Stingray (what size sand do u have?)

chana

Member
I have a 265 gal tank with sugar size sand in my tank.Finally got the blue spotted stingray
and my tank is CLOUDY.
I thought this sand is what I was suppose to get for the ray. I do have filters in the sump. Will it just take a while for the stingray to stir small particles to get filtered out or did I buy the wrong size sand for a ray?

The tank looks like it did when we first set it up (you no what I'm saying) Those first few days when you finally get it clear then move the rocks around and make it cloudy again.
If I did buy the wrong sand do you think I could add bigger sand to the top of the exsisting sand?
Thanks!
 

chana

Member
This tank has been set up for 4 weeks.
Here is the story. I had a 150gal setup that was up for around a year.
Had live rock/sand. I purchased a 265 and used all the water, rock and some of the sand for the new tank. Obviously I had to add more water and sand.
All the fish are doing great. ammonia,nitrite and nitrates are 0. The sand cloudyness was normal after a few days of being set up. The stingray just stirs it up. The shark kinda stirs it up also but it disapates pretty fast.
Just wondering if anybody else experienced this and if the small particles in the sand eventually get filtered out?
 

sepulatian

Moderator
Originally Posted by chana
http:///forum/post/2955937
This tank has been set up for 4 weeks.
Here is the story. I had a 150gal setup that was up for around a year.
Had live rock/sand. I purchased a 265 and used all the water, rock and some of the sand for the new tank. Obviously I had to add more water and sand.
All the fish are doing great. ammonia,nitrite and nitrates are 0. The sand cloudyness was normal after a few days of being set up. The stingray just stirs it up. The shark kinda stirs it up also but it disapates pretty fast.
Just wondering if anybody else experienced this and if the small particles in the sand eventually get filtered out?
The smaller parts will get filtered out.
I have to say that you added delicate fish way too fast though.
 

chana

Member
Ok thanks
To fast? I have been checking my water peramaters and I have alot of live rock that was already establish in the 150 gall setup and used all the same water- just added to it.
How long do you think I should have waited?
This is an honest question not being defensive.
 

chana

Member
Wow 6 months
I dont understand. I have a large protien skimmer and live rock thats been established for a year.
I thought I understood cycling a tank
Dont understand why moving it and adding some water would make a differance?
 

aquaknight

Active Member
What is a 'large skimmer'? SEQUENCE OF THE SET UP
1.
Place cleaned aquarium in its spot
2.
Put in substrate (that has been cleaned)
3.
Put in some water; don't fill tank more than half-full with marine water (onto a dish so as to not disturb substrate)
4.
Arrange live rock
5.
Fill tank with marine/salt water (An alternative approach is to fill the tank with source water and mix the first batch of saltwater in the bare tank. This will work too. After the water is mixed, aged, and adjusted, then arrange the live rock in it (removing excess water if necessary and storing it for water changes))
6.
Start operation of equipment (light, pumps, filter, heater, skimmer, etc.)
7.
Check water chemistries (ammonia, nitrite, nitrate) and water parameters (specific gravity, temperature, and pH). Make minor changes to specific gravity, temperature, and pH at this time. Practice holding these three as steady as you can on a day-to-day basis. Do these tests at various times of the day to see how they fluctuate (if the do) throughout the day.
8.
LET THE TANK RUN LIKE THIS FOR AT LEAST TWO WEEKS. Check twice or three times a day all equipment for leaks and malfunction. Make any equipment adjustments.
9.
Life should be coming out of the live rock by this point, and hopefully pods and worms will be spreading around the aquarium. (Check at night, too). Start feeding that life. Add frozen fish foods to the aquarium (NOT pellets or flake) at a rate of about 0.5 gram every day or other day per 25 gallons of water. After no less than two weeks OR when readings indicate ammonia level is zero and nitrite levels are below 0.10 ppm and pH is being held steady go on to 10. Add additional pods and worms if you like, at this point.
10.
Begin your water change pattern (10+% weekly, 25% every 2 weeks, or 40+% monthly are good choices). Put one or more sponge filters into the display tank (sump) for the quarantine process.
11.
When all chemistries and parameters are stable and where they should be, now check alkalinity, calcium, and magnesium. Additions may be needed, but for the most part your water changes will probably keep these controlled unless the artificial salt or source water is a problem.
 

