should I buy this?

[daisy]

So I'm setting up my 58 gallon, and I want to do it right. My LFS guy is usually great, I just want to run this by you all and get some imput. All I have is the tank and the cabinet -- here's what he wants to sell to me:
Maxi Reef 200 w/d
Mag 7 pump
tubes and returns
80 Lb LS
25 Watt UV sterilizer
Sea Clone 150 with pump
200 watt heater
thermometer, salt
hood with two 36" 65 Watt PCs and one 10,000K MH bulb on two ballasts
He wants $1500 and will come in and set it all up for me. Please let me know as soon as possible what you all think. Here is what I think -- I know w/d is not in with everyone, but I want the equipment under the tank, and this seems like a good way to do it. I think the UV may not be necessary. I'd like to have a reef with different types of corals as well as a few fish, so I know lighting is key -- is this lighting good enough to support many types of corals?
Thanks again!
tahl

 

[cmack]

I don't have a lot of experience, but from what I've read this is how i see it...
1. You probably dont need the UV sterilizer
2. MH lighting in that size tank can support just about any coral or clam you can throw at it, (it may actually be too strong for some soft corrals)
3. If you can find it in your area, buy some Southdown sand from Home Depot and seed it with Live Sand. Much cheeper in the long run...
Again, I dont have as much experience as most others on this board, so everyone else Please correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[cmack]

by the way, I was able to get Southdown by me, and Im in Westchester...If you feel like taking a drive, I can tell you where I found it.

 

[a_fender69]

The UV steralizer will not be a good edition for a reef tank.
Lights are good for a coral reef
You should only put about 1/2 to 1 inch of substrate on the bottom. Live sand is good, crushed coral is outdated, not natural, and a pain to clean.
Heater may/may not be Necessary. The water in your tank will generaly stay 5-10 degrees colder than room temp. So the water in your tank needs to be between 74-78, figure it out. Also, heaters can be added at any time so it is not mandatory.
you might save some money but setting it up yourself. It really isn't that hard

 

[crazy4reefs]

i think if you live in nyc you will need a heater....
just my 2 cents...

 

[pb here]

Wow. That's a lot of stuff he wants to sell you.
Just my advice, and I am by no means an expert but here is what I did to save tons of money.
Like others have said, at this time you have no need for the UV.
I would go with with four 65 watt PC's instead of the MH for that size tank. I would recommend Hellolights.com and do it yourself.
50 or so lbs. of LR will be enough, especially if you go with a deep sandbed.
I could never get Southdown PS here in B'ham so I used Premium PS from Home Depot. I used three bags and topped it off with one bag of LS. I have had zero problems from it. I have about a 5" deep sand bed in my 75 gal.
I built my own stand and canopy too.
That should save you quite a chunk of change. Good luck.

 

[daisy]

Okay, no UV. Any body else think the MH will overpower the tank? It is deep both front-to-back and top-to-bottom, so I want to make sure I have enough light to support clams, corals.
Cmac, I am in Westchester and would love to find southdown -- couldn't find it at HDepot on the thruway in Yonkers. My email is tahl@mindspring.com -- please write me and let me know where you found it!
The other thing -- he does not want me to do the dsb, but I really want to. I want lots of LR so my reef will look reef-like. Also, I'd love to build up a 'pod population enough to support a mandarin. Eventually...
tahl

 

[eelfreakrobi]

From what I have heard I wouldnt recommend the uv for a reef period, it makes water clear and pretty and can kill parasite or whatever, but it also kills beneficial bacteria for the reefs. IMO I would get that setup looks very good to me and get the uv sterilizer but dont set it up in your tank, sell it in the trading and classifieds or any other place and youll save money for other cool stuff.

 

[broomer5]

daisy
That list of equipment would not be my choice for setting up a reef tank.
In my opinion:
Don't need the wet dry.
Don't need the UV
Don't need the SeaClone Skimmer.
Don't need the 80 lbs live sand.
If this was my tank - I would consider spending my money as follows.
Inexpensive sump to hold a "good" quality in sump skimmer.
MagDrives are good pumps.
LifeReef Prefilter/Overflow
Two heaters instead of one.
Dry aragonite sand - possibly seeded with live sand
OR
Dry aragonite sand seeded with LIVE ROCK
Research your lighting options. Lighting is KEY
What are the dimensions of your tank and stand ?

 

[mlm]

Whats the wattage on the halide? Instead of getting the wet/dry just make a sump out of a tank or a rubbermaid container. The pump is good for that size tank. I would do VHO from hellolights if you can fit them. They are better and cheaper/easier to find in the long run than PCs IMHO. I you get the halide then you can just get two actinic VHO bulbs. Forget about the UV and get the DSB. The seaclone is good for the money and it will work great on a tank that size.

 

[daisy]

Broomer, and anyone else -- the tank is 36" long, 18"front to back and 21"top to bottom. The stand is (obviously) 36" long, 18" front to back and 32" tall.
Would you not go with a dsb?
What would you consider a "good" in-sump skimmer?
I've been researching my lighting options for so long that I am totally confused. I have no idea whether I should get VHO Metal Halides, PCs, what? And moreover, I already have a hood (useless, I assume) that has a fitting for only one bulb, and I'm a scientist, but not an engineer at all, so I can't fathom how to situate the bulbs above my tank, how to hook them up. I feel totally confused on this score. HELP!
thanks.

