Well, this is rediculous.....

[motohead]

um,no crm.it is called actually,techinically,12/2 or 14/2 or 6/3 or 8/4.these numbers i have just typed out refer to the wire size first example being 12 then slash then the number of conductors that are INSULATED.sure,bare wire will conduct electricity,but are you going to purposely use it to conduct say for a plug.uh,no.guess ya need to go on over to home depot and check it out for yourself.what you will find is boxes of romex labeled 12/2.but lo and behold there will be a bare ground for a total of three wires.one being bare,the rest insulated.if you go ask an electrician for 12/3,you are going to get a piece of wire that has three insulated conductors and one bare wire.hence that is why we call it 12 2 with a ground........................

 

[motohead]

lol @nflnut.you know,i do apologize for barking.specially to sevenley cuz i sure did not mean her or anyone in particular.it just gets kind of disheartening to go look at jobs and the homeowner tries to tell you how to do it.and then on top of that you know it is wrong the way they want it.i know some people are not like that,they just want to get the job done and get it done right which is where i think seven is coming from.but alot of folks just wanna cheap out and do it the cheddar way.which is why me and alot of other Electricians i know and work with will not even do side jobs for people they or friends do not know.i myself am a Industrial Electrician,meaning i work in a Petrochemical plant.i have done alot of commercial work over the years also.when i first started doing this crap about 20 years ago,i worked for one contractor working residentail and i quit after 6 months.too much work and too little money.now,i just work at the plant and do side work.just finished doing a total rewire on a 1500 sq ft house for a woman at the plant and that will be the extent of my sidework for the year.i get so burnt out on it.probably the reason why sevne and others have a hard time finding someone to do the work is because there is very little money in residential work.alot of contractors are not doing it anymore.focusing more on commercial and industrial.sure,to someone at home,like myself,200 dollars seems like alot of money for 2 hours work.but look at it in their perspective.how many of those jobs can thwey line up for the week?certainly not enough to pay rent on a shop,run a truck,pay for bonding,workmans comp,and so forth.the money is in the big jobs.there are folks out there who specialize in this type of work,and i think there should be plenty in houston for seven.you just got to find em.so once again,i apologize for sounding like an ass.certainly did not want to make enemies out of such great folks.i was on a roll i guess.lemme know how much money you wanna pay me for the sensor on the light.maybe i can hook ya up.lets say about 600 bucks?????

 

[crm13]

"ummm (who still uses that.

)"...moto, I guess I was just thinking that in your post, you mentioned lingo as if that was the primary point of denny's post. He was just giving a friendly opinion, even with a funny at the end. I guess he could have just as well offered the same point and opinion if he left "3 conductor" out of the whole post altogether. I am sure we would all come home from home depot with the right wire, even without the help of an electician. Pull the plate, count 'em up. No lingo needed... which by the way was elegantly explained. 12/2, 14/3, 12 gauge, 14 gauge.... it's pretty clever that whole nomenclature thing. I'm gonna look at that a while, maybe even stop at home depot, check it out ... becuase if I don't get this straight, I may have to call an electrician.

 

[nflnutswif]

You guys are great for having such a skill! I know nothing about electricity as most average housewives I suppose. "moto" you threw out that $600.00 without even knowing the job and you are not far off! The bid I have been given is $500! I never expected my $100 light fixture to cost so much to install. It's getting done, so is the recess lighting job in my kitchen, for a whoppin $400 and the access is already there!
Oh well. . . I'm tryin to talk my 19 year old son to take up the trade, definately beneficial!