aquaknight

Active Member
12. After any adjustments from 11, repeat the tests to make sure the concentrations are where they should be. WAIT 4 more weeks! Now start checking the phosphate concentration.13. Slowly add your clean-up crew from quarantine. Add all snails, including some carnivorous ones. Feed them according to what they need to eat. (Feed herbivore snails with sheets of marine algae; feed carnivore snails with shrimp flesh, scallop, squid, clam, etc. but no pellets yet). Do not add starfish or cucumber at this point. Don't add any obligate detritus eaters.
14.
Run aquarium with the clean-up crew being fed and kept healthy for a few weeks. Then, if all water chemistries and water parameters are still good, add shrimp, additional worms and pods you'd like to keep. Feed all your livestock every two days. At this time, you can include the feeding of pellets that sink.
15.
Drop a clean, opened, previously frozen and thawed living clam into the aquarium once every 10 days. You should see worms, carnivorous snails, and the shrimp eating it. Remove any uneaten clam 20 hours after putting it in.
16.
After no less than two months of running the aquarium with the clean-up crew in place with proper, steady water quality the appearance of the aquarium should be coming around. There should be less noticeable 'brown algae' and nuisance algae. The clean-up crew can be expanded along the way as needed. Snails may be laying eggs (a good sign), pod population should be very high, and worms are perhaps more noticeable (they are getting brave since there are no worm predators around -- yet!).
17.
Determine the foods needed for the fishes you want to keep. Obtain proper nutritional supplements and foods and get things ready for handling fishes.
18.
Acquire your first (hardy) fish to put through the quarantine process.
19.
Start adding hardy fish to the display aquarium at a rate no faster than one fish every 6 weeks. Monitor all chemistries and if anything goes out of sorts, stop adding fish, determine any causes, fix causes, make additional water changes, etc. before continuing. CHOOSE YOUR FISH WISELY.
20.
After the first fish is added, you may quarantine a Chocolate Chip Star separately to be added to the display. Same with a cucumber. The QT for the cucumber can have a thick substrate laden with food particles during quarantine. Choose one or the other for aquariums over 165 gallons. Now is the time to add any obligate detritus eaters.
21.
After several (6-8) months of operation after the clean-up crew was put in, the tank should be mature and ready for more sensitive fishes (the large Angelfishes, Butterflyfish, etc.). If the goal is to keep these kinds of fishes, then let the tank run with the clean up crew, shrimp, etc. and regular feedings for these critters, for no less than a total of 6 months.
22.
Don't overstock. Stick to your plan.
23.
Add fish one at a time with no less than 6 weeks in between so the system can adjust to each addition. The system needs time to gear up to additional bio-loads and demands put on it.
-At the risk of a Joe like calling out, this is from Lee Birch.
Basically you are starting fresh. The rock in the 150, what just that, established for the specific bioload of that tank. In the 265gal, everything will need to start fresh. There's no way to import over all of the pods, worms, beneficial bacteria that only time will allow to become established in an aquarium.
However the main reason is there's a difference between a tank ready for clean-up-crew/hardy specimen, and a tank ready for a blue-spotted stingray.
 

chana

Member
Also would like input on how to upsize the right way if this wasn't right.
I am planning on getting a bigger tank in a couple of years ( there will be less people in the house so I can take up more space).
So if I have delicate fish in an established 265 gall and want to get a 500 gall tank how would I do it?
Do you all just start over? Buy all new LR and have 2 tanks going at the same time? Sounds way more expensive!
Can you get containers and plumb them to your exsisting system and add like 5 gallons a week/month until you have enough volume for the new setup?
I have seen alot of people on here buy sharks and then upsize there tank. Has anyone done this? If so how was it done if they didn't just buy a bigger tank and add more water?
Your input would be appreciated.
 

chana

Member
Not wanting to argue on here or make it a flaming thread but I would like to discuss this topic!
Yes I pobably should have discussed it first!
Just sitting here thinking about all I have done in this hobby and have questions about this.
I have a reef tank also. Have had it for a couple of years. My tank is a 90 gall. I added a 30 gallon fuge a couple months after it was up and running.
Yes in one day! That was adding alot of new water and sand and some cured rock at one time and everything survived! Did I get lucky?
Before that I had a 125 gall built in the wall. I sold it since we were remodeling the whole upstairs. That wall doesn't exsist anymore! Anyway I had a 55 gall fuge on that one. My brother also has a reef tank and one night he called and said his lights caught on fire and he had to use a fire extingiusher and some got in the tank! We removed all of his stuff out of his tank and put them in my refugium! He lost one fish and I lost none.
Was this again just luck?
I would like to here about other people who have upsized or added alot of volume to there tanks and if stuff dyed or not
 

