Water change, posted in Nano by mistake, need help - Long

[trish&dave]

Great information! If I may, like to explain my situation. We have 56 gallon tall, running for almost 3 months. We have 20 gallon sump with calarpia and ceoto, 15 lbs of mud, sand and live rock (with some clean up crew as well). Parameters have been 0 with NO2, N03, Ammonia, PO4, calcium is at 425 (down from 450 a week ago) and Alk was 2.1. PH was 8.0 (tuff to tell with Red Sea test kit, but not less than 8.0, but probably 8.2). Concerned about ALK. We are about to do a water change for the first time (because the paramerters have been so good (and nervous about it).
I have put 10 gallons of RODI water into a tub with Instant Ocean salt. We have a Maxi jet 1200 and heater in the tub. Plan to circulate for around 20 hours.
I plan to test the parameters of both before adding.
Wow, so many questions! We also have purchased a top off system which we want to add Kalkwasser when adding top off. It is a JBJ lighting ATO system. I plan to put a 5 gallon bucket behind the sump for top off. Here go the questions:
When I shut down the return, and empty 5 gallons (10%), should I turn on the return and replace the water through the sump? I have plenty of tubing and a pump.
When I set up the Kalk, can I adjust the top off to do it slow enough for a Kalk additive or should I dilute it? I was thinking of taking 1 quart of Kalk, disolving every day and adding that back to the 5 gallon bucket that will top off the sump. Maybe 1 quart of Kalk to 1 quart of RODI water (thats about what we are evaporating a day).
Sorry for the long post, I have read so much about alk, calcium, mag and their relationsip. I know my system is off. Just looking to fix it before I add any more coral.
Thanks for any advise!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[trish&dave]

OK, we just tested alk and calcium, Alk is at 1.8 and calcium is down to 400. Last night they were Calc. 425, Alk 2.1 (this is again a guess becuase we are using Red sea and it goes from 1.7 green to 2.8 blue). Last night we added 4 ml of success buffer, Iodine, molybdenum, and strodium into our fuge and 1 cap of calcium reactor (Kent brand). In the am we added probuffer DKH (kent) in am today. All tests are down. Little confuse, looking to do water change and hopefully balance everything. Just have not done it yet. We also add purple up maybe 2x per week (after getting calcium from 300 to 450), and only after we see it drop below 450.
By the way we have test kits on the way fore Seachem Magnesium, strodium, and calcium (much better that what we have from what I understand).
We have had great tests, and have purchased some frags (I know too early in the process, but confident we will do what we need to make this work and take care of our babies!

Just getting prepared for them in about a week.
Again, Please give advise!!!!!!!!!! You all have be excellent for our hobby!

 

[veni vidi vici]

Slam on the breaks trish&dave!!!!!I think you have a recipe for disaster coming your way.Dont add anymore suppliments to your water.I think you might want to slow down and evaluate whats going on .
1st off what salt mix are you using , and have you tested a new batch of SW before you put it into tank?Your alkalinity is low for meq/l and extremely low if its Dkh.You have some issues with parameters fluctuating rapidly.
You might want to take a water sample to your LFS and have them verify your test results.
I would start with that. IMO

 

[trish&dave]

Getting ready to go to bed, wish I could get some good advise from you guys. Not trying to be pushy, just know there are some experience people, especially with water change, that could provide some sound advise. We are adding several frags (several zoos, and a stag) and want to do my first water change first. I know we are rushing things, but the system is running with great parameters and we already have a frogspawn, toadstool, cup coral, and several shrooms doing excellent. We are taking a risk by adding too soon, but thought some of your advise would help us to make sure we don't #@%# things up. I am ready to get on a scheduled water change, just looking for some advise. We do 30-40% water changes on our 125 gallon cichlid tank already. They are not as sensitive, so I am looking for your help. Thanks, please respond!

