lots of sps help please!

[runn3rb3an]

ok so I set up my frag tank and have been having problems with my sps ever since. Right now I have a glo t5 unit and a nanocube hood jerry-rigged over it until I get my leds which are in transit. I am dosing calk, mg and alk but i think my problem might be the lighting. Everything is basically losing color and its gotten frustrating. The tank is 48x24x8 so its pretty shallow. I have taken pictures of the whole tank because i can pretty much explain it all day long and not convey whats going on. you can see a green birdsnest in the pics which is no longer much green, a red monti which is pinkish, another monti which is fading in color towards the edges, the powerheads and lighting, and whatever else.
So basically check out my flow, lighting and set up in general please! tell me whats going wrong!
oh theres a rainbow monti too, which is no longer blue

 

[runn3rb3an]

heres the tank, theres a mj 600 in the back left pointing towards the back, a ph of similar stenght on the back facing the front with a hydor flo on it so it rotates but has limited flow, and a koralia 4 on the right
Thanks so much!

 

[scott t]

I am a Newbie here, but from what I have read on SPS Corals that most if not all of them need very "Strong Lighting" most everything I have read Recommend MH lighting. If you have Strong enough T5 lighting you can get away with having them in the top 1/3 of your tank. If you do not have the light source that these Corals need then they will start bleaching and will eventually die. Also, says they Need strong flow. I would say hope that you get your Lighting soon and hope that they are not to far gone to save. Good Luck and hope this helps a little bit.
Just my .02

 

[btldreef]

I don't want to say anything without seeing your parameters posted, but I'm inclined to think that you need to lower those lights, A LOT!
Some questions:
1) What are ALL your parameters?
2) How established was this tank before you through in corals?
3) Where did the frags come from (I only ask this, because we go to the same stores and I've had some really bad batches of SPS lately and I'm wondering if it's just our local stores)
4) Did you purchase these SPS or did the frags come from tanks with much stronger lighting (MH)? If so, how strong was the lighting and how close to the coral was the lighting?
5) You say you're dosing, are you checking your readings EVERY day? Sometimes twice a day?
6) Temperature? Is it constant?

 

[runn3rb3an]

Originally Posted by BTLDreef
http:///forum/post/3291053
I don't want to say anything without seeing your parameters posted, but I'm inclined to think that you need to lower those lights, A LOT!
Some questions:
1) What are ALL your parameters?
2) How established was this tank before you through in corals?
3) Where did the frags come from (I only ask this, because we go to the same stores and I've had some really bad batches of SPS lately and I'm wondering if it's just our local stores)
4) Did you purchase these SPS or did the frags come from tanks with much stronger lighting (MH)? If so, how strong was the lighting and how close to the coral was the lighting?
5) You say you're dosing, are you checking your readings EVERY day? Sometimes twice a day?
6) Temperature? Is it constant?
What happened was I had a 90 gallon with a 40 gallon sump/fuge. I wanted a frang tank so Im selling my 90 and took my fuge with the same sand/chaeto and put it on the frag tank. After that the system ran for about a month or so before I added sps. I don't have all my params ATM but due to the fact I have a small pair of clowns in there only, whenever I test the water I get 0 on everything and ph is 8.2 to 8.3.
When I put the zoas under there as the first corals they bleached right away which suprised me. At that time the t5s were right on the tank, about 10 inches total MAX from the corals, about 6 inches of water. I then put the sps directly under the lighting because I thought they would be fine due to the bleaching of the zoas. Anyway the sps were not looking good so I added the hqi hood from my nanocube over it for good measure. Now Where caught up to present time.
The tank is at a constant 80 degrees which I think I need to lower. I got the montis from a private dealer, green birdsnest from mike at deer park (forgot the name but you know what I'm talkin about) and I hate to say it but I got a lot of nice pieces from aquahut that didn't make it.
Also I had some scans that I had to move to the corner because they were bleaching.
Also now that I think about it, the zoas I took where actually more like palys and were at the bottom of my dads tank. He had 2 bulb nova bilit changed the bulbs like 2 years ago so that quick change in lighting may have shocked it.
The sps always did well in my nano btw before the switch

 

[btldreef]

I think that it's lack of lighting to be completely honest with you.
DO NOT BUY SPS FROM AQUA HUT! As much as I love them, you're just wasting your money. I only purchase LPS and monti's from them. Their SPS has a very low survival rate, and you're taking a huge risk since it's all maricultured. I've seen the shipments when they first get unloaded from their dealer and if you saw how much comes in dead from transