Tank Crashing? Swimming last night - on the bottom this morning?! Advice?

daddyjama

daddyjama

Member
Setup:
75g about a year old, ~70lbs of live rock.
Inhabitants
One Maroon clown
Sadleback clown
1 pajama cardinal
algae eater blenny
hermits, a starfish, and a fire shrimp
So a week ago i bought a bi color angel.. and he was fine
Yesterday i bought a Pearl butterfly fish. I aclimated him by putting water from my tank into a bucket with him in it over about 20 mins..
They were swimming around fine last night.. This mornign i woek up and the angel, the butterfly and the saddleback are on the ground shallow breathing. I set up a quick 10 gallon up this mornig and put the angel and butterfly in it to see fi they will pull through. Right now they are shallwo breathing on the bottom but still fluttering.
The saddleback is on still on the ground in tank. All the rest are fine?
What do yo uthink?
my levels are good using the strips and the plastic hydrometer as in the nitrates are below 20, and the salt is right in the middle.
 
flower

flower

Well-Known Member

Adding two fish should not have caused a spike in an established 75g
…
Putting them all in a 10g QT after the fact only stressed them more. I acclimate each fish for at least an hour to 2 hours, not 20 minutes.
If you had a set up QT why didn’t you use it to start with?
I am not trying to sound mean, but strip tests are almost useless for a saltwater tank. I say “almost useless” because it offers a quick test to see if something is off before wasting the more accurate expensive marine tests.
Here is what I would do...
Keep water changes up in the 10g for a few days because of overcrowding. Give your healthy fish a few days to rest before trying to re-acclimate them to the DT. Because you already added the new fish to the DT it isn’t going to make any difference now.
You want to not stress the fish anymore for a bit. Don’t re-add any sick fish. If isn’t breathing right keep it in the QT because it will be easier to remove it if it dies.
Sorry to hear of your troubles, hope this helps.
 
flower

flower

Well-Known Member

Sorry, after re-reading your post..I see all three fish are still breathing hard. I read all the rest were doing fine and thought you meant the established other two in the QT. It really sounds like an ammonia spike, which makes no sense in an established tank.
What kind of filter are you using? Also do you run a skimmer, and power heads?
 
daddyjama

daddyjama

Member
Originally Posted by Flower
http:///forum/post/3245153

Adding two fish should not have caused a spike in an established 75g
…
Putting them all in a 10g QT after the fact only stressed them more. I acclimate each fish for at least an hour to 2 hours, not 20 minutes.
If you had a set up QT why didn’t you use it to start with?
I am not trying to sound mean, but strip tests are almost useless for a saltwater tank. I say “almost useless” because it offers a quick test to see if something is off before wasting the more accurate expensive marine tests.
Here is what I would do...
Keep water changes up in the 10g for a few days because of overcrowding. Give your healthy fish a few days to rest before trying to re-acclimate them to the DT. Because you already added the new fish to the DT it isn’t going to make any difference now.
You want to not stress the fish anymore for a bit. Don’t re-add any sick fish. If isn’t breathing right keep it in the QT because it will be easier to remove it if it dies.
Sorry to hear of your troubles, hope this helps.
Thanks Flower
QT wasnt set up..it was all parts but now water in. It orignially had a couple of damsels in it in a differnet room. I gave the damsels away..
So i understand the strips arent as accurate, but what im hearing is that if something was way out of wack, the strips would it least show that.. and so they dont i'm assuming it isnt.
So the fix for now will be water changes in both tanks?? That sounds good, but im still wondering what could have happend so i can fix that?
 
flower

flower

Well-Known Member
Originally Posted by DaddyJama
http:///forum/post/3245156
Thanks Flower
QT wasnt set up..it was all parts but now water in. It orignially had a couple of damsels in it in a differnet room. I gave the damsels away..
So i understand the strips arent as accurate, but what im hearing is that if something was way out of wack, the strips would it least show that.. and so they dont i'm assuming it isnt.
So the fix for now will be water changes in both tanks?? That sounds good, but im still wondering what could have happend so i can fix that?

Do you have a skimmer? They pull junk out of the water you can't even test for.
 
daddyjama

daddyjama

Member
Originally Posted by Flower
http:///forum/post/3245155

Sorry, after re-reading your post..I see all three fish are still breathing hard. I read all the rest were doing fine and thought you meant the established other two in the QT. It really sounds like an ammonia spike, which makes no sense in an established tank.
What kind of filter are you using? Also do you run a skimmer, and power heads?
Butterfly, Angel, and Saddleback were breathing hard in the DT. i put the angle and butterfly in the QT(which apparently i should not have) so the saddleback is still in the DT breathing hard but moving more than the other guys.
Why would the rest not go down too?
I've got a fluval 406, and a powerhead. No skimmer.
BA
 
flower

flower

Well-Known Member

Can you put some activated charcoal in the fluval? That will help remove toxins if any...DO NOT MESS WITH ANYTHING ELSE IN IT. You don't want your good bacteria to be disturbed.
Don't do too big a water change at once. 20%
I bet a skimmer would help your system. I would get one ASAP.
 
