Start up costs

jimmyd

jimmyd

New Member
Hi all,
I'm hoping to be new to this hobby soon. I'm realistically about 2 years out (need to buy a house that can fit the tank) which gives me plenty of time for research... so I figure I'll start now.
This is probably a common question, but after a quick search I think the last time it was looked at thoroughly was at least a couple years ago (maybe prices/technology have changes since then). How much does it cost to start up a saltwater tank?
Below is my first take at what I think I'll need to start up a saltwater tank, and the costs associated with each item. My research was pretty quick and dirty. I'm hoping some of you can take a look and see if I'm missing anything or if my prices are way off base.
A few quick notes:
- Definitely am thinking acrylic over glass... could maybe bump up to 90 gallons
- Not 100% decided on the fauna yet, but what's below is my first opinion of what I want
- I'm still not really sure what live rock is other than having beneficial bacteria
- Not sure if live rock has lighting requirements or anything
- Not too sure about live rock supplements either
- I may want to setup a reef, but I'm a little nervous about any extra up-keep (I know there would be extra cost)
- I currently keep a 20 gallon, planted, freshwater aquarium so I'm well versed in general care & maintenance (e.g. weekly water changes, daily supplements, etc)




Item



Price



High Price



Low Price







75 Gallon Acrylic Tank



$ 600



$ 800



$ 500







Wooden Tank Stand



$ 500















High Output Lighting



$ 200



$ 500



$ 150







Fauna Total:



$ 155















- Clownfish (2)



$ 30













- Blue Hippo Tang



$ 35

d>








- Copper Band Butterfly



$ 35















- Shrimp (3)



$ 40















- Snails (3)



$ 15















Live Rock (80 lbs)



$ 180















Live Rock Supplements



$ 20















Canister Filter



$ 150



$ 400



$ 90







Protein Skimmer



$ 150



$ 300



$ 60







Salt



$ 20



$ 30



$ 15







Sand



$ 70



$80



$ 70







Water Testing Kit



$ 20















Heaters (2)



$ 100















Refractometer



$ 60



$ 115



$ 50







RO/DI Kit



$ 200



$ 400



$ 100







Grounding Probe



$ 20













Total:

B2:B5)" x:num="2445">
$ 2,445








Any insight is much appreciated!
Thanks,
Jim
 
monsinour

monsinour

Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmyd http:///forum/thread/383981/start-up-costs#post_3361871




Item



Price



High Price



Low Price







75 Gallon Acrylic Tank



$ 600



$ 800



$ 500







Wooden Tank Stand



$ 500















High Output Lighting



$ 200



$ 500



$ 150







Fauna Total:



$ 155















- Clownfish (2)



$ 30















- Blue Hippo Tang



$ 35















- Copper Band Butterfly



$ 35















- Shrimp (3)



$ 40















- Snails (3)



$ 15















Live Rock (80 lbs)



$ 180











Live Rock Supplements


$ 20













Canister Filter



$ 150



$ 400



$ 90







Protein Skimmer



$ 150



$ 300



$ 60







Salt



$ 20



$ 30



$ 15







Sand



$ 70



$80



$ 70







Water Testing Kit



$ 20















Heaters (2)



$ 100















Refractometer



$ 60



$ 115



$ 50







RO/DI Kit



$ 200



$ 400



$ 100







Grounding Probe



$ 20















Total:



$ 2,445











Any insight is much appreciated!
Thanks,
Jim
tank - go glass, its cheaper and more scratch resistant. Unless you can make your own acrylic tank, hey we are all not as capable as Shawn or Al, the savings with glass is worth it. You can save even more $ by looking on your local bobs list site.
stand - yea, you will probably need one of those, LOL/
Lights - This is where most people scrimp and end up paying for it later, like me. You should get the best possible lights that you can afford even if you are thinking no corals now but corals later.
livestock - CBB are hard to keep in a tank. I wanted one when I started but was advised against it. You can try it, but keep your eye on it. Snails - someone suggested a 1 snail per gallon rule, but I think thats too many. As long as you have a good mix of snails, you can get away with less than 1 per gallon.
LR - might want more than 80 lbs of rock. And where are you finding it for $2.50 a pound? I hope that its good rock. General rule for rock is 1.5 to 2 lbs per gallon. What are the live rock suppliments? I didnt think rocks grew, LOL.
Canister filter - unless its a fluval, i wouldnt get it. There are some newer models that have loads of features on them. I stayed away from canisters because I wanted a sump/fuge.
Protien skimmer - you might want a better unit than what you can get for $150. Being that you dont have a sump, you are kind of limiting yourself to a HOB skimmer.
salt - i just bought a bag of salt for a 50 gallon mix up (would have mixed to 1.020 and not strong enough for my liking) for $25. Gonna want to up the price for inital purchase of salt.
Sand - since you are getting LR, you wont need live sand. you can get dead bagged sand and have the LR seed it. If you have a LFS near you, ask them for a scoop of thier sand from their fuge. If they are a cool LFS, this should happen and cost no more than $5. You can use this scoop to seed your sand.
test kit - make sure its the mini chemistry kind and not the test strips. API makes a good test kit for starters and I think they are $30 or a shade less.
heaters - having 2 is good incase one were to break. I recomend Jager heaters but I dont think you can get 2 for your tank under $50.
refractometer - yop, you need one of these. Which reminds me, I need to get one too.
RO/DI - here is where you can save $ by purchasing RO water from someplace. I get mine from sprawlmart for $0.37 a gallon. When i have some spare $ i will get an RO/DI unit. But in this house, spare $ doesnt exist.
Grounding probe - not offering an opinion on this. Someone else will chime in on it.
For me, I know it cost a little over $1K for me to start my tank and get it up and ready for its first additions. I think i have spent half that since I added my first critters to the tank. In this forum you can find my thread for my 56 gallon column style tank and see what all I have done.
 