 

[trish&dave]

Originally Posted by Veni Vidi Vici
http:///forum/post/2507625
Slam on the breaks trish&dave!!!!!I think you have a recipe for disaster coming your way.Dont add anymore suppliments to your water.I think you might want to slow down and evaluate whats going on .
1st off what salt mix are you using , and have you tested a new batch of SW before you put it into tank?Your alkalinity is low for meq/l and extremely low if its Dkh.You have some issues with parameters fluctuating rapidly.
You might want to take a water sample to your LFS and have them verify your test results.
I would start with that. IMO
Thanks, that is what I am looking for. We have verified at our LFS and the parameters are consistant with our readings. THat is what gave us some confidence! You all know the addiction, and unfortunitely we are subcoming to the fix! I have read and read about the balance of alk, calc. and mag. So my additives I am balancing (slowely) between them. That is why I know it is time for a water change. Plumbing has been a new experience, so each time I shut down my return (I know it wont flood, but still get nervous), I get skitish. Any thoughts on why they might be fluctuating? Would Kalk work to stablize? Coraline is growing well on our base rock, so the level of calc has been stable, but since the alk has dropped, I am getting concerned.

 

[trish&dave]

We are using Instant Ocean. Recommend anything different? Will stay up as I get responses, so thanks!

 

[matt b]

Originally Posted by trish&dave
http:///forum/post/2507656
We are using Instant Ocean. Recommend anything different? Will stay up as I get responses, so thanks!
Instant ocean is a great salt!!! and for the kalk I have never liked it, Cause just think if you add to much at once your ph is gonna spike. I would just use a two part slution like b-ionic. and for the water change just make sure the temp and sal are the same and your good. I never buffer topoff water or water change water. And for the topoff I have the same one and I just use a maxijet and a 30gal trash can for the holding of topoff water so i dont have to re fill it alot.

 

[veni vidi vici]

IMO you need to get your water stable before you add anymore livestock to your tank.Get your water parameters as close to natural sea water as possible:
Ammonia=0
PH=7.8-8.5
Salinity=1.026 sg
Calcium=380-450 ppm
Alkalinity=2.5-4 meq/l or 7-11 dkh
Magnesium=1250-1350 ppm
and then try and hold it steady there for awhile.
Something is happening with you water,either bad test or inadequate elements.Water looks to be out of whack. If i where you i would slow down and try to get it under control.

 

[trish&dave]

Originally Posted by MaTT B
http:///forum/post/2507672
Instant ocean is a great salt!!! and for the kalk I have never liked it, Cause just think if you add to much at once your ph is gonna spike. I would just use a two part slution like b-ionic. and for the water change just make sure the temp and sal are the same and your good. I never buffer topoff water or water change water. And for the topoff I have the same one and I just use a maxijet and a 30gal trash can for the holding of topoff water so i dont have to re fill it alot.
Glad to hear that is good salt! I have heard great things about kalk, but am open to other opinions, guess that is why I am asking! Right now we are using Kent pro dhk and the kent calcium reactor (supposed to have everything). But of course, Kent will recommend the use of all of them. Just checking before I make a MAJOR mistake!

 

[trish&dave]

Originally Posted by Veni Vidi Vici
http:///forum/post/2507696
IMO you need to get your water stable before you add anymore livestock to your tank.Get your water parameters as close to natural sea water as possible:
Ammonia=0
PH=7.8-8.5
Salinity=1.026 sg
Calcium=380-450 ppm
Alkalinity=2.5-4 meq/l or 7-11 dkh
Magnesium=1250-1350 ppm
and then try and hold it steady there for awhile.
Something is happening with you water,either bad test or inadequate elements.Water looks to be out of whack. If i where you i would slow down and try to get it under control.
We have Magnesium test coming. The only thing that is out of whack is low Alk, which from my research will start to alter my calcium. We are testing at least 1 time a week, most times 2. Weather permitting in KY, I will take another test to our LFS for confirmation. I did go to the big names and they do a dip stick, I laughed at them asked them if the would do chem test, and he did not know how. Guess what, wont go back there!
Vini Vide, thanks for responding! As you can see, I need some conversation on this!

