Very discouraged, please help ID my problem

[rondo]

Hi All,
Unfortunately I have lost two fish in the last week, considering these were the first two fish I added to my system I'm a little discouraged and concerned. I'll lay out as many details as I can in hopes that someone can pick up on something i'm missing. My tank is a 55 gal with a 10 gal sump with about 70 lbs of live rock. I use an in sump protein skimmer. The tank was started back in May, aquacultured caribbean live rock was added and allowed to cycle. Cycle took a little less than a month. I added a cuc purchased from SWF of hermits, snail a CBS, some emeralds and a sally lightfoot. I waited a few weeks with the cuc in the tank then added a ocellaris from my LFS. He was doing fine and eating well about a week and a half later i added a coral beauty angel and cleaner shrimp from SWF. Again all seemed well both fish were eating flake and pellet and algae sheets for the angel. About 3 days after adding the angel the clown was much higher up in the column than normal but I didn't think much of it, the next morning he was dead. I got some input from the boards here and decided to chalk it up to bad luck or a bad LFS. Well a few days later the angel was dead also. Behavior was hard to notice since I only had it a few days and it spent most of the time hidden behind the rockwork. All of my inverts seem fine still. Needless to say I'm very disheartened. I was really enjoying the hobby and all seemed to be going well with my tank. I am hoping someone can help me ID the problem and what my next steps should be. I have listed the water paramaters below. Thanks everyone!
Temp 78
SG 1.023
PH 8.2
Alk Normal
Ammonia 0
Nitrites .02 I found this to be a little strange but am not sure what to make of it.
Nitrates 10
I do use tap water but I am on a well with good water quality. I have little to no algae so I have not tested for phosphates. I do a 10% wc every other week. Any ideas would be most appreciated cause I'm stumped

 

[flower]

Originally Posted by Rondo
http:///forum/post/3095823
Hi All,
Unfortunately I have lost two fish in the last week, considering these were the first two fish I added to my system I'm a little discouraged and concerned. I'll lay out as many details as I can in hopes that someone can pick up on something i'm missing. My tank is a 55 gal with a 10 gal sump with about 70 lbs of live rock. I use an in sump protein skimmer. The tank was started back in May, aquacultured caribbean live rock was added and allowed to cycle. Cycle took a little less than a month. I added a cuc purchased from SWF of hermits, snail a CBS, some emeralds and a sally lightfoot. I waited a few weeks with the cuc in the tank then added a ocellaris from my LFS. He was doing fine and eating well about a week and a half later i added a coral beauty angel and cleaner shrimp from SWF. Again all seemed well both fish were eating flake and pellet and algae sheets for the angel. About 3 days after adding the angel the clown was much higher up in the column than normal but I didn't think much of it, the next morning he was dead. I got some input from the boards here and decided to chalk it up to bad luck or a bad LFS. Well a few days later the angel was dead also. Behavior was hard to notice since I only had it a few days and it spent most of the time hidden behind the rockwork. All of my inverts seem fine still. Needless to say I'm very disheartened. I was really enjoying the hobby and all seemed to be going well with my tank. I am hoping someone can help me ID the problem and what my next steps should be. I have listed the water paramaters below. Thanks everyone!
Temp 78
SG 1.023
PH 8.2
Alk Normal
Ammonia 0
Nitrites .02 I found this to be a little strange but am not sure what to make of it.
Nitrates 10
I do use tap water but I am on a well with good water quality. I have little to no algae so I have not tested for phosphates. I do a 10% wc every other week. Any ideas would be most appreciated cause I'm stumped

The fish hanging out at the top...was it seeking air???
Angels are tricky, I personally can't keep one, but clowns are very hardy...
Since the clown was hanging out higher than normal??? Check the water movement on top, if there is not enough movement the water doesn't have enough oxygen. Also do yo have a skimmer, and how many power heads?

 

[rondo]

I am running a SeaClone 100 protein skimmer in my sump. I have about 1100 gph of flow from my sump return and powerheads in the tank. I do have a glass cover to hold my existing lights which I understand can be a problem with oxygen transfer. Perhaps there was enough O2 for one fish but my adding the second caused a strain? would that make sense?

 

[spanko]

Certainly the glass top and lack of air (gas) exchange at the water surface could be part of the answer, however with the sump and the Seaclone one would think there would be enough dissolved O2 in the tank. The other consideration could be the use of well water. Have you ever had your county health department do an analysis on it? There may be some level of something that is affecting the fish. It would be advantageous for you and your thank to investigate the use of a RODI filtering unit.
Just a couple of things to think about.

 

[trouble93]

" I do use tap water but I am on a well with good water quality"
I would say that the well water may very well be the culprat...There are a lot things in well water we don't test for. Ground water sources contain metals & minerals(High concentrations of sulfur and so on) And it may not affect your CUC, but fish may be more sensative.

 

[rondo]

If it was the water wouldn't it have affected the clown sooner than a few weeks or would that reflect the difference in the hardiness of the clown and the angel?

 

[spanko]

Too many variables to really answer. The clown could have been in better shape than the Angel for some reason. The angel could have still been stressed from shipping. etc etc etc.

 

[fau8]

I would go with the obvious first, are you sure the angel did not have ick? and infect the tank?

 

[florida joe]

[Certainly the glass top and lack of air (gas) exchange at the water surface could be part of the answer, however with the sump and the Seaclone one would think there would be enough dissolved O2 in the tank./QUOTE]Exactly

 

[florida joe]

Certainly the glass top and lack of air (gas) exchange at the water surface could be part of the answer, however with the sump and the Seaclone one would think there would be enough dissolved O2 in the tank
Plus 1
I would go with the obvious first, are you sure the angel did not have ick? and infect the tank
IMO ick just does not kill that quickly

 

[trouble93]

Here in South East Ohio we have coal mines that have unearth under ground rivers. When I first started in this hobby I used that water(before I knew any better). No detectable levels of what we test our salt water tanks for and very high in calcium, but I sent a sample off to a lab in Columbus and what I got back was not suited in any way to support a salt water tank. It may have taken awhile for the clown to surcome to the effect of the water, but after it passed that could have effected the angel as well. just my .02

 

[rondo]

My first thought was an infection brought in by the angel, but i didn't think anything would have happened that quickly without any signs.

 

[rondo]

Just remembered, I did a 10% wc the day before a added the angel. I suppose that wc may have been contaminated somehow but I use the same bucket for all my my watter changes and to the best of my knowledge its as clean as can be.

 

[rondo]

Thanks everyone,
I think I will get an Ro/DI unit and do a few large water changes to start with. I guess the new T5s will have to wait until the "tank fund" is built back up. lol. Im also going to re-do my sump with a fuge and some macros to help with CO2 and Nitrate levels. Thanks again!

 

[rbcjoker]

"but I use the same bucket for all my my watter changes and to the best of my knowledge its as clean as can be."
I'm not trying to make you feel silly with this question, but do you use a seperate bucket for the water you take out and the water you put in? You may be cross contaminating by accident.