Starting a reef/fish tank. Stocking questions.

[pmac85]

Hi, I'm pretty new to this, and I've just recently finished cycling a 90 Gallon, 4 foot tank. I've got a 20 gallon sump underneath with a live rock refugium.
I've got some questions about adding livestock to my tank.
As the title of my post says, I plan on this being a mixed, reef/fish aquarium.
I would really like to introduce a Volitan Lionfish once I start adding fish, but I'm somewhat unsure of what would be some compatible tankmates, considering I would like to have corals and other inverts in here as well as fish. The lionfish is on the top of my list for fish I want to have in here, so basically I'm going to try to base all my other livestock selections around that.
I've got a bit of a list here of what I've found may be compatible, but I'd like to hear some other opinions before I spend the money on some inverts, etc.
Fish:

[hr]
Volitan Lionfish
Yellow Belly Regal Blue Tang
Some sort of wrasse
Snowflake Eel* ??
Butterfly Fish
Foxface
A Large Angel* ??
Anthias
Filefish
Striped Squirrelfish
* = Kind of up in the air about these two, and I've heard the eel may eat all my hermits, etc.
Inverts:

[hr]
Blue Leg Hermits
Electric Flame Scallop
Sea Slug
Spiny Sea Cucumber
Featherduster
Sea Star
Longspine Urchin
Blue Tux Pincusion
Spiny Star Astraea
Some sort of Clam
Condy Anemone
As I said earlier, I'm pretty new to this, so I'd like to hear some suggestions/additions/etc. on my stocking list so far. As well as some advice on what will/won't survive together off of my list.
Thanks in advance,
Patrick
EDIT: I also don't know a whole lot about corals, so some suggestions for corals that may do well in my tank would be appreciated.

 

[btldreef]

Hi

Congrats to you for finish your cycling, always a good feeling. I've listed a lot of comments throughout your quote underneath, my comments appear in red.
When you're ready to start adding things to your tank, start with some cheap inverts first, hermits, snails, etc. See how it goes for a week or two, then add more and go from there. However, I do think your stock list needs to be modified a little. Hopefully other people will chime in as well since I have no personal experience with lionfish (I'm afraid of them, lol).
Originally Posted by PMac85
http:///forum/post/3189652
Hi, I'm pretty new to this, and I've just recently finished cycling a 90 Gallon, 4 foot tank. I've got a 20 gallon sump underneath with a live rock refugium.
I've got some questions about adding livestock to my tank.
As the title of my post says, I plan on this being a mixed, reef/fish aquarium.
I would really like to introduce a Volitan Lionfish once I start adding fish, but I'm somewhat unsure of what would be some compatible tankmates, considering I would like to have corals and other inverts in here as well as fish. The lionfish is on the top of my list for fish I want to have in here, so basically I'm going to try to base all my other livestock selections around that.
I've got a bit of a list here of what I've found may be compatible, but I'd like to hear some other opinions before I spend the money on some inverts, etc.
Fish:

[hr]
Volitan Lionfish
Yellow Belly Regal Blue Tang
Some sort of wrasse
Snowflake Eel* ??
Butterfly Fish
Foxface
A Large Angel* ??
Anthias
Filefish
Striped Squirrelfish
* = Kind of up in the air about these two, and I've heard the eel may eat all my hermits, etc.
Since you want a reef as well as keeping fish. I don't know if a Filefish or Butterfly would be a smart move. Most eat corals. The large angel, well that's always a risk as well. Some people have luck, other don't. There are a few species that are better than others. Being that your tank is only a 90 gallon, I would not recommend the Yellow Belly Blue Regal OR a Large Angel fish, both need 125+ gallon tanks in my opinion, or 6 foot long tanks. Squirrelfish will eat any sort of feather duster you put in there and more than likely with destroy a clam as well. I, personally, do not consider them a reef friendly fish.
The major problems I see with parts of your fish stock list is that many of the fish you list are really more geared for a fish only tank, not a reef. I'd do some more research about the fish you want. Like, what type of butterfly do you want? Also, with anthias, depending on the size of your lionfish, the lion may eat them sooner or later. IMO, if you really want both the lion and the anthias, you either need to buy adult anthias (which are hard to find) and a baby lion or place the lion in as the very last fish which may be well over a year from now. Are you set on the volitan specifically or any lionfish?
Inverts:

[hr]
Blue Leg Hermits
Electric Flame Scallop
Sea Slug
Spiny Sea Cucumber
Featherduster
Sea Star
Longspine Urchin
Blue Tux Pincusion
Spiny Star Astraea
Some sort of Clam
Condy Anemone
Looks okay to me. You need more snails though. Look at Trochus, Nassarius and Ceriths, which in my opinion are essential to a reef (especially if you have sand).
As I said earlier, I'm pretty new to this, so I'd like to hear some suggestions/additions/etc. on my stocking list so far. As well as some advice on what will/won't survive together off of my list.
Thanks in advance,
Patrick
EDIT: I also don't know a whole lot about corals, so some suggestions for corals that may do well in my tank would be appreciated. Some easier corals are generic polyps, (green star polyps are quite popular), zoos (zoanthids), mushrooms, and most LPS corals (Torch, Frogspawn, Hammer, Brains). SPS are the more difficult corals and really not recommended until you have established water with consistent readings. I don't consider an SPS to be a beginner coral.