pezenfuego

pezenfuego

Active Member
Originally Posted by luvmyreef
http:///forum/post/3245167
And add more rock. It sounds like your biological filtration is inadequate for this many fish.
That may or may not be the problem here.
I think that he did stress the biological filter in his tank and that he had an ammonia or nitrite spike.
Adding more rock is certainly a good idea, but with your stocklist, you need to be careful not to eliminate too much swimming room.
Doing water changes (20% is good
) is also a good idea; I would even recommend reduced feedings for a while until you can build up your biological filter.
With that said, I really can't imagine this being a result of having no skimmer. In any case, I agree with Flower. You should get one.
 
daddyjama

daddyjama

Member
NO new charcoal i'll have to wait till store opens. I live out in deliverance so they dont open for a while. I'm doing the water change..
I took a little rock out when i rearranged for the fish
I'm wondering if if the frozen silverslides i put in were bad?? I had some mysis shrimp and i threw in some silverslides.. the bag was open so i'm wondering if the food was bad?
 
luvmyreef

luvmyreef

Active Member
Originally Posted by DaddyJama
http:///forum/post/3245179
NO new charcoal i'll have to wait till store opens. I live out in deliverance so they dont open for a while. I'm doing the water change..
I took a little rock out when i rearranged for the fish
I'm wondering if if the frozen silverslides i put in were bad?? I had some mysis shrimp and i threw in some silverslides.. the bag was open so i'm wondering if the food was bad?
Well, if this is the cause then a water change and new charcoal will help. I still recommend more rock though. I have a 75 and i have about 110-115lbs of rock in it, ofcourse its stacked in the center to give my fish plenty of swimming room. Oh and take a sample of your water to the store and have them test it for you. And, keep us posted.
 
flower

flower

Well-Known Member
Originally Posted by luvmyreef
http:///forum/post/3245192
Well, if this is the cause then a water change and new charcoal will help. I still recommend more rock though. I have a 75 and i have about 110-115lbs of rock in it, ofcourse its stacked in the center to give my fish plenty of swimming room. Oh and take a sample of your water to the store and have them test it for you. And, keep us posted.

Just curious...What kind of rock? I have a 90g with Fiji rock about 80 pounds and it fills the tank halfway up. Unless you use a very dense rock, 115 pounds in a 75g even placed in the center is allot more than the tank can hold and leave swimming room.
 
luvmyreef

luvmyreef

Active Member
Originally Posted by Flower
http:///forum/post/3245205

Just curious...What kind of rock? I have a 90g with Fiji rock about 80 pounds and it fills the tank halfway up. Unless you use a very dense rock, 115 pounds in a 75g even placed in the center is allot more than the tank can hold and leave swimming room.
I have 45lbs of lalo rock( in three huge chunks) and the rest is premium figi ( a lot of triangle shapes and fingerlike shapes). I ordered it all in the beginning of my set up six years ago from the doctors. Oh and I added a couple pieces of brazilian rock that had the prettiest pink coralline on it from the local store at the time.
 
killer whale

killer whale

Member
Originally Posted by DaddyJama
http:///forum/post/3245144
Setup:
75g about a year old, ~70lbs of live rock.
Inhabitants
One Maroon clown
Sadleback clown
1 pajama cardinal
algae eater blenny
hermits, a starfish, and a fire shrimp
So a week ago i bought a bi color angel.. and he was fine
Yesterday i bought a Pearl butterfly fish. I aclimated him by putting water from my tank into a bucket with him in it over about 20 mins..
They were swimming around fine last night.. This mornign i woek up and the angel, the butterfly and the saddleback are on the ground shallow breathing. I set up a quick 10 gallon up this mornig and put the angel and butterfly in it to see fi they will pull through. Right now they are shallwo breathing on the bottom but still fluttering.
The saddleback is on still on the ground in tank. All the rest are fine?
What do yo uthink?
my levels are good using the strips and the plastic hydrometer as in the nitrates are below 20, and the salt is right in the middle.

Three of your fish are struggling? That sounds like a problem with your parameters. Your ammonia levels could be high. (As it will take some time to be coverted into nitrate) This may sound stupid but have you checked water temperature? Any chance of impurities in your system? How much Iodine are you using? Also recommend a better test kit, you can quess for free.
 
daddyjama

daddyjama

Member
well heres a pic of ammonia..and how much rock.. the ammonia pic is after sitting for about a half hour.. after 5 mins, there wasn bot a big difference. Well the saddleback is off the ground but still in corner.. the butterfly is gone.. he's stiff and not breathing.. crossing the finger for the angel..
i'm still wondering what could have spike it?

 
daddyjama

daddyjama

Member
Originally Posted by killer whale
http:///forum/post/3245229
Three of your fish are struggling? That sounds like a problem with your parameters. Your ammonia levels could be high. (As it will take some time to be coverted into nitrate) This may sound stupid but have you checked water temperature? Any chance of impurities in your system? How much Iodine are you using? Also recommend a better test kit, you can quess for free.

temp is good..a tic over 74..
yes the three were wierd..the others are fine. IVe never used iodine..
i'm gonna do one more bucket to finsh water change
BA
 
daddyjama

daddyjama

Member
Clowns Good.. swimming around .. angel is breathing heavy but moved from one side to other side of QT so i'm crossing fingers.. no more butterfly ;(
 
srfisher17

srfisher17

Active Member
Without going thru QT; you can't rule out any number of parasites. Many are very tough to see and attack the gills first.
 
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