Things I don't believe in

snakeblitz33

Well-Known Member
I thought it would be interesting to take a cue from a larger forum and start a thread that may be interesting if other people can join in and tell us what you also don't believe in.
1. Biopellet reactors
2. Frequent weekly water changes
3. Excessive amounts of flow
4. Over-skimming a tank
5. Not feeding a tank for scare of nutrients
6. frozen, pre-packaged fish foods
7. ULNS
8. De-nitrate filters / aquapure filters
9. Excessive GFO
10. Tweaking tank parameters to achieve perfect results
What's some of the things you don't believe in?
 

kiefers

Active Member
you pretty much covered it.
Add one, not being able to have 2 dwaf angelfish in the same system
 
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intdes

Guest
When I first started with saltwater tanks, having to have all the parameters perfect overwhelmed me. To compensate, I picked hardy fish. Over the years, the one thing that sticks out is that many inverts are sensitive to parameter changes so it makes more sense to keep them stable instead of perfect. Isn't that why we acclimate them and not just dump them in the tank? I can see perfecting parameters for delicate fish, but you won't likely find those in my tank...
My contribution would be not believing everything the LFS employee tells you, many of them don't know. Do your own homework and research something BEFORE buying it!
 

snakeblitz33

Well-Known Member
1. Hours of acclimating a fish/invert/insert word here
I honestly don't believe in acclimating fish and stuff for hours on in. As long as the temp balances out, you can go ahead and pop a couple holes in the bag and let it sit.
2. Huge clean up crews...
Seriously,... what's the point when there are better methods of controlling algae?
3. Absolutely strict "dosing" schedules
Amino acids? Sugar? Seriously? OMG! I have to get home... my fish need me! (*Ditches date with wife*)
 

kilofey

Member
I don't believe in obsessing over a tank, I don't dose my tank, and I don't do water changes every week. I don't let my tank control me because hobbies should be fun, not consume every free moment you have. I also don't believe in not having a mixed reef. I have softies next to sps, sps next to lps, aggressive in close proximity to non aggressive never had a coral war yet... well I take that back. My plate has it out for my brain, it will inch its way closer and closer, until I move it back once every couple weeks but it hasn't gotten close enough to it yet
I only keep 6 small fish in a 75 gal with 30 gal sump. I go sometimes months without doing a water change. My parameters are fine, my fish don't die and my corals grow. I keep my bio load low to keep maintenance at a minimum. Sure I have to scrape the glass once in a while and I have some diatoms on my sand bed but it doesn't bother me. My tank stays fairly stable because I don't fiddle with it.
I'm sure some people are rolling their eyes at this post, but my tank is still a stunner and people are in awe when they see it.
 

snakeblitz33

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kilofey http:///t/395392/things-i-dont-believe-in#post_3519917
I don't believe in obsessing over a tank, I don't dose my tank, and I don't do water changes every week. I don't let my tank control me because hobbies should be fun, not consume every free moment you have. I also don't believe in not having a mixed reef. I have softies next to sps, sps next to lps, aggressive in close proximity to non aggressive never had a coral war yet... well I take that back. My plate has it out for my brain, it will inch its way closer and closer, until I move it back once every couple weeks but it hasn't gotten close enough to it yet
I only keep 6 small fish in a 75 gal with 30 gal sump. I go sometimes months without doing a water change. My parameters are fine, my fish don't die and my corals grow. I keep my bio load low to keep maintenance at a minimum. Sure I have to scrape the glass once in a while and I have some diatoms on my sand bed but it doesn't bother me. My tank stays fairly stable because I don't fiddle with it.
I'm sure some people are rolling their eyes at this post, but my tank is still a stunner and people are in awe when they see it.
And your methods, and my methods are probably not for everyone either.
1. that starting a tank with tap water is a horrible thing.
Doesn't make sense to me. I've started tanks with declorinated tap water all the time and let it go through it's natural algae successions... which can be good in a way.
2. having a tank that is completely void of all forms of algae.
I think that having a tank with some algae is beneficial. If it's a fuge with macroalgae - that's great! It will remove some nutrients from the system. If there is some algae in the display tank then all the better for some organisms to live in and breed. Controlling the amount of algae may be a necessity. I periodically have to prune my halimeda algae in my display tank. No big deal.
3. I don't believe anything I hear until I have researched it first.
Seriously - most things on forums are here-say. I like to read first-hand written articles by "experts" in the hobby, before I believe it whole heartily. I encourage anyone who has read any of my guides and articles to take my information with a grain of salt and to do their own research...
4. I don't believe in API test kits.
No-brainer.
 
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intdes

Guest
4. I don't believe in API test kits.
No-brainer.
What type of tests do you use? I have been using API as it is all my LFS carries, I need to buy a new set soon but don't want to take a chance on a bad brand.
 

snakeblitz33

Well-Known Member
I use any simple to use titration style test kit - and whatever one is on sale and within the expiration date.
Typically, that is Seachem. I've had pretty good success with Seachem test kits. Then there is the more expensive Red Sea and Elos. But, for me, I stick to cheap because I am a cheap **** person. :)
 
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smallreef

Guest
I don't believe what most LFS' try to sell me or tell me is fact without searching myself...
I also don't believe that you have to take tank readings to tell if there is something wrong with your tank, if you pay attention well enough you will notice before a test can tell you...
 

snakeblitz33

Well-Known Member
Agreed. I can look at my tank and notice when my alkalinity is low because my coralline starts looking a different shade of purple. Weird but true.
 

flower

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by SnakeBlitz33 http:///t/395392/things-i-dont-believe-in#post_3519908
I thought it would be interesting to take a cue from a larger forum and start a thread that may be interesting if other people can join in and tell us what you also don't believe in.
1. Biopellet reactors
2. Frequent weekly water changes
3. Excessive amounts of flow
4. Over-skimming a tank
5. Not feeding a tank for scare of nutrients
6. frozen, pre-packaged fish foods
7. ULNS
8. De-nitrate filters / aquapure filters
9. Excessive GFO
10. Tweaking tank parameters to achieve perfect results
What's some of the things you don't believe in?
LOL.
..I don't believe folks who knock stuff they have never tried. Aquaripure filters are awesome, but not needed on a macroalgae loaded tank. Frequent weekly water changes, while not for the lazy aquarist, is also a fantastic way to make sure the tank is in tip top shape...and it saves on having to do big water changes which can really disrupt the system. It also removes the need to "tweak" the parameters, and isn't time consuming...big water changes takes hours to do. 1 gallon a day water changes are even better and easier.
#11.... for your list...I don't believe anything a fish store person tells me, I do my own research.
 

flower

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by intdes http:///t/395392/things-i-dont-believe-in#post_3519933
What type of tests do you use? I have been using API as it is all my LFS carries, I need to buy a new set soon but don't want to take a chance on a bad brand.
API test did me wrong...it read 80+ nitrates and had me worried sick. I now use Seachem, not because I'm cheap, but because each test kit comes with a regent to be able to double check the results. With all the on-line stores, there is no reason to be trapped with what the LFS sells.
I can tell when something is off on my tank, but I also know to do the test and see what's up. Never dose before you test is my motto.
 

acrylic51

Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by SnakeBlitz33 http:///t/395392/things-i-dont-believe-in#post_3519908
I thought it would be interesting to take a cue from a larger forum and start a thread that may be interesting if other people can join in and tell us what you also don't believe in.
1. Biopellet reactors They have their places and are effective IMO......
2. Frequent weekly water changes Small frequent water changes I think are better than larger volume water changes for several reasons.....
3. Excessive amounts of flow Depends what you call excessive.....
4. Over-skimming a tank Agree.......
5. Not feeding a tank for scare of nutrients
6. frozen, pre-packaged fish foods
7. ULNS
8. De-nitrate filters / aquapure filters
9. Excessive GFO This I feel is true to much as well as carbon can be detrimental.....
10. Tweaking tank parameters to achieve perfect results Smaller more frequent (daily) water changes could aid in this......
What's some of the things you don't believe in?
 

flower

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by SnakeBlitz33 http:///t/395392/things-i-dont-believe-in#post_3519908
6. frozen, pre-packaged fish foods
What??? I missed this one.
I keep seahorses, frozen pre-packaged Mysis shrimp is the only thing they eat. I made sure I purchased captive bred so I could be sure they would eat frozen pre-packaged food. I do stock their tank with amphipods for a little hunting fun, and for them to snack on...but frozen pre-packaged Mysis shrimp is a must have. Seahorses can't be the only ones that need frozen pre-packaged food.
There are quite a few new folks who hang on every word you post.
On this thread...

  • You advocate using tap water, accepting nuisance algae as a normal process.