 

[sevenley]

No problem Moto! I can see where you're coming from too. It is expensive for electricians, contractors, carpenters....to keep a business going; like you said with all the licenses, equip. etc. needed you have to be able to keep the business running.
Still friends?
Update on my quest for an electrician: I haven't heard from the guy who was supposed to get back to me early this week to schedule the installation of my outlet. Perhaps I should go with a "handyman?" I live in Indiana, PA. I've run out of names in the yellow pages.
Lee

 

[motohead]

welp seven,man i like to say that name.lol.reminds me of "seven of nine" on star trek.member her?i do.hehe.anyway,do you have the pennysaver or american classifieds there in indy?there are usually good residential electricians in there.as far as handymen go,just make sure that they follow codes.dont let them overload a breaker.a good bet is to have them run a brand new circuit for that plug.also have them install a junction box in the attic or under the house whichever may be the case so that when you want to add new plugs in the future,you have a fresh circuit to work with and also a point to grab the circuit from already there(new junction box).man i wish i could help ya'll out.too bad we fellow tankers live so far apart.bein a fish head,i would probably cut a break in the deal for ya.lol.sucks dont it???? nfl nut, 500 seems like alot to me to add a light to your house.but of course i do not know the extent of the job so maybe i should shut up now.and seven,of course still friends

 

[motohead]

oh ya nut,the electrical trade is a good one for a young man to get into.best thing to do is join the union if it is strong in your area.they have a great 4 year apprenticeship program.I.B.E.W(international brotherhood of electrical workers) the only thing that sucks about it is the pay is not that great till they finish the program.another good one to get into if not interested in the union is associated building and contractors.(ABC}.they also have a 4 year program.not as in depth as union though.it is a great trade to get into once past the apprentice phase.sparkies at the plant i work at make 29 bux an hour.

 

[swnewb]

Originally posted by motohead
500 seems like alot to me to add a light to your house.but of course i do not know the extent of the job so maybe i should shut up now.and seven,of course still friends

Yeah it does. I re-wired my entire house a couple months ago for less. But of course that was just material, the labor (me) was free .

 

[pyro f/x]

Wow, definitely some strong opinions on "sparkys". I can tell you that I can see both sides to this thread. Make no mistake about it knowledge is the key. National code must be used for a safe install. I should know, here in chicago we have one of the strictest codes in the country. I myself put in a hard days work for a good paycheck with great benifits for myself and family and am not ashamed in the least bit. But please remember in the long run that your putting your family's lives in some "sparkys" hands if things aren't done safely

. I only wish there was some way I could help you out . I agree that 175.00 seems far if there is access from the basement and there's room in the panel, but I'm not there looking at it. Hope all goes well keep us informed.

 

[sevenley]

Thanks everyone! I just dug the pennysaver out of the garbage yesterday to see if I could find an ad for a handyman.
I feel like this has got to be the biggest stumbling block in my decision to set up a SW tank. I think, at this point, that if I would have known, I would have just skipped the whole thing. I don't even feel like buying more equipment. Maybe I'll take a trip to a LFS this weekend so I can get excited again.
In the meantime, that 42 gal. hex sure makes a nice pedestal for my two cats.
Moto: I'm not sure how I thought of this username. It goes back to the days when I did the personal ads and it just short of stuck.
Lee

 

[denny80688]

wow this thread has gone a bit wild :thinking: My bad about the 3 conductor - 12/2 thing.... Im no electrician but my dad is a "sparky" working for the Union as a foreman doing commercial work. So because of him, I have a small amount of hands-on experiance doing elctrical work. I have no formal training... I see 3 wires I think 3 conductor
THe bottom line is I think $300 is crazy for one outlet just like $500 - $600 sounds crazy for an outdoor light when you say there is access to do the work! :scared:

 

[nflnutswif]

[THe bottom line is I think $300 is crazy for one outlet just like $500 - $600 sounds crazy for an outdoor light when you say there is access to do the work! :scared: [/B]
The situation with the outdoor sensor light is, $500.00 for it being mounted just under the upstairs window above a garage door! There is no attic access and no outlet near by, I want the switch inside the garage near a back door! I understand now that it is a little more involved than I ever thought!
The recess light fixtures: $400.00 to install 2 in the ceiling of my kitchen. I have dome (?) light fixtures up there now that will be replaced, so the access is already there.
Does this sound fair?

 

[motohead]

well if ya'll ever need a little bit of advice electrically i will be willing to try and help.
motohead5@hotmail.com