 

[trish&dave]

By the way Vendi, unfortunately we have already made the purchase. Now I am nervous and want to have things set up before it arrives. So I guess I am in a little of a pickle, if your will!

 

[matt b]

Originally Posted by trish&dave
http:///forum/post/2507699
Glad to hear that is good salt! I have heard great things about kalk, but am open to other opinions, guess that is why I am asking! Right now we are using Kent pro dhk and the kent calcium reactor (supposed to have everything). But of course, Kent will recommend the use of all of them. Just checking before I make a MAJOR mistake!
I use to use super dkh and turbo cal from kent and I loved it! I just didnt like having to add one one day and the other the other day. So i started using c balanced two part. Kalk is good I just dont like it.

 

[trish&dave]

Originally Posted by MaTT B
http:///forum/post/2507726
I use to use super dkh and turbo cal from kent and I loved it! I just didnt like having to add one one day and the other the other day. So i started using c balanced two part. Kalk is good I just dont like it.
Thanks for the advise, I will look into that!

 

[veni vidi vici]

Your welcome,
You have been reading how Calcium ,Alkalinity,and Magnesium ions all work together to create a stable balance,so your already ahead of the game.If it where me,i wouldnt add any more buffers or supplements to your water.I would do a water change or 2,and when you new test kits arrive test your salt and your tank water and check what the differences are. You should get an idea from your new salt water batch an idea of what your going to need to supplement if anything at all.

 

[t316]

Dave, my recomendation is this...don't add any more additives to your tank at all, NOTHING. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. First things first, start doing the water changes, and feel comfortable about it. It's no big deal. And you shouldn't worry about shutting everything down and having an overflow. Just turn it all off and see what happens. Once everything is off and leveled out, remove 5-10 gals and replace it with your mixed water (Instant Ocean is a good brand salt for now). After 3-4 weeks of regular water changes, then re-evaluate if you need all these additives. If your current corals are doing fine, why add all this stuff? I wouldn't add the kalkwasser right now either. Until you see corals having a problem from lack of calcium, what's the need?

 

[veni vidi vici]

Originally Posted by trish&dave
http:///forum/post/2507723
By the way Vendi, unfortunately we have already made the purchase. Now I am nervous and want to have things set up before it arrives. So I guess I am in a little of a pickle, if your will!
What type of coral did you purchase?

 

[veni vidi vici]

Originally Posted by trish&dave
http:///forum/post/2507718
We have Magnesium test coming. The only thing that is out of whack is low Alk,
Vini Vide, thanks for responding! As you can see, I need some conversation on this!
Need to check Magnesium before you say "the only thing out of whack is low Alk"
Correct proportions of Cal,Alk,and Mag=stability

And a few other things as well......

 

[matt b]

Originally Posted by Veni Vidi Vici
http:///forum/post/2507762
Need to check Magnesium before you say "the only thing out of whack is low Alk"
Correct proportions of Cal,Alk,and Mag=stability

And a few other things as well......
Mag IMO is not really a big deal at this point. IO will give him what he needs if he only has a few corals

 

[veni vidi vici]

Originally Posted by MaTT B
http:///forum/post/2507772
Mag IMO is not really a big deal at this point. IO will give him what he needs if he only has a few corals
It isnt a big deal if you dont mind your water being unstable.IMO
You can add all the suppliments you like ,but if Mag is low then you run the risk of calcium carbonate precipitation.

 

[trish&dave]

Originally Posted by Veni Vidi Vici
http:///forum/post/2507745
What type of coral did you purchase?
Well, a zoo (long lash eagle eye), a neon candy cane, and (I know I should not have, but dying to try for the price) two acropora: green slimer and blue polyped tort. Total price for all was less than $40. I am dedicated to it, so if I have a problem, I will do everything to fix it. So the willingness (and addiction) has provoked me to make some purchases! I know you all know what I am talking about!