somewhere between the reef and our tank. Collectors, shippers, wholesalers, online retailers, and many lfs use it routinely. I have done this for many years, with an incredible number of fish, and find it very safe and effective.I haven't seen any parasites in any of my tanks since I can remember.

 

[jackie dh]

None of the fish that I purchased had Ich, I wouldn't have touched them if they had showed any sign of it. The Purple Tang had just arrived and had only been in the tank about an hour so I felt pretty safe getting it. I was more worried about the stress of being shipped and moved twice in one day than the Ich. I made very sure that when I added the fish to the tank, that I didn't add any water with him other than a wet dip net. I've had the fish about a month now with no sign of Ich, he tends to stay a light purple but is zooming around the tank and eatting like a pig.
The Angel came from their reef tank, which is very healthy and I've never seen any sign of sickness in any of the fish in it and I have checked it weekly for months (can't keep me out of a pet store!) I'll try and get a QT set up again soon, although I don't really plan on buying any more fish for a while, I still need to have one.