miaheatlvr
Active Member
Watching his MEMORIAL, Live here in Miami, Very star studded! Emotional!
Sean Taylor Article
- Thread starter shogun323
- Start date
stdreb27
Active Member
Originally Posted by Rylan1
I agree with you, however; when it comes to black people in particular... there are many other factors that make it harder for them, particularly in previous generations to "do it" as you stated in your post. I am not making excuses or playing any sort of "card" here... I think that some accountablility needs to be taken as Bill Cosby would say... I also believe that other factors are also equally if not more significant in explaining this issue. But that would require another thread.... back to Sean Tayor and Jason Whitlock...
I hope something positive will come out of this loss.
And Jason Whitlock will continue to make a name for himself based on his rhetoricical theories. I so much want to agree with what he is saying, but to me he is wrong much more than he is right.
The only factors are insurmountable are the ones in their head. Black, brown, white or whatever. The problem is people think they are victims facilitated by liberal media, social aid programs, that don't force these people to since or swim. When my grandfather nationalized, he had to sign a waiver so he couldn't recieve welfare, or be "burdon to the state." So he had to swim.
Oh so appearantly the four people arrested, one was the lawn guy, the others had been there for a birthday party. So they guys knew what was going on, it wasn't the color they were going after, but the bling.
I agree with you, however; when it comes to black people in particular... there are many other factors that make it harder for them, particularly in previous generations to "do it" as you stated in your post. I am not making excuses or playing any sort of "card" here... I think that some accountablility needs to be taken as Bill Cosby would say... I also believe that other factors are also equally if not more significant in explaining this issue. But that would require another thread.... back to Sean Tayor and Jason Whitlock...
I hope something positive will come out of this loss.
And Jason Whitlock will continue to make a name for himself based on his rhetoricical theories. I so much want to agree with what he is saying, but to me he is wrong much more than he is right.
The only factors are insurmountable are the ones in their head. Black, brown, white or whatever. The problem is people think they are victims facilitated by liberal media, social aid programs, that don't force these people to since or swim. When my grandfather nationalized, he had to sign a waiver so he couldn't recieve welfare, or be "burdon to the state." So he had to swim.
Oh so appearantly the four people arrested, one was the lawn guy, the others had been there for a birthday party. So they guys knew what was going on, it wasn't the color they were going after, but the bling.
shogun323
Active Member
Originally Posted by Rylan1
The fact he was shot in the leg was the only clue I needed to know that this was not a planned murder.
Gil Grissom....... is this really you? Have you ever shot someone? In fact, have you ever shot a pistol? Do you think most criminals are skilled in marksmanship?
In the end Whitlocks speculation was wrong. However, when I read his article his speculation about his past catching up with him wasn't what struck me. Clearly this case struck a nerve with Whitlock and that nerve is the glorification of the "thug life" and "hip hop" culture which is what he condemned.
The fact he was shot in the leg was the only clue I needed to know that this was not a planned murder.
Gil Grissom....... is this really you? Have you ever shot someone? In fact, have you ever shot a pistol? Do you think most criminals are skilled in marksmanship?
In the end Whitlocks speculation was wrong. However, when I read his article his speculation about his past catching up with him wasn't what struck me. Clearly this case struck a nerve with Whitlock and that nerve is the glorification of the "thug life" and "hip hop" culture which is what he condemned.
rylan1
Active Member
Originally Posted by stdreb27
The only factors are insurmountable are the ones in their head. Black, brown, white or whatever. The problem is people think they are victims facilitated by liberal media, social aid programs, that don't force these people to since or swim. When my grandfather nationalized, he had to sign a waiver so he couldn't recieve welfare, or be "burdon to the state." So he had to swim.
Oh so appearantly the four people arrested, one was the lawn guy, the others had been there for a birthday party. So they guys knew what was going on, it wasn't the color they were going after, but the bling.
i don't think social aid programs are the main problem... i think that is a common idea by some people; however, I think the lack/or opportunity for quality education which includes either a trade or colllege is the main problem. People are not on welfare because they refuse to work... They are on welfare because they can not find a job or do not qualify for a job that will meet the needs of their family. Secondly, most poor households are single parent households and are women... which for one women make less in the country on average and these household only have the one income source.
But I would agree with you in part, I agree that there is a mentality that needs to be overcame; but I also believe that there are societal reasons that can not be discounted or ignored....
The only factors are insurmountable are the ones in their head. Black, brown, white or whatever. The problem is people think they are victims facilitated by liberal media, social aid programs, that don't force these people to since or swim. When my grandfather nationalized, he had to sign a waiver so he couldn't recieve welfare, or be "burdon to the state." So he had to swim.