superman

superman

Member
Just on the brief side...Live rock is a natural filtration system for the tank. You are right that there are beneficial bacteria which allow for filtration to take place. It also brings a lot of interesting micro fauna to the system, and the occasional mystery guest. On some occasions there can be bad hitchikers on the rock such as predatory crabs or mantis shrimp. As for the size of the tank, you said 90 was a possibility and I think you should consider this. Two reasons: 1. The hippo tank will be much happier with you in a larger system and 2. (Every aquarist will tell you this) Get the bigger tank, because you will always want a bigger tank. When you have that 75g set up you will find yourself thinking, 'if only i had a little more room for this.' As for the copperband butterfly, I would advise staying away from that for a while. They have very specific diets and often will not accept prepared and frozen foods, can be very difficult to acclimate, and are best suited to mature and well established aquariums. As for your decision of FOWLR vs. Reef, they both have benefits and I would advise some more research into both. I really hope you have a good experience in the hobby. Good luck and keep us posted!
 
acrylic51

acrylic51

Active Member
Honestly it's hard to put together a good price list of what the actual cost will/would be....My biggest thing is research all your purchases extensively before hand.....You'll get a lot of different opinions and don't rely solely on product reviews.....If it means you have to put the purchase off a couple weeks that is the best thing. Spend your money on the best you can afford; don't buy just to get it over with, because in the end you'll wind up spending more money to replace poor quality equipment with better......
As far as some of your prices on equipment....Test kits your a bit low.....RO/DI a bit low, skimmer is another area your a bit low, and wouldn't skimp in that area personally. Lighting is low, and as mentioned earlier to buy the best you can afford.
As far as glass vs acrylic.....Well that can be debated till the "cows come home", but it all comes down to personal choice. Both have their advantages and disadvantages.....So basically 1 technically isn't better than the other, but I'd say the biggest advantage to acrylic is the ability to drill if you choose to, definitely clearer than glass, better insulator, and lighter. The issue with scratching IMHO is "iffy"......The scratches can be buffed out, so don't let that discourage you, but it does scratch.
My manners are lacking a bit, but WELCOME!!!!!!
 
2quills

2quills

Well-Known Member
Yep and you're going to need flow inside the tank so you may want to tack on at least 2 power heads but I'd go with 4. And don't forget the tax. :p
 
cam78

cam78

Active Member
Craigslist should help you out a lot. SOme people give stuff away on there. And its new stuff. Good thing about this hobby is people get in and out real quick!!!
 
saltfan

saltfan

Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by CAM78 http:///forum/thread/383981/start-up-costs#post_3362125
Craigslist should help you out a lot. SOme people give stuff away on there. And its new stuff. Good thing about this hobby is people get in and out real quick!!!
+1. Also, just off top of my head here, $3500 to $4000 is a reasonable price for everything new, and good stuff that you won't have to replace in the first month its running. =) Also, I'd go with glass also, not very likely your going to scratch it up while cleaning it for years. Acrylic on the other hand has to be buffed every so often, or you get nice ugly looking scratches in them. And they get hazy for that reason. But just my 2cents
 
florida joe

florida joe

Well-Known Member
Am I mistaken or not? You are not researching the fundamentals of keeping a marine aquarium but you are researching the prices of equipment you will need TWO YEARS down the road
 
saltfan

saltfan

Active Member
Start up is the killer, not the maintenance of the daily use, if you ask me. =) But what the hell I know.
 
1snapple

1snapple

Active Member
I agree w/ above statement.
I will get a list together today and post prices, add all together, everything and that should get you a good price estimate.
I would/ will do a 90g tank
No animals/ critters. (i don't recommend having a hippo in anything under a 150g/ 125g tank because of length and height.)
 