 

[daisy]

Okay, so I put a 20L under my tank, what do I do with it? I want to have heater(s), skimmer, anything else in it? Can it be sectioned off so that part of it is a fuge, or would that be a different tank somewhere else that I would have to figure out some way to attach it to the 20L?
I need a pump to get the water into the sump and another one to get the water back into the tank, right? Where do I go to look for how to do this? And if I DIY, who will tell me that I have done it properly and that I will not flood my livingroom and the three co-op apartments below me?
I feel ridiculously ill-equipped to do this, and I've been researching it for soooooo long.
tahl

 

[a&m aggie 04']

is your tank drilled??? If the glass isnt tempered id have it drilled, if it is tempered shouldnt try to drill it. I just dont like having overflows on my tank.
or are you using an overflow???
Gravity will feed the water into the sump, but you'll need a pump to get the water back up, i have a 58 and im using a Mag 3 as a return.

 

[xxvietxjustinxx]

just build a sump with a GOOD, REALLY GOOD SKIMMER... a seaclone sucks since i have used it.. go with ets or euro reef, or just some other brand because me and seaclone really did suck alot..

 

[fishfood]

i have a 55 tub or might be 58 that wasn't tempered and got it drilled. My tank is probably the same size as yours daisy.
Here is what i have
lights: icecap 3 bulb vho two super actinic one 50/50 i think and a 175 mh. You could go with a dual bulb vs the 3 bulbs. I got the vho's first and then upgraded. Looks a lot better with the single mh in the middle of the tank. You still get shaded areas for low light coral and get a great ripple effect if you have a ph or the return flow churning up the surface.
sump/fuge: 20gal tank divided by acrylic. 15 or 20 watt plant grow light in the fuge side. I pump the water from the sump side to the fuge side with a pump that came with the bucket of instant ocean salt.
Find the sd sand. It will allow you to put your money into the lights or have DvSkin help set the thing up and maybe build a canopy for the lights. Or find a someone who works with wood to help do it if you are unabel.
I'd say 3 bags of sd for the tank and fuge and then about 10 lbs or so of ls to seed it.
I have about 65 lbs of lr in my tank and about 25 of it was just dead base rock which is now cover in coralline and as alive as can be.
Forget the uv unless you want to put it on your qt.
I have 3 maxi jet 1200 for circulation in the tank. I don't know if it is too much but my return doesn't have much power and is used to keep the surface aggitated.
I have a mag 7 for the return and it works fine but i have it split at the surface which reduces the preasure and thus the return is slower.
I have 2 heaters. One in the overflow and one in the sump.
you might need one fan in the hood if you go with the mh.

 

[daisy]

okay, now we're talking...
I totally do need someone's help in person to set the thing up. I'm just north of NYC -- DvSkin, you really serious about helping me? If so, please email me at tahl@mindspring.com
It's an oceanic, and while it's not drilled, the top of the cabinet upon which it sits is covered with wood except for the back left corner, which has a rectangular cut-out -- so I imagine they expect me to drill the bottom there, right? Who does this for me?
An overflow? hmmmm... is that the box inside the tank on some tanks? Whatever it is, I don't have one on my 55-gal, and the new tank is just four walls of glass at this point.
I have to tell you that I've been keeping fish since high school. I've bred FW fish. I've had SW for a little over 2 years. And I feel like a dunce trying to set up this tank. In the mean time, though, all of my friends are in total awe of me and my sw tank because all they know is that it is too complicated to even bother trying... what is the message here?

 

[daisy]

Aggie, You have my tank. How do you like your lights? Do you wish you had a MH? Can you have clams in your tank?
Fishfood, if you could do the lights over again, what would you buy now? Are your lights on two ballasts so you can do the dawn/dusk thing? Did you make the hood yourself? I'm not an electrician, and I am terrified of burning down my building. How do I get it all over my tank safely?

 

[fishfood]

I run my vho's from 11 to 10 and my mh from 2 to 7. I'm slowly increasing the mh because it is a new bulb. I wouldn't do anything different on that tank(lighting wise). I like the vho/mh mixture. My stuff glows in the morning and night when the vhos are on by themselves and the mh allows me to keep clams and other higher light corals. What i would do over is get a better skimmer. My lights are on two seperate ballasts. One is sitting on the hood and the there is mounted in the stand since it has the quick release plugs. The one on the hood is hidden by a plant. I bought the hood/stand and tank together.
One other thing that i'm still working on is finding the bulb that i like for my mh. I am on my second one and like the old one better. My tank looked flat and motionless with the vho and then when i added the mh things just looked more alive.

 

[daisy]

Fishfood,
what skimmer do you have, what skimmer would you rather have, and where do you have the skimmer?
Will I have to build a hood for the lights I want? or does Oceanic make a hood that matches the cabinet I bought from them. (If they are selling "reef-ready" tanks, why do they come with lousy hoods?)
Any chance you can describe or take and send a pic of the light hood? Where does the MH sit? So there are three bulbs, two are the actinic 50/50, and one 175 W plus the MH? Is this in a standard hood, or did you build it?
And where is the overflow? Again, a picture would be good. Is it part of the under-the-tank stuff, or is it in the tank? I don't have anything in the tank -- should I?

 

[daisy]

Dumb, dumb, dumb question -- (though I feel like they all are at this point) Do all these bulbs look the same? I mean, do they all look like the tube of glass that connects to the ends of the hood on both sides? So when we talk about three bulbs, we're talking about three parallel bulbs?
I sound like a total idiot, but for some reason I had in mind that the MH bulbs were round. Please tell me they are not, and I can start to imagine how this will actually work.
So when you say, fishfood, that you have three bulbs, you have in parallel, an actinic, a MH and an actinic, yes?