Oh so appearantly the four people arrested, one was the lawn guy, the others had been there for a birthday party. So they guys knew what was going on, it wasn't the color they were going after, but the bling.
i don't think social aid programs are the main problem... i think that is a common idea by some people; however, I think the lack/or opportunity for quality education which includes either a trade or colllege is the main problem. People are not on welfare because they refuse to work... They are on welfare because they can not find a job or do not qualify for a job that will meet the needs of their family. Secondly, most poor households are single parent households and are women... which for one women make less in the country on average and these household only have the one income source.
But I would agree with you in part, I agree that there is a mentality that needs to be overcame; but I also believe that there are societal reasons that can not be discounted or ignored....
rylan1
Active Member
Originally Posted by shogun323
Gil Grissom....... is this really you? Have you ever shot someone? In fact, have you ever shot a pistol? Do you think most criminals are skilled in marksmanship?
In the end Whitlocks speculation was wrong. However, when I read his article his speculation about his past catching up with him wasn't what struck me. Clearly this case struck a nerve with Whitlock and that nerve is the glorification of the "thug life" and "hip hop" culture which is what he condemned.
No I don't think most criminals are skilled marksman, however; if this was an arranged hit... you would think that it would be by a professional criminal instead of an amateur. There are people who specialize in these things, and I would assume things would have been handled much differently if they were hired. The media was just speculating.. and the reports suggested the total opposite which is was what the police were saying was the motive.
Whitlock has been saying this for a while now, this case just gave him another opportunity to talk about it. As far as the glorification of "thug life" what makes hip hop different from other mediums such as television and cinema? We can watch the Soprano's with anticipation, but condemn hip hop. I personally don't like some of the music out there and I feel like the record exec's are more to blame than the artists. The exec's have control over the music and what is promoted... There is such a variety of rap music out there and what you mention is only a part of it. But I agree with some of what Whitlock says... but music has degraded just like society. The reason why rap has changed is because of a new model that guarantees sales. The music is not created as an expression, but more as an opportunity to make $.
Gil Grissom....... is this really you? Have you ever shot someone? In fact, have you ever shot a pistol? Do you think most criminals are skilled in marksmanship?
In the end Whitlocks speculation was wrong. However, when I read his article his speculation about his past catching up with him wasn't what struck me. Clearly this case struck a nerve with Whitlock and that nerve is the glorification of the "thug life" and "hip hop" culture which is what he condemned.
No I don't think most criminals are skilled marksman, however; if this was an arranged hit... you would think that it would be by a professional criminal instead of an amateur. There are people who specialize in these things, and I would assume things would have been handled much differently if they were hired. The media was just speculating.. and the reports suggested the total opposite which is was what the police were saying was the motive.
Whitlock has been saying this for a while now, this case just gave him another opportunity to talk about it. As far as the glorification of "thug life" what makes hip hop different from other mediums such as television and cinema? We can watch the Soprano's with anticipation, but condemn hip hop. I personally don't like some of the music out there and I feel like the record exec's are more to blame than the artists. The exec's have control over the music and what is promoted... There is such a variety of rap music out there and what you mention is only a part of it. But I agree with some of what Whitlock says... but music has degraded just like society. The reason why rap has changed is because of a new model that guarantees sales. The music is not created as an expression, but more as an opportunity to make $.
stdreb27
Active Member
Originally Posted by Rylan1
i don't think social aid programs are the main problem... i think that is a common idea by some people; however, I think the lack/or opportunity for quality education which includes either a trade or colllege is the main problem. People are not on welfare because they refuse to work... They are on welfare because they can not find a job or do not qualify for a job that will meet the needs of their family. Secondly, most poor households are single parent households and are women... which for one women make less in the country on average and these household only have the one income source.
But I would agree with you in part, I agree that there is a mentality that needs to be overcame; but I also believe that there are societal reasons that can not be discounted or ignored....
I am speaking as a generalization, there are reasons for someone not being able to care for himself or family, the one that is in my head is medical reasons.
I don't know about you, but I've worked with and around people who recieve "the check." It has been my experience (with no scientific evidence) that declining to work is more the case, than not.
on a macro level, if your point was correct why do social service account for sooo much of our federal budget every year and is growing. It anything it should be shrinking.
i don't think social aid programs are the main problem... i think that is a common idea by some people; however, I think the lack/or opportunity for quality education which includes either a trade or colllege is the main problem. People are not on welfare because they refuse to work... They are on welfare because they can not find a job or do not qualify for a job that will meet the needs of their family. Secondly, most poor households are single parent households and are women... which for one women make less in the country on average and these household only have the one income source.