 

[pmac85]

Originally Posted by BTLDreef
http:///forum/post/3189685
Hi

Congrats to you for finish your cycling, always a good feeling. I've listed a lot of comments throughout your quote underneath, my comments appear in red.
When you're ready to start adding things to your tank, start with some cheap inverts first, hermits, snails, etc. See how it goes for a week or two, then add more and go from there. However, I do think your stock list needs to be modified a little. Hopefully other people will chime in as well since I have no personal experience with lionfish (I'm afraid of them, lol).
Thanks for the reply, like I said, I'm new to this

. Those suggestions will definitely help me with picking my stocklist. I was pretty set on getting a Black Volitan Lion, but maybe something a little smaller will have to do, so I can get a nicer variety of tankmates for it.
Keep the suggestions coming everyone!

 

[colbalt60]

can anyone say bio overload. like the above poster stated. butterfly and angel are not going to be advised by me.
if the lion is your prize, then you will have to adjust your stocking list drastically.
i feel that you would be better served as a fish only with live rock for your system.
this is only my opinion.

 

[btldreef]

You can have a lionfish in a reef, many people do it, but the stock list will have to be adjusted. Fish only tanks, to me, are boring. It will just take a tiny bit more research to do a lion in a reef and keep all the critters happy and safe together. But you're new to the hobby and a little research is not such a bad thing.
My friend had a reef for a few years, let his clowns reach full size, etc, then added his prize lion. All he has for a CUC is very large hermits and snails and everything is doing very well.

 

[pmac85]

Originally Posted by colbalt60
http:///forum/post/3189700
i feel that you would be better served as a fish only with live rock for your system.
this is only my opinion.
Care to elaborate on this a little? I've heard a fair bit of success stories from people keeping lions in reef tanks.

 

[pmac85]

Anyone care to take a stab at creating an example stock list that I could work from? Just to give me a basic idea. I'm basically looking to get a decent amount of colourful/exotic looking fish (incl. a lionfish as my showpiece as I've mentioned before), with a few inverts (I like spiny urchins, sea stars, etc.), and some hard/soft corals, and of course a good cuc.
Sorry for bein such a newbie on here haha

 

[btldreef]

Originally Posted by PMac85
http:///forum/post/3189731
Anyone care to take a stab at creating an example stock list that I could work from? Just to give me a basic idea. I'm basically looking to get a decent amount of colourful/exotic looking fish (incl. a lionfish as my showpiece as I've mentioned before), with a few inverts (I like spiny urchins, sea stars, etc.), and some hard/soft corals, and of course a good cuc.
Sorry for bein such a newbie on here haha

At least you ask questions first, instead of having to come on here and go "I screwed up, now help me fix it." I'll make a stock list, give me a few minutes. Anyone can modify mine as well to help.

 

[btldreef]

Originally Posted by PMac85http:///forum/post/3189731Anyone care to take a stab at creating an example stock list that I could work from? Just to give me a basic idea. I'm basically looking to get a decent amount of colourful/exotic looking fish (incl. a lionfish as my showpiece as I've mentioned before), with a few inverts (I like spiny urchins, sea stars, etc.), and some hard/soft corals, and of course a good cuc.Sorry for bein such a newbie on here haha

Fish: (a lot of these fish are "reef safe with caution" which means there is a risk that they may nip at corals, although they usually don't)
Dwarf Lionfish going with a dwarf will make your stocking much easier, so that is what I'm going to list here - if you really want a Volitan, please let me know, because drastic changes will probably need to be made, the Volitans get much bigger and therefore must be housed with much bigger fish. Keep in mind with most lions, they will eat whatever fits in their mouth
Dwarf Angelfish - Centropyge species - go with one of the larger ones, such as a Coral Beauty, Flame, BiColor, LemonPeel, Potters, etc. The pygmy might be a little too small
Exquisite Wrasse - or another larger reef safe wrasse
Flame Hawkfish
Foxface
Inverts:
Coral Banded Shrimp - 2?
Large Turbo Snails
Blue Tuxedo Pin Cushion Urchin
Red Pin Cushion Urchin
Anemone - depending on your lighting. RBTA's are nice.
Starfish - (Linckias, Sand Sifters, Brittles don't add until you're tank is very established
Large Blue Legged Hermits
Clam - depending on lighting. Do not add until tank is established
Assorted other snails
Corals (to start off with)
Favia
Torch
Frogspawn
Mushrooms
Hammer
Zoos
Lobophyllia
Bubble Coral
Fox Coral
Duncanmussa
Blastomussa wellsi
Various polyps (green stars, daisy polyps, etc.)
*google beginner corals - there are some great sites with beginner coral listings, many will list leather corals, that's fine, but if you plan on doing hard coral (SPS) down the road, a lot of leathers can cause issues with keeping these*