  • You would rather purchase additives and chemicals instead of doing water changes.
    Only test your water when you see things going to pot in the tank.
Too much flow???? If the fish are not fighting the current, and the corals are not bent over, you don't have too much flow, and I don't know a soul who does....even new folks notice if the fish are in distress and the corals can't stand up to the water flow.
Snake, the stuff I mentioned that you posted, is just bad advice. Often (Back when I worked on the railroad) I was asked to train the new guy. I had my shortcuts, and knew what I was doing (35 years experience) but I always told the new guy what he SHOULD be doing. I always showed him the correct way to do any task and took the time to explain why. As the new guy went along over the years he found his own methods of getting the job done that worked for him. I didn't start off with telling him how close he could cut in front of a rolling train in the yard and not get killed.
 

snakeblitz33

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flower http:///t/395392/things-i-dont-believe-in#post_3520249
What??? I missed this one.
I keep seahorses, frozen pre-packaged Mysis shrimp is the only thing they eat. I made sure I purchased captive bred so I could be sure they would eat frozen pre-packaged food. I do stock their tank with amphipods for a little hunting fun, and for them to snack on...but frozen pre-packaged Mysis shrimp is a must have. Seahorses can't be the only ones that need frozen pre-packaged food.
There are quite a few new folks who hang on every word you post.
On this thread...

  • You advocate using tap water, accepting nuisance algae as a normal process.

  • You would rather purchase additives and chemicals instead of doing water changes.
    Only test your water when you see things going to pot in the tank.
Too much flow???? If the fish are not fighting the current, and the corals are not bent over, you don't have too much flow, and I don't know a soul who does....even new folks notice if the fish are in distress and the corals can't stand up to the water flow.
Snake, the stuff I mentioned that you posted, is just bad advice. Often (Back when I worked on the railroad) I was asked to train the new guy. I had my shortcuts, and knew what I was doing (35 years experience) but I always told the new guy what he SHOULD be doing. I always showed him the correct way to do any task and took the time to explain why. As the new guy went along over the years he found his own methods of getting the job done that worked for him. I didn't start off with telling him how close he could cut in front of a rolling train in the yard and not get killed.
If a fish or coral has a certain dietary need, of course give it to em'. That's called common sense. DIY frozen foods can be much more nutritious than those pre-packaged meals from the store - and much, much, much cheaper over time. I never said to never feed frozen brine or mysis. I just said I didn't believe in it.
I never said that I advocated using tap water long term. Starting a tank with dechlorinated tap can, in some ways, be a good thing. Some areas in this country have decent tap water to begin with. Some don't. Again, use your common sense. If you keep getting boil warnings or heavy metal warnings in the mail - do you think that you should drink the water,... let alone put it in your tank to start it? No. Common sense.
I would rather keep a tank healthy on my own budget. Whether I want to balance my water chemistry with the proper amounts of elements after I have tested the water to see the deficiencies is my own personal choice. I never held anyone down and said "don't do water changes, ever." I don't think, however, that frequent small weekly water changes do much besides add major and minor elements in small portions back to the system. Large monthly water changes remove waste from the system - detritus within rocks, in the substrate and the muck that has settled in the sump. I believe larger water changes are better at removing actual waste from the system - rather then a 1g water change every day that removes no solid waste from the system. Again, use your common sense.
I never said wait until things go to pot before testing your water parameters. I don't even mention that here on this thread. I simply said that I don't believe in the accuracy of API test kits. As an experience aquarist, I can look at my tank and notice if something is off. If there is, I check my water parameters - first the temp, then pH, then salinity, then alkalinity and keep on going down the line until I find something wrong. If you observe your tank at all every day, you will notice things that might be off with the whole tank. Testing water parameters every single day is completely unnecessary in my opinion. Now, I do advocate testing before dosing anything.
Also - the issue with my opinion on flow... I see some people on RC who are putting upwards 70x - 100x flow in their tanks. It is of my opinion that past a certain point, it is absolutely unnecessary to blow your fish out of the water. I believe that more importantly than flow rate is flow patterns. Flow patters are definitely more important than flow rates. For example, we know that in order to keep a healthy tank there has to be enough to keep the tank oxygenated and the display tank detritus suspended in the water column. If you can accomplish that at 30x, why would you want to go up to 70x or more? SPS corals can grow at 30x turnover rate until they start growing in. By then keeping detritus suspended can be accomplished with additional flow....
I know there are some people on here who read what I have to say and take it to heart. But, I always tell them to do their own research and to use their own common sense. I advocate research, learning through experience, and common sense every single day to new hobbyists. By now, they ought to know to take everyone's advice with a grain of salt. Even yours, Flower.
 