But I would agree with you in part, I agree that there is a mentality that needs to be overcame; but I also believe that there are societal reasons that can not be discounted or ignored....
I am speaking as a generalization, there are reasons for someone not being able to care for himself or family, the one that is in my head is medical reasons.
I don't know about you, but I've worked with and around people who recieve "the check." It has been my experience (with no scientific evidence) that declining to work is more the case, than not.
on a macro level, if your point was correct why do social service account for sooo much of our federal budget every year and is growing. It anything it should be shrinking.
shogun323
Active Member
Originally Posted by Rylan1
As far as the glorification of "thug life" what makes hip hop different from other mediums such as television and cinema? We can watch the Soprano's with anticipation, but condemn hip hop. I personally don't like some of the music out there and I feel like the record exec's are more to blame than the artists. The exec's have control over the music and what is promoted... There is such a variety of rap music out there and what you mention is only a part of it.
You're point here is valid my friend.
But I agree with some of what Whitlock says... but music has degraded just like society. The reason why rap has changed is because of a new model that guarantees sales. The music is not created as an expression, but more as an opportunity to make $.
This is a sad truth. Music is a powerful medium and unfortunately is become just a money machine!!!
As far as the glorification of "thug life" what makes hip hop different from other mediums such as television and cinema? We can watch the Soprano's with anticipation, but condemn hip hop. I personally don't like some of the music out there and I feel like the record exec's are more to blame than the artists. The exec's have control over the music and what is promoted... There is such a variety of rap music out there and what you mention is only a part of it.
You're point here is valid my friend.
But I agree with some of what Whitlock says... but music has degraded just like society. The reason why rap has changed is because of a new model that guarantees sales. The music is not created as an expression, but more as an opportunity to make $.
This is a sad truth. Music is a powerful medium and unfortunately is become just a money machine!!!
rylan1
Active Member
Originally Posted by stdreb27
I am speaking as a generalization, there are reasons for someone not being able to care for himself or family, the one that is in my head is medical reasons.
I don't know about you, but I've worked with and around people who recieve "the check." It has been my experience (with no scientific evidence) that declining to work is more the case, than not.
on a macro level, if your point was correct why do social service account for sooo much of our federal budget every year and is growing. It anything it should be shrinking.
I disagree. Of course there are individuals who don't want to work. Their behavior could probably attributed to them being on drugs, mentally ill, or something. I do however believe that the majority of these people are unable to better their situation because they do not have the skills to do so. McDonald's may be the best they can do? If they do decline to work... its because they can make more in benefits than at a actual job. As far as the federal budget goes... these people are not the people we need to look at cutting off. Our budget in the last 15 years has gone from 2 trillion defecit to 8 trillion. I would make the prediction that there were more people on assistance than due to the drug epidemic that occurred during that time than there is now.
I am speaking as a generalization, there are reasons for someone not being able to care for himself or family, the one that is in my head is medical reasons.
I don't know about you, but I've worked with and around people who recieve "the check." It has been my experience (with no scientific evidence) that declining to work is more the case, than not.
on a macro level, if your point was correct why do social service account for sooo much of our federal budget every year and is growing. It anything it should be shrinking.
I disagree. Of course there are individuals who don't want to work. Their behavior could probably attributed to them being on drugs, mentally ill, or something. I do however believe that the majority of these people are unable to better their situation because they do not have the skills to do so. McDonald's may be the best they can do? If they do decline to work... its because they can make more in benefits than at a actual job. As far as the federal budget goes... these people are not the people we need to look at cutting off. Our budget in the last 15 years has gone from 2 trillion defecit to 8 trillion. I would make the prediction that there were more people on assistance than due to the drug epidemic that occurred during that time than there is now.
stdreb27
Active Member
Originally Posted by Rylan1
I disagree. Of course there are individuals who don't want to work. Their behavior could probably attributed to them being on drugs, mentally ill, or something. I do however believe that the majority of these people are unable to better their situation because they do not have the skills to do so. McDonald's may be the best they can do? If they do decline to work... its because they can make more in benefits than at a actual job. As far as the federal budget goes... these people are not the people we need to look at cutting off. Our budget in the last 15 years has gone from 2 trillion defecit to 8 trillion. I would make the prediction that there were more people on assistance than due to the drug epidemic that occurred during that time than there is now.
