What am I doing wrong?

irishpenny

New Member
We just purchased a 50 gal tank so that we could start our saltwater aquarium. We got the filter, lighting. heater, thermostat and live sand.
We put the sand and water in the tank and got the filter going. We were told by the clerk that we should start out with damselfish before getting into the more expensive and colorful fishes. They told us to wait two days until the tank has settled from the sand dust. When that day came, we got 6 damselfishes. We were instructed on how to place the fishes in the water. Leave them in the bag for 15 mins, then add a cup of our water to it, let it sit another 15 minutes and then we could place them in our tank, but do not put the water that they came in, in our tank. So, we used a net to get the little fishes out. All of them bit the dust thru the night somehow.
We went back to the store (this is just an aquarium store) and the clerk was surprised they all died, even when we got the okay to put the fishes in. Somehow I thought maybe the tank wasn't quite cleared from the sand dust, this was the cause of them dying. The clerk said that shouldn't of been a problem. So he offered to replace the fishes with four more.
We decided to wait a few more days till the tank was very clear.We got those micro filters which we cleaned every few hours to help make the water get clearer.
Today, we went back to the store with our sample of the water. They tested it and everything came out normal....so we the other four damselfishes. Did the same procedure of preparing them for our tank.
Within 5 hours, they all died. I understand there may be stress factor in this, but I can't understand how all 9 fishes total since day one can all die. Seems impossible to get the fishes stress free from the store to the tank.
Perhaps I am not putting them in the tank the right way, but I did follow the instructions of transporting. Perhaps the tank wasn't ready for them...I really don't know. The clerks seem to make it sound so simple, you buy the fishes and just put them in the tank. I know there is more to that. We had read some books and everything we are doing, we are doing right (so we think).
I keep reading something about cycle...is this something I am not being told by the clerks....tank needs to be filtered a week or so before you bring the first fish home.
I hope someone can help me, because I don't know how much more my granddaughter can take toilet bowl funerals. I will appreciate any advice or help you can give me. I really would like to have a sucessful aquarium.
Thanks
 

iwantacans

Member
k first off... welcome to the most addictive hobby of all.. 50 gallon ehhh in 8 months your gunna wish you spent the extra 100 bucks n got the 120, but thats another story for another time... do you have any live rock? if so it is cure or uncured? whats the salinity of your tank? when you say your peramiters are fine what do you mean, what are your readings?
lastly the best way to acclimate fish is get a 5 gal bucket... float the bag for 30 min or so with the lights off to temp acclimate. next empty the bag into the buck and get a slow drip going by using airline tubing and tying a knot. the tighter you go the less it will drip. i get a 1 drip a sec going... i do this till the bucket is 3/4 full.. i thin drain out half and do it over...once again till half full. then i fish em out and place in my tank or qt tank...
 

blemmy_guy

Active Member
You poor thing!! Well ill do my best but wait for more answers too, but a cycle usually last around 6 weeks, then you can put fish in . Your amonia has to spike then go back to Zero first. Im really not too good at this part, do a search on Cycles at the top of the page and read everything you can on them, i think your questions will be answered there. Sorry but lfs arnt too bright sometimes! lol, Welcome to the boards Todd
 

mbrands

Member

Originally posted by IrishPenny
I keep reading something about cycle...is this something I am not being told by the clerks....tank needs to be filtered a week or so before you bring the first fish home.

Freshwater tanks cycle in about a week. Saltwater tanks, especially those without live rock, will take around 6 weeks to cycle. Your water probably tested "fine" because nothing at all has happened yet.
 

irishpenny

New Member
So basically what you are saying that it is not wise to set up a tank and put fishes in it a few days later. I can't understand why the clerk who owns the aquarium store wouldn't even tell us that. He made it sound like all you do is put the water in it and immediately after, you can put the fishes in.
You mentioned salinity...that tested fine too. But from what I am gathering here...the anmonia, ph, nitrites, nitrates and what other stuff can change day after day after starting up the tank.
How will I know when it is safe after I do the cycle (will read up on that). I am thinking maybe I don't have the knack for this, but if others can do it sucessfully, I am sure I can.
My granddaughters are anxiously waiting for "Nemo", but he's not going into the tank till I am 99% sure he will be safe, cause I certainly wouldn't want them to be around for his toiletbowl funeral..lol.
I don't have live sand nor live rocks....is that something that should be placed in the tank. The sand that is in it is called...ummm....agronate...something like that.
Thanks for your replies...I have a feeling I will really like this group...once I can get a fish to live..lol.
 