crimzy

Active Member
I have upgraded my system twice without a cycle. I haven't had a problem as long as I maintain the bacteria in the fuge, substrate and liverock. Each time I have had no losses or problems. The only thing to worry about when upgrading is if you get a large amount of additional liverock then you will have some die off and may trigger an ammonia spike.
As far as your ray, sep is right, the smaller particles will be filtered off over time and the sand will be fine. What kind of shark and ray do you have? What else is in the tank? What are the dimensions? Just curious as I love shark/ray setups.
 

chana

Member
I have a banded Catshark. Somebody traded him back to the LFS, You helped me out with the Goiter Problem. I am feeding it Mazuri shark gel, and dipping food hopefully this will take care of it!
I have a Purcipine Puffer, Fimbreated Eel, Banded catshark, Lunar wrasse, Blue Spotted Ray and Harleqiun Tusk.
I didn't add any Live Rock. I did't want to for the shark and eel. My tank is
7' X 2'6" X 2'
I hope I am OK. My LFS Owner is way cool with me I have known him for around 7 years.
I am wondering if I should take he Ray back? I don't want to kill it
 

crimzy

Active Member
Originally Posted by chana
http:///forum/post/2956146
I have a banded Catshark. Somebody traded him back to the LFS, You helped me out with the Goiter Problem. I am feeding it Mazuri shark gel, and dipping food hopefully this will take care of it!
I have a Purcipine Puffer, Fimbreated Eel, Banded catshark, Lunar wrasse, Blue Spotted Ray and Harleqiun Tusk.
I didn't add any Live Rock. I did't want to for the shark and eel. My tank is
7' X 2'6" X 2'
I hope I am OK. My LFS Owner is way cool with me I have known him for around 7 years.
I am wondering if I should take he Ray back? I don't want to kill it

Oh yeah... I remember. BTW, I didn't mention, but it probably goes without saying, that you want to keep your water quality as high as possible during treatment for the goiter. Try to keep your trates low. As long as the shark is still able to eat then I'm pretty sure it will make a full recovery.

Have you had any problem with the porky and the shark or ray? How long have you had them together?
Why do you think you are going to kill the ray?
 

chana

Member
Sepulation says I moved to fast. I am worried.
I set the 265G up 4 weeks ago. I lost a porcipine puffer 2 days before the move. Found him squished under the rocks! Apperantley the rocks shifted.
I also removed 2 large Black Urchins when I upsized the tank (since I was getting a Shark and a Ray). So we bought 2 small puffers that were in the same tank as the Shark at the LFS. One got a huge hicky from being stuck in a powerhead
. He lived for two days before an untimely death. So between my house and the LFS the shark and the puffer have been togather for about 2 months.
 

chana

Member
Actually Thinking about it they have been together since just after Christmas. The Ray was intoduce to the LFS tank about 1 weeks after that. We waited to bring the ray home after we got the Shark to see if water quality would stay good with the Shark in the tank. Also wanted to wait for the bigger protien skimmer to get here.
 

crimzy

Active Member
Originally Posted by chana
http:///forum/post/2956191
Sepulation says I moved to fast. I am worried.
I set the 265G up 4 weeks ago. I lost a porcipine puffer 2 days before the move. Found him squished under the rocks! Apperantley the rocks shifted.
I also removed 2 large Black Urchins when I upsized the tank (since I was getting a Shark and a Ray). So we bought 2 small puffers that were in the same tank as the Shark at the LFS. One got a huge hicky from being stuck in a powerhead
. He lived for two days before an untimely death. So between my house and the LFS the shark and the puffer have been togather for about 2 months.
Yeah, Sep is right that you generally want to move slowly, especially when introducing a delicate species like a blue dot ray. There is no hard and fast rule but playing it safe is a good rule of thumb. However at this point, if you have the ray eating, and if the water quality is high then I'd say you're doing ok.
Be careful with puffers. Generally most experts advise against keeping rays/sharks with puffers because the puffers may get aggressive, and their beaks can cause a lot of damage on the shark/ray. Again, playing it safe is generally recommended but it appears that your combination is working for the timebeing.
Good luck with them and post often as things progress. I'll offer any assistance that I can.
 
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