 

[pmac85]

Thanks for all the help on this BTLDreef. That seems like a pretty decent starting point, as far as the Dwarf Lion goes, from what I've seen of them so far, they don't really have the attraction I'm looking for (clearly they aren't nearly as impressive as the Volitans). I realise that if I were to go with a larger Lionfish that it would limit my stocking options quite a bit, but I'm sure there must be a way to work around it. So, supposing I did still go with a Volitan, or something similar, any ideas of what my options might be as far as tank mates, etc?
I'm sure the urchins and anemones, etc. wouldn't really be affected, since they have pretty good defence mechanisms, and I've heard that Volitans aren't really too interested in Hermits, snails, etc. I'm not too sure about the corals, but I've heard that they should be okay. I just don't know what other fish/inverts might be suitable.
Thanks

 

[btldreef]

. as usual - answers in red
Originally Posted by PMac85
http:///forum/post/3189816
Thanks for all the help on this BTLDreef. That seems like a pretty decent starting point, as far as the Dwarf Lion goes, from what I've seen of them so far, they don't really have the attraction I'm looking for (clearly they aren't nearly as impressive as the Volitans). I realise that if I were to go with a larger Lionfish that it would limit my stocking options quite a bit, but I'm sure there must be a way to work around it. So, supposing I did still go with a Volitan, or something similar, any ideas of what my options might be as far as tank mates, etc?
I should have went back and revised what I said. Just about everything I listed I think would be okay with the Volitan as well.
I'm sure the urchins and anemones, etc. wouldn't really be affected, since they have pretty good defence mechanisms, and I've heard that Volitans aren't really too interested in Hermits, snails, etc. I'm not too sure about the corals, but I've heard that they should be okay. I just don't know what other fish/inverts might be suitable. You should be okay. They get a bad reputation because people are afraid of them. They're not evil fish. They're quite peaceful, they'll just eat what fits in their mouth (tiny fish, shrimp, etc) Usually Coral Banded Shrimp are okay with them, larger hermits and snails will also be fine.
Thanks

 

[pmac85]

Okay, sounds good. Thanks again. I had a feeling that list would still be pretty good with a Volitan. Most of the people that say you can't put them in with reef/other fish/etc. Also don't back up their statements with any knowledge or reasoning. I've read that they are quite peaceful, and realise that they eventually will eat anything they can fit in their mouth, so I'll just have to watch I don't get any fish that are too small.
About the shrimp, I'm assuming it would have to be a pretty large coral banded shrimp to not get eaten, they seem quite delicate, and I've always figured they wouldn't be much more than a nice meal for a Volitan.
One more question, should the Volitan be last in my stocking order as far as fish go? or would it be an okay fish to start with after my CUC is established, and maybe a few other inverts/easy corals.

 

[btldreef]

Originally Posted by PMac85
http:///forum/post/3189851
Okay, sounds good. Thanks again. I had a feeling that list would still be pretty good with a Volitan. Most of the people that say you can't put them in with reef/other fish/etc. Also don't back up their statements with any knowledge or reasoning. I've read that they are quite peaceful, and realise that they eventually will eat anything they can fit in their mouth, so I'll just have to watch I don't get any fish that are too small.
About the shrimp, I'm assuming it would have to be a pretty large coral banded shrimp to not get eaten, they seem quite delicate, and I've always figured they wouldn't be much more than a nice meal for a Volitan.
One more question, should the Volitan be last in my stocking order as far as fish go? or would it be an okay fish to start with after my CUC is established, and maybe a few other inverts/easy corals.
I would put him towards the end of the list, that's just my opinion, but I don't think it matters much on my stock list except for the dwarf angel. If you do decide on the dwarf angel, that should be last. Try to get a young Volitan, this way your fish will grow together, less issues this way.
As for the Coral Banded, I think they're a little feistier, but I'd try to see what others that keep lions in their reef have to say about that.

 

[pmac85]

Great, thanks again for all the info. Now I've got a nice starting point to base my livestock list from. Now it's time to dip into the bank account and get started haha. I'll start another thread detailing my progress soon, so I can keep you guys posted on how my tank starts to shape up.
Anyone else feel free to chime in on this thread if you have any suggestions for me!