iwantacans

Member

Originally posted by IrishPenny
So basically what you are saying that it is not wise to set up a tank and put fishes in it a few days later. I can't understand why the clerk who owns the aquarium store wouldn't even tell us that. He made it sound like all you do is put the water in it and immediately after, you can put the fishes in.
You mentioned salinity...that tested fine too. But from what I am gathering here...the anmonia, ph, nitrites, nitrates and what other stuff can change day after day after starting up the tank.
How will I know when it is safe after I do the cycle (will read up on that). I am thinking maybe I don't have the knack for this, but if others can do it sucessfully, I am sure I can.
My granddaughters are anxiously waiting for "Nemo", but he's not going into the tank till I am 99% sure he will be safe, cause I certainly wouldn't want them to be around for his toiletbowl funeral..lol.
I don't have live sand nor live rocks....is that something that should be placed in the tank. The sand that is in it is called...ummm....agronate...something like that.
Thanks for your replies...I have a feeling I will really like this group...once I can get a fish to live..lol.

the lfs was trying to make money off of you,,
yes add lr first that will see your sand.. after youve added the lr let it cycle. this takes usually 4-6 weeks.... then after water perameters are fine you can add fish... but slowly
 

leona

Member
Go get yourself a saltwater test kit that has ph,nitrite,ammonia,nitrates. SO that YOU can keep an eye
on your tank. Buy yourself some LR. To start your cycle you could feed your imaginary fish or put a raw shrimp in the tank. This would help you cycle a little faster. We cycled completly in 4 weeks. So it just depends. What is your temp? It is always good to have your levels ready for us to look at. Your PH might be low that could be the reason why your damsels are dying. We used damsels in our tank to help cycle it. So in a "SMall" way your LFS is right. But in a small way. Now if he tells you to put inverts in DON"T. Not until you fully cycle.
If there is any other questions please feel free to ask.
Leona
 

howardcu

Member
A lot of pet stores that carry a limited amount of saltwater species do not have knowledgable employees. They have the pretty and cheap blue damsels that they try to sell to after having your tank setup for only a few days. I actually would not recomend using them to cycle your tank if you are going to have more peaceful community fish. I had 5 to cycle my 55 about 3 years ago when I started and they killed off many new fish within a week of the new one's arrival. They would terrorize everything except my clowns relentlessly. Even a fridmani dottyback. Oh and as an example of the knowledge base of some pet shops I wish share my experience earlier this week. I was looking at a store I had never been in before in a mall and noticed they had saltwater tanks and of course was drawn to them. Not only were they absolutely filthy, but they didn't even know what fish they had. They had a royal dottyback marked as a royal gramma! I can understand someone completely new seeing the half magenta, half yellow fish and thinking that it was a royal gramma, but a pet store? Plus who knows where they got it from. What dealer wouldn't be able to tell the difference between a dottyback and a basslet. I informed the clerk so that some unsuspecting customer wouldn't come along and have their peaceful community tank wiped out by a particularly nasty dottyback.
 

loopy

Member
I listened to the lfs and did everything wrong, fish too soon, geez, you name it...it went wrong. THEN I found this site, it is a great deal of help. I had some MAJOR problems from adding fish too soon, and too many fish...again too soon. Patience is the key hear, and this site is the keyhole. You'll so fine....probably a lot better than me!!!!! Good luck.....I know about the 'kids and Nemo' thing...lol....just tell them Nemo is not ready to move in yet, he'll miss his dad!!!!! Good luck....and for future reference, anything you don't know or are not sure of...ask here, you'll get an answer, lots of them. BTW, did you add bio sphere to 'push' the cycle? The lfs gave it to me and then add the fish. Doesn't work that way, but I think the BS is a good thing to add. Opinions may vary on this, and...I AM NOT ONE TO TAKE ADVICE FROM..LOL:jumping:
 

iwantacans

Member

Originally posted by Loopy
..I AM NOT ONE TO TAKE ADVICE FROM..LOL:jumping:

not true, the advice you give is right on not what to do... use this experiance to understand why and give that advice.. your doing great, asking questions...:)
 

someone400

Member
Just my two cents worth but, I had the same problem with damsels that howardcu had. I used them to cycle my tank and left them in when I started to add the more expensive fish. The damesls being very territorial ended up killing several of them. I would recommend using green chromis (sp?) to cycle your tank instead. They are a very calm and gentle fish. :)
 

howardcu

Member
I agree with the green chromis theory. They are just as cheap and hardy, yet not evil. I also had a three spotted damsel when cycling and it was just as evil if not more so than the blue ones. I actually refer to them as the blue b@sta@rds to this day. I will never forgive them for what they did to my poor little jawfish and even worse a Scott's Fairy Wrasse...he was so beuatiful. Sigh.
 