flower

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by SnakeBlitz33 http:///t/395392/things-i-dont-believe-in#post_3520258
If a fish or coral has a certain dietary need, of course give it to em'. That's called common sense. DIY frozen foods can be much more nutritious than those pre-packaged meals from the store - and much, much, much cheaper over time. I never said to never feed frozen brine or mysis. I just said I didn't believe in it.
I never said that I advocated using tap water long term. Starting a tank with dechlorinated tap can, in some ways, be a good thing. Some areas in this country have decent tap water to begin with. Some don't. Again, use your common sense. If you keep getting boil warnings or heavy metal warnings in the mail - do you think that you should drink the water,... let alone put it in your tank to start it? No. Common sense.
I would rather keep a tank healthy on my own budget. Whether I want to balance my water chemistry with the proper amounts of elements after I have tested the water to see the deficiencies is my own personal choice. I never held anyone down and said "don't do water changes, ever." I don't think, however, that frequent small weekly water changes do much besides add major and minor elements in small portions back to the system. Large monthly water changes remove waste from the system - detritus within rocks, in the substrate and the muck that has settled in the sump. I believe larger water changes are better at removing actual waste from the system - rather then a 1g water change every day that removes no solid waste from the system. Again, use your common sense.
I never said wait until things go to pot before testing your water parameters. I don't even mention that here on this thread. I simply said that I don't believe in the accuracy of API test kits. As an experience aquarist, I can look at my tank and notice if something is off. If there is, I check my water parameters - first the temp, then pH, then salinity, then alkalinity and keep on going down the line until I find something wrong. If you observe your tank at all every day, you will notice things that might be off with the whole tank. Testing water parameters every single day is completely unnecessary in my opinion. Now, I do advocate testing before dosing anything.
Also - the issue with my opinion on flow... I see some people on RC who are putting upwards 70x - 100x flow in their tanks. It is of my opinion that past a certain point, it is absolutely unnecessary to blow your fish out of the water. I believe that more importantly than flow rate is flow patterns. Flow patters are definitely more important than flow rates. For example, we know that in order to keep a healthy tank there has to be enough to keep the tank oxygenated and the display tank detritus suspended in the water column. If you can accomplish that at 30x, why would you want to go up to 70x or more? SPS corals can grow at 30x turnover rate until they start growing in. By then keeping detritus suspended can be accomplished with additional flow....
I know there are some people on here who read what I have to say and take it to heart. But, I always tell them to do their own research and to use their own common sense. I advocate research, learning through experience, and common sense every single day to new hobbyists. By now, they ought to know to take everyone's advice with a grain of salt. Even yours, Flower.
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Thank you Snake (Seth),
The explanations you gave is exactly what I wanted to see, because not everyone who takes your advice to heart actually posts to you...they read and run with it. I think we have lots of quiet non-posting people who come here digging for answers but never post. I have seen a couple of new members say they have been lurking for years before they finally decided to post. For those people I posted what I did so you would offer the more in detail information that needed to be said. Saying it's okay to use tap water without an explanation of how or when, could spell disaster for somebody else. In case you haven't noticed...common sense is not something everyone has....I don't know if you remember any of those folks, they don't seem to stay too long.
 

bang guy

Moderator
1 - Dosing Iodine
2 - Excessive Borate (some is good, lots is bad)
3 - UV Sterilizers
4 - Flaked Food
 
S

saxman

Guest
1. Dosing anything you don't test for. (this can get you into beau coup trouble)
2. "Reef-Safe" remedies. (snake oil, all of them...use a QT/HT and git-r-dun right)
3. Bristleworms are bad. (if you have too many, cut back on the food)
4. Keeping tanks above 77*F. (there's no reason to keep a captive system any warmer, and there's no "buffer zone" if room ambient temp spikes)
5. Ugly equipment in my DTs. (it's a fish tank, not a powerhead, heater, etc. tank)
6. Keeping fish in nasty shipping water while they drip. (the accumulated NH3 burns their gill structures).
7. Lionfish and their kin are aggressive. (just because you eat, it doesn't make you aggressive)
8. Feeding krill as an exclusive diet. (nutritionally poor, and freeze dried is even worse)
9. Using common names for Scorpaeniformes or any often mis-ID'd fish.
10. FW feeders are bad for SW preds (gutloaded livebearers and ghost shrimp are OK, Cyprinids
[goldfish, rosy reds,etc] are the bad ones)
I'm sure I could go on...
 

acrylic51

Active Member
Seth you are correct on flow pattern vs flow itself....those guys running that look at some of their systems. ...... also just because said pump pushes "X" doesn't necessarily mean your getting truly that due to plumbing etc.....
 

acrylic51

Active Member
Sorry.....that same 30x flow when they werent grown in....now that 70x flow is required to overcome growth possibly to keep things suspended.
 
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