So I started a tank over a week ago

theskeptic

theskeptic

New Member
I started a saltwater tank over a week ago. My local fish store person told me it is possible to cycle a tank with fish. I have 3 clownfish in my tank now, along with some live rock and I do water level tests regularly. Everything seems to be looking well except I have traceable amounts of ammonia, this is scaring me. Recently I did a 50% water change and noticed that there is still ammonia in my tank, I was told that this is because it is going through its cycle, and that I shouldn’t be doing water changes…That seems kind of fishy to me (pun intended) can anyone help?
 
slice

slice

Active Member
Welcome to the site!
Prepare yourself for hard times ahead. Please be "TheSkeptic" when being given advice from your LFS.
I would advise you to do some research on establishing the cycle in your tank, AFTER you save the lives of your clowns by returning them to the store.
Search this site for threads regarding good practice during the initial cycle.
Good luck!
 
mmstillwell01

mmstillwell01

Member
+1

Imagine for a moment that you are given a sterile glass box. Now fill that glass box with saltwater. It’s pretty isn’t it? The water virtually sparkles because it is so clean and clear and crisp. Now imagine heading down to the local fish store and buying a True Percula Clownfish and putting it in your glass box. At first the clownfish seems quite happy, but then, it starts not to look so good. What’s happening?

A Sterile Marine Aquarium is Not a Good Aquarium
The truth of the matter is that your clownfish is poisoning itself with its own waste. A sterile marine tank is, in fact, the worst kind of tank. In a mature (or “cycled”) tank, beneficial bacteria break down fish waste before it reaches toxic levels. While you still need to perform regular maintenance and use a reliable filtration system, the fully cycled tank is a much more stable environment



[*]
Although so people will tell you to cycle your tank by adding a hardy fish such as a damsel, don’t do it. While the fish may survive, such a practice is archaic and is really nothing short of torture.
 
monsinour

monsinour

Active Member
Its going to take a while to get your tank up and running ready for fish. If you insist to leave them in the tank, you will be doing constant water changes to keep up on the ammonia buildup. I would say that you would need to be doing about 25 to 50% water changes frequintly if you are going to keep the fish in the tank. It took me about 3 to 4 weeks before I was able to add fish into the tank and then I waited one extra week to be safe.
 
theskeptic

theskeptic

New Member
I tried to return them and they gave me some excuse about not taking them back because they are not sure of the parasites in my water. So now I have to house these poor guys and I just feel f*cking awful. How regularly should i be doing the 25 to 50% water changes? wont this start the cycle back over? This was a very unskeptical move on my end. Thanks for the help.
 
slice

slice

Active Member
Don't beat yourself up, but please do plenty of research.
Returning livestock to a reputable LFS for store credit is standard practice. Hopefully, you can find a reputable one nearby.
What you were told is complete BS. The only possible parasites you may have came from the fish they sold you.
As for your other questions, do your research. (not trying to avoid answering you, but you will learn more doing it yourself)
 
monsinour

monsinour

Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheSkeptic http:///forum/thread/381595/so-i-started-a-tank-over-a-week-ago#post_3324715
I tried to return them and they gave me some excuse about not taking them back because they are not sure of the parasites in my water. So now I have to house these poor guys and I just feel f*cking awful. How regularly should i be doing the 25 to 50% water changes? wont this start the cycle back over? This was a very unskeptical move on my end. Thanks for the help.
It wont start the cycle over as you are still going through the cycle. There are chemicals out there that will make the ammonia less toxic for your fish. However I do not know if this chemical will prevent the buildup of the benefical bacteria you need to take care of the ammonia on a normal basis. The water changes? I have no idea how frequintly you should do them. I would do them every day myself. Probably 25% everyday if I could.
 
reefaholic33

reefaholic33

Member
Another thing to point out 3 clownfish are not likely to work. You need to find a home for 1 atleast and if you can all 3 for now till we get your cycle worked out. The more water changes you do the better right now.
 
hookem0981

hookem0981

Member
I know this is not what you are wanting to hear, but you need to take the clownfish back. The only thing that you might be able to cycle with is damsels, but I wouldn't even recommend torturing a fish for that.. here's what you do...
Go out and buy some live rock.. get some fresh shrimp and cut it up to cycle the tank.. make sure you keep track of water parameters and settings... Like the guy before me said, a sterile tank is not a good one. It will take some time, but don't rush it.. rushing it only leads to other problems... such as diseases.
Wait approx.. 4-6 weeks.. then check to make sure your nitrates/nitrites are 0, make sure your ammonia level is also 0.
Some things to consider.. so you don't make the mistakes I did.. don't get a cheap skimmer.. do not waste your money on that. I was using a piece of crap skimmer for 5 months.. and my terrible water quality led to an outbreak of ich.. and if you know anything about aquariums, ich is bad stuff.. get a good skimmer.. since i got my ASM G2 for my 75 gal, my fish are finally where i want them. Good luck..
and remember, if your LFS told you to use clownfish to cycle a tank.. that just tells you how much they know about the hobby.. so don't listen to a damn thing they say.
 
