what to cycle a tank with
- Thread starter fishy88
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richard rendos
Active Member
I voted damsels but prefer the live rock method. I don't understand why everyone says uncured LR though. Cured LR works great too!
wamp
Active Member
Well, I tell you what, those shrimp never had a chance at a good life!!!!! So, you use one type of animal that was horribly caught in a net, killed by sufication and then frozen... WHAT is the diffrence?
this is meant as a sort of joke BUT what makes one life more valuable than another in our hobby?
Me, I use damsels. I always have and always will. I have only lost very few in cycling a tank. A cycle, if done correctly, will have a very small spike tat most fish can handle. It's the pepole that rush a cycle and do no water changes during the cycle that have a problem. When I start a tank. It takes about 2-3 months before the last level completly goes to 0. I prolong them and do frequent water changes. I like to let the nitrogen cycle mature slowly. I have had better results and longer life in my tanks using this techniqe. So, it works for me. Than agiain, I have set up over 15 tanks so, it took a while to get it down to an art for me.
this is meant as a sort of joke BUT what makes one life more valuable than another in our hobby?
Me, I use damsels. I always have and always will. I have only lost very few in cycling a tank. A cycle, if done correctly, will have a very small spike tat most fish can handle. It's the pepole that rush a cycle and do no water changes during the cycle that have a problem. When I start a tank. It takes about 2-3 months before the last level completly goes to 0. I prolong them and do frequent water changes. I like to let the nitrogen cycle mature slowly. I have had better results and longer life in my tanks using this techniqe. So, it works for me. Than agiain, I have set up over 15 tanks so, it took a while to get it down to an art for me.
fireeater
Member
this is meant as a sort of joke BUT what makes one life more valuable than another in our hobby?
Wamp,
I think maybe the answer to the question lies where you live or grew up.
I have lived on the gulf coast all my life. I have caught all sorts of things in nets and fishing.
I'll use shrimp as an example here;
I grew up eating them, catching them, using them as bait and so forth. So to me they are expendable.
I would have no problem using mud minnows to cycle a tank as they are also used as bait here. Catch big flounders with them!
I had an atlantic spadefish in my tank that I caught in a net. I had to get him out as he started eating the wrong stuff in the tank. I was so mad at him I tried to kill him to get him out. Once again, a fish we use as bait to catch sharks.
Now a damsel to me is a fish you keep in a sw tank for looks. They are pretty and I do not eat them or have never used them as bait. This goes for the other sw fish we keep in our tanks as opposed to eating.
I had a big mouth bass in my fw tank once. When he died (didn't medicate him in time) after I had him for about 4 months, it was really no big deal to me as I catch them to eat not raise them in tanks. I can just go catch another one when I want one in my tank again.
Now to try and make sense of all my ramblin on.
For those of us that did not grow up where our sw tank fish are from, we pay good money to put them in our tanks. So we care for them and spend alot of time doing so.
The people that are living where our fish are from view them differently, they most likely use them for bait or food and not think twice about how pretty they are.
Imagine some person in another country having all his friends over for a shrimp boil. They are peppermints, cleaners, blood shrimp, ect...heheh.
Hope I made some sense here....maybe - maybe not?
Wamp,
I think maybe the answer to the question lies where you live or grew up.
I have lived on the gulf coast all my life. I have caught all sorts of things in nets and fishing.
I'll use shrimp as an example here;
I grew up eating them, catching them, using them as bait and so forth. So to me they are expendable.
I would have no problem using mud minnows to cycle a tank as they are also used as bait here. Catch big flounders with them!
I had an atlantic spadefish in my tank that I caught in a net. I had to get him out as he started eating the wrong stuff in the tank. I was so mad at him I tried to kill him to get him out. Once again, a fish we use as bait to catch sharks.
Now a damsel to me is a fish you keep in a sw tank for looks. They are pretty and I do not eat them or have never used them as bait. This goes for the other sw fish we keep in our tanks as opposed to eating.
I had a big mouth bass in my fw tank once. When he died (didn't medicate him in time) after I had him for about 4 months, it was really no big deal to me as I catch them to eat not raise them in tanks. I can just go catch another one when I want one in my tank again.
Now to try and make sense of all my ramblin on.