leona

Member
I will have to agree with the Blue Devil Damsels. BUT. I currently STILL have my 2 other damsels that we used to cycle our tank. It's been going on 8 months. 3 stripe damsel and a yellow tail damsel. But i would agree about the chromis also. They are a peace keeping fish that you will enjoy in your tank.
We used and still use stess zyme in our tank with the bioligical filter
Leona
 

someone400

Member
I didn’t have the heart to ‘flush’ my damsels but my last one died thankfully. What I lost to the ‘evil’ fish was a fire fish, several shrimps (I wondered why the antennas on my cleaner shrimp kept growing shorter and shorter), and a few others. Needless to say, I lost several times worth ($$) of fish to the damsel. :D
Alot of what I have discovered is trial and error which may be the best way to learn sometimes. It is a hobby that I have grown to love. Hang in there and things will work out. :)
 

bjgwilliam

Member

Originally posted by Loopy
Patience is the key hear, and this site is the keyhole. You'll so fine....probably a lot better than me!!!!! Good luck.....I know about the 'kids and Nemo' thing...lol....just tell them Nemo is not ready to move in yet, he'll miss his dad!!!!! Good luck....and for future reference, anything you don't know or are not sure of...ask here, you'll get an answer, lots of them.:


Agreed!!!
This site has been a tremendous help for me. I know I would have made many mistakes along the way... Who knows how many fish, inverts, and coral this site has saved... Priases to those who are willing to help..
 

ophiura

Active Member
I agree with everything that has been said! :D
Now, that being said, let's look at what is going on. Because we do have here some darn tough fish, damsels...but for them all to die this quickly, that, to me, means there is something quite wrong. If you lost one or two? Ah, bad livestock...cycling tank. But we haven't even gotten far enough to cycle it!
So, when things like this happen - really sudden death of tough fish - we look at some of the big bad stuff - some sort of toxin:
1) Used dechlorinator, right? (know it seems obvious but worth asking)
2) No windex, cleansers, lysol, carpet cleaner, painting, smelly stuff, lotion, soap, etc near the tank - or on your hands when near the tank? If you can smell it, it can get in the tank.
3) No use of a kitchen sponge (even new) in the tank, when it was wiped off or something?
4) temperature somewhere around 78 - 82?...do you have a reading on your specific gravity...and I agree on purchasing a high quality test kit for you home use.
5) In addition to cycling the tank with live rock and/or a couple of shrimp from the grocery store (save money!!), I would get some carbon and a polyfilter.
There are some other resins that might be of use if there are still issues with it, but I am concerned at this point as to why these fish all died suddenly. :thinking: :notsure:
 

mbrands

Member
ophiura,
I'm not sure if you realized it, but bjgwilliam brought up a thread that hadn't been posted to for over a month. Hopefully, IrishPenny's issues are resolved by now.
That being said, your posting has a lot of great information/suggestions and should still help a lot of people.
:D
Also, if you read this . . . should I give my cc star a shot at living amongst soft corals by trying to feed him daily, or trade him in? I'd really miss the guy, but not at the expense of a high priced coral. I know others who use this site have been able to do it successfully. (sorry about borrowing the old thread :D )
 

ophiura

Active Member
Oops :D
Well, it would be interesting to hear how things are going...but maybe there are other posts on it :D
Your CC with corals is a risk - even with feeding. Definitely no guarantees, I am afraid :( Sometimes it will work...sometimes it will work until one day....So you'll have to weigh the pros and cons and figure what you are willing to risk. Sorry for this(probably not unexpected) answer on CC with corals.
 

ophiura

Active Member
Of course, being an seastar fan, I would risk it... :) But don't let that sway you. If any of my stuff got eaten I would probably say (baby star talk) "didjou havagoood little snacky my good pretty little starypoo? Yur such a big predatory star, yes you are!!"
How about setting up a nano for it?
 
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