slice

slice

Active Member
This is another reason I recommended the OP to do their own research, hopefully from an acknowledged expert, instead of reading 40 different versions from 40 posters and confusing the reader.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hookem0981 http:///forum/thread/381595/so-i-started-a-tank-over-a-week-ago#post_3324746
I know this is not what you are wanting to hear, but you need to take the clownfish back. The only thing that you might be able to cycle with is damsels, but I wouldn't even recommend torturing a fish for that.. here's what you do...
Go out and buy some live rock.. get some fresh shrimp and cut it up to cycle the tank.. make sure you keep track of water parameters and settings... Like the guy before me said, a sterile tank is not a good one. It will take some time, but don't rush it.. rushing it only leads to other problems... such as diseases.
Wait approx.. 4-6 weeks.. then check to make sure your nitrates/nitrites are 0, make sure your ammonia level is also 0.
Some things to consider.. so you don't make the mistakes I did.. don't get a cheap skimmer.. do not waste your money on that. I was using a piece of crap skimmer for 5 months.. and my terrible water quality led to an outbreak of ich.. and if you know anything about aquariums, ich is bad stuff.. get a good skimmer.. since i got my ASM G2 for my 75 gal, my fish are finally where i want them. Good luck..
and remember, if your LFS told you to use clownfish to cycle a tank.. that just tells you how much they know about the hobby.. so don't listen to a damn thing they say.
^THIS^ is not quite right.
Most folks do not cut up the shrimp. Some even put it in a filter sock or net for easy disposal when the shrimp has done it's task (sometimes before the shrimp has completely decomposed).
DO NOT simply wait 4-6 weeks. Take daily tests (or at least every other day) to monitor and verify when/how the cycle is progressing.
You will NOT see nitrate go to 0 when the cycle is established. You will see an Ammonia spike (rise and fall), then a Nitrite spike, then a rise in Nitrates that will stay high until it is removed
by some means, usually by water changes. One should monitor this process to be sure if/when it has happened.
This site has wonderful resources, but unfortunately, a recent "upgrade" has made finding them difficult.
PLEASE read this and google for other sources:
http://saltaquarium.about.com/cs/bionitrogencycle/a/aa073199.htm
 
hookem0981

hookem0981

Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slice http:///forum/thread/381595/so-i-started-a-tank-over-a-week-ago#post_3324763
This is another reason I recommended the OP to do their own research, hopefully from an acknowledged expert, instead of reading 40 different versions from 40 posters and confusing the reader.
^THIS^ is not quite right.
Most folks do not cut up the shrimp. Some even put it in a filter sock or net for easy disposal when the shrimp has done it's task (sometimes before the shrimp has completely decomposed).
DO NOT simply wait 4-6 weeks. Take daily tests (or at least every other day) to monitor and verify when/how the cycle is progressing.
You will NOT see nitrate go to 0 when the cycle is established. You will see an Ammonia spike (rise and fall), then a Nitrite spike, then a rise in Nitrates that will stay high until it is removed
by some means, usually by water changes. One should monitor this process to be sure if/when it has happened.
This site has wonderful resources, but unfortunately, a recent "upgrade" has made finding them difficult.
PLEASE read this and google for other sources:
http://saltaquarium.about.com/cs/bionitrogencycle/a/aa073199.htm
what does it matter, the shrimp turns to decay.. it turns into pure bacteria and decomposes.... after about 8 days, theres nothing left to remove
 
deejeff442

deejeff442

Active Member
also bad water and a cheap skimmer dont cause ich.
i havnt ran a skimmer on any of my 3 tanks for years and my water tests perfect.
 
spanko

spanko

Active Member
First of all Clownfish and Damsels both come from the family Pomacentridae. I point this out because it is possible to perform the initial cycle with a clownfish as they are a hardy fish. This is not advisable as there are better ways to cycle without harming fish but it can be done. Your task will be to keep the ammonia levels closer to .2, not 2 - .2. and to do water changes of at least 50% when you see it reach that level. A 50% water change is only going to bring the lever back down to .1 so you can see you are going to be testing and changing water very often. Eventually you biofiltration, nitrifying bacteria will populate the tank in sufficient quantity to handle the bioload of the fisn, their wast and their left over food. This is a daunting task in that the fishes health is of the main concern here and ammonia is extremely toxic to them. I encourage you to do a google search for ammonia poisoning and see what the fish may go through and the symptoms to watch out for. Your best bet here is to find someone to hold these fish for you until you can get you tank setup and matured some. Good luck to you and whatever direction you choose to go.
 
tlsohio

tlsohio

Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slice http:///forum/thread/381595/so-i-started-a-tank-over-a-week-ago#post_3324763
This is another reason I recommended the OP to do their own research, hopefully from an acknowledged expert, instead of reading 40 different versions from 40 posters and confusing the reader.
^THIS^ is not quite right.
Most folks do not cut up the shrimp. Some even put it in a filter sock or net for easy disposal when the shrimp has done it's task (sometimes before the shrimp has completely decomposed).
DO NOT simply wait 4-6 weeks. Take daily tests (or at least every other day) to monitor and verify when/how the cycle is progressing.
You will NOT see nitrate go to 0 when the cycle is established. You will see an Ammonia spike (rise and fall), then a Nitrite spike, then a rise in Nitrates that will stay high until it is removed
by some means, usually by water changes. One should monitor this process to be sure if/when it has happened.
This site has wonderful resources, but unfortunately, a recent "upgrade" has made finding them difficult.
PLEASE read this and google for other sources:
http://saltaquarium.about.com/cs/bionitrogencycle/a/aa073199.htm
+1
 
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