For those of us that did not grow up where our sw tank fish are from, we pay good money to put them in our tanks. So we care for them and spend alot of time doing so.
The people that are living where our fish are from view them differently, they most likely use them for bait or food and not think twice about how pretty they are.
Imagine some person in another country having all his friends over for a shrimp boil. They are peppermints, cleaners, blood shrimp, ect...heheh.
Hope I made some sense here....maybe - maybe not?
nacl-h2o
Active Member
Hi Richard Rendos,
The reason most people say uncured as opposed to cured is that uncured will allways have enough die off to create a larg bacterial population to support your fish when introduced. And even thou cured will usually work it will sometimes does not have enough bacteria or die off to create a larg enough bacterial population to support the fish at first and sometimes results in ammonia and or nitrite spikes that kill fish or inverts shortly after they're introduced. Alot of people prefer something that will give you a good strong filter a 100% of the time, instead of something that gets it right only 80 or 90% of the time.
The reason most people say uncured as opposed to cured is that uncured will allways have enough die off to create a larg bacterial population to support your fish when introduced. And even thou cured will usually work it will sometimes does not have enough bacteria or die off to create a larg enough bacterial population to support the fish at first and sometimes results in ammonia and or nitrite spikes that kill fish or inverts shortly after they're introduced. Alot of people prefer something that will give you a good strong filter a 100% of the time, instead of something that gets it right only 80 or 90% of the time.
fshhub
Active Member
shrimp 2d, lr and shrimp first, IMO
As for ammonia, it is probably not listed, b/c it is also not preferred, some do use ti but most do not. This one is way that is way too risky, just look at shrimp, many people use it and almost every day it has to be explained what to use again. Now, using breaded shrimp or live shrimp probably would not hurt the tank too awful much, but Using Mr Clean would be detrimental if someone used the wrong stuff.
As for ammonia, it is probably not listed, b/c it is also not preferred, some do use ti but most do not. This one is way that is way too risky, just look at shrimp, many people use it and almost every day it has to be explained what to use again. Now, using breaded shrimp or live shrimp probably would not hurt the tank too awful much, but Using Mr Clean would be detrimental if someone used the wrong stuff.
richard rendos
Active Member
NaCl-H2O
Cured live rock should have a large enough bacterial population living in it to support fish added as long as you add them slowly to allow more bacteria to grow to make up for the added bioload. If you add too many fish too quickly after cycling with cured or uncured LR you will get the same result. Plus your tank won't smell horrible while cycling if you use cured LR.
My opinion. I'm not wanting to argue, I just feel cured will do as good or better job on cycling. The only advantage I see to uncured LR is price.
Cured live rock should have a large enough bacterial population living in it to support fish added as long as you add them slowly to allow more bacteria to grow to make up for the added bioload. If you add too many fish too quickly after cycling with cured or uncured LR you will get the same result. Plus your tank won't smell horrible while cycling if you use cured LR.
My opinion. I'm not wanting to argue, I just feel cured will do as good or better job on cycling. The only advantage I see to uncured LR is price.
slowest is fastest
Member
Something perhaps that is being overlooked is that benificial bacteria IMHO will only live if there is something in the tank to support them. Uncured live rock may result in a larger die off and subsequently more initial benificail bacteria are produced to convert the ammonia but afterwards without food they die also (perhaps even prolonging the cycle time or adding to the severity) Cured live rock may not produce as many additonal colonies of bacteria initially but 10lbs of uncured vs 10 lbs of cured will support the same quanity of bacteria after the tank has stabilized. Perhaps if one could time the introduction of livestock with the overpopulation of initial bacteria then a measurable benifit might be seen. IMHO once water conditions are right the bacteria will grow and take care of itself. I also try to use cured LR (if there really is such a thing) and IME I get a much milder "first cycle" after which by proceeding slowly I have never had a problem. So for me at least "cured" LR has worked 100% of the time.
No offense meant, no harm intended.
SiF
No offense meant, no harm intended.
SiF
sal t. nutz
Member
I am using pure Ammonia also. Seems to be working just fine. As far as it being "Too Risky", that just isn't true. It is actually the least risky way. You add ONLY Ammonia and no other contaminates like you do when you add dead shrimp. Also, the amount of ammonia can be exactly dosed, which cannot be done with any other method mentioned here.
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