Speaking of McDonalds, you know what bugs me are those commercials where they have some mexican in the slums, that gets a job at Micky D's then suddenly their life has meaning and all that. And they say with a thick accent something like "I like McDonalds."
I'm not arguing the total amount of the deficit, I'm simply saying that if they truely couldn't find jobs, ect then that would diminishing instead of increasing.
Sure there are external factors to the situation you live in, they do shape and mold you as a person. The reason I think the way I think is because my grandfather would tell me school is a honor don't waste it. Learn english without an accent. Work hard, and you can do anything. I'm not going to hide that, but the beautiful thing about america, there isn't a class system. You can start with nothing and end up on the top of the pile. And you are celebrated. And I simply think that people don't strive to do that, or believe they can.
The simple term Baby-daddy should help drive my point.
People go after violence on TV just as much as in rap music. It is just rap music's turn for a while.
I disagree. Of course there are individuals who don't want to work. Their behavior could probably attributed to them being on drugs, mentally ill, or something. I do however believe that the majority of these people are unable to better their situation because they do not have the skills to do so. McDonald's may be the best they can do? If they do decline to work... its because they can make more in benefits than at a actual job. As far as the federal budget goes... these people are not the people we need to look at cutting off. Our budget in the last 15 years has gone from 2 trillion defecit to 8 trillion. I would make the prediction that there were more people on assistance than due to the drug epidemic that occurred during that time than there is now.
Speaking of McDonalds, you know what bugs me are those commercials where they have some mexican in the slums, that gets a job at Micky D's then suddenly their life has meaning and all that. And they say with a thick accent something like "I like McDonalds."
I'm not arguing the total amount of the deficit, I'm simply saying that if they truely couldn't find jobs, ect then that would diminishing instead of increasing.
Sure there are external factors to the situation you live in, they do shape and mold you as a person. The reason I think the way I think is because my grandfather would tell me school is a honor don't waste it. Learn english without an accent. Work hard, and you can do anything. I'm not going to hide that, but the beautiful thing about america, there isn't a class system. You can start with nothing and end up on the top of the pile. And you are celebrated. And I simply think that people don't strive to do that, or believe they can.
The simple term Baby-daddy should help drive my point.
People go after violence on TV just as much as in rap music. It is just rap music's turn for a while.
rylan1
Active Member
There is a class system... Rich and Poor. Look at the justice system and you can see there are different rules for people of priveledge.
As far as your comments... yes it is true that you can accomplish a lot if you set your mind to it. I don't know to what extent this still exists, but I have to believe it does happen on some level... teachers have a huge influence on kids and on what they become. I've heard many stories of minority children telling their teachers they want to be an astronaut or whatever and that teacher then suggesting they be a mechanic or a tradesman because those are good jobs... This happens with parents as well... I think people shoot down the dreams of their kids because they either believe they can't achieve them because they didn't or because of the belief the are incapable due to their race or situation.
I've recently heard of a drug dealer who had an IQ of 162, and dropped out of school at 14. He made millions, but talk about a loss of potential.
By the way, McDonalds runs those commercials that cater to different races. I've never seen a Hispanic one, but I live in Ohio... I've seen the others though.
As far as your comments... yes it is true that you can accomplish a lot if you set your mind to it. I don't know to what extent this still exists, but I have to believe it does happen on some level... teachers have a huge influence on kids and on what they become. I've heard many stories of minority children telling their teachers they want to be an astronaut or whatever and that teacher then suggesting they be a mechanic or a tradesman because those are good jobs... This happens with parents as well... I think people shoot down the dreams of their kids because they either believe they can't achieve them because they didn't or because of the belief the are incapable due to their race or situation.
I've recently heard of a drug dealer who had an IQ of 162, and dropped out of school at 14. He made millions, but talk about a loss of potential.
By the way, McDonalds runs those commercials that cater to different races. I've never seen a Hispanic one, but I live in Ohio... I've seen the others though.
stdreb27
Active Member
Originally Posted by Rylan1
I've recently heard of a drug dealer who had an IQ of 162, and dropped out of school at 14. He made millions, but talk about a loss of potential.
By the way, McDonalds runs those commercials that cater to different races.
Well I dunno, quick money, if you have no morals and enjoy a rush. It would make sense to me.
Did you see Chapelle's spoof of those commericals?
I've recently heard of a drug dealer who had an IQ of 162, and dropped out of school at 14. He made millions, but talk about a loss of potential.
By the way, McDonalds runs those commercials that cater to different races.
Well I dunno, quick money, if you have no morals and enjoy a rush. It would make sense to me.
Did you see Chapelle's spoof of those commericals?