1snapple

1snapple

Active Member
Tank and stand - used (craigslist) $200
High Output DIY LED - $500
Live rock - 120lbs @ $7 a pound. $840
"Dead" sand - 120lbs $105
Sump - $300
Bio balls- $12
Reef Octopus Skimmer 150 - $190
UV Sterilizer - $270
Refractometer - $40
Test kit - $50 - $60
RO/DI unit - $160
Total = $2677
 
aaane

aaane

New Member
Hey Jim,
selling my saltwater reef tank 55gl with customized stand and top due to moving out of state. Have Fiji live rock, clownfish with anemone, live sand, starfish etc. Live in Las Vergas. Sell everything for $500! That's an awesome deal copared to the start up costs.
In case anyone is interested plz reply, have only 4 weeks left.
Thanks
 
snowflakeclown

snowflakeclown

Member
Welcome to the hobby and the boards.
I have a firm opinion on this. You should never start saltwater unless you are willing, and can afford, to do it right. I don't think their is really any skimping on the costs. I have done it the cheap way and it ends up costing you more in the end when you lose everything. I started a tank in January, yes I went all out, but it was the right way to do it. Let me see if I can recall my expenses, totally about $7000.00 + so far and counting ......

  • 55 Gallon Marineland tank kit (tank, hob filter, stealth heater, led moonlights) - $175.00 (I did not use anything except the tank and led moonlights)

  • Stand - $160.00 - It is ok, but I would have bought something more open in the bottom if I did it again.

  • Wavepoint HO T5 4 bulb, 56w a piece $300.00 - You can keep anything with these lights. (Great system)

  • Glass tops - $30.00

  • Live Sand , 60 pounds (Bag Retail Type) - $75.00

  • Live Rock , 80 pounds (Need More) - $275.00

  • Sump, Bio Balls, Skimmer, Overflow - $400.00

  • Pumps for Sump (3) - $210.00

  • Coralife UV 18 Watt - $150.00
    APC Battery Backup - $200.00
    Power Surge Strips - $100.00
    Test Kits - $75.00
    Koralia Power Head - $70.00
    Generac 5500 Watt Generator - $750.00
    Foods, Supplements, Algae Scrappers, Salt, Plumbing, etc. - $1500.00 - Yes this is expensive if you do it right
    RO/DI - $300.00
    Fish, Corals, etc. - $2500.00 - This is the expensive part, up to your wants and desires.
I still haven't listed everything I have bought and my 7k price is probably low. Did I go all out? Pretty much, but in the end if you want your set up to live, you have to. Do you need an APC battery backup or a generator to begin? No not really, but if you have a power outage, kiss all your stuff goodbye if you are not home and don't have a way to aerate and heat the water.
The RO/DI system is a must, tap water will work, but it is horrible and causes a lot of problems. Lighting is also a must, I am thinking of switching my HO T5's to LED, but my Wavepoint system is incredible and my corals, live rock, etc. are flourishing.
I am forgetting a lot of things I have bought, but you get the point. The best way is to make a list over a week or so and just buy and check off.
I cycled in 24 hours, most will say that is impossible to do, but it is not. My system has been up almost 2 months now and is rock solid with perfect parameters. Here is a pic of the inhabitants.
 
jimmyd

jimmyd

New Member
Hey everybody,
Sorry I fell off the face of the earth for a few days. Thanks for all the advice... I definitely have a good sense now of what things will cost and what to start looking into. There were definitely a few eye openers.
Florida Joe - Yes I'm looking for prices today of what I'll need two years down the road. Is this a problem? Do you think prices will move considerably? You seem very concerned about this point. I currently live in a very smally apartment that can't fit much more than a 20 gallon tank. I'm planning on moving in a couple of years and am really excited about the prospect of starting up a saltwater tank. In my experience with freshwater, the more research you can do up front the better.. so I figured I might as well start looking into things and see if it's something I'm even going to be able to afford. I hope that doesn't bother you too much.
Monsinour - I had the same thoughts about live rock, but had to ask anyway. I found this site with rock for $2 per pound that mentions lighting and supplements for the rock. I'm still a bit confused about why rocks would need supplements and light :) http://www.***********.com/product/prod_display.cfm?c=393+2392&pcatid=2392
Question about the RO/DI water... if I bought it from a store (let's say I got a 90 gallon tank) wouldn't that be about $16 of water each week? Or do you not do 50% water changes with saltwater tanks? Carrying 45 gallons of water from the store to home each week could get a bit tiring. Weekly 50% water changes would end up costing over $830 a year.
2Quils - Good point about the power heads. I'll look into those.
Well, I'm feeling a bit overwhelmed. There's quite a bit to look into here. This is definitely going to hit my checking account pretty hard. Thanks again for all the info so far. Maybe I can look into buying some equipment a little at a time over the next couple of years so it doesn't hit me too hard all at once.
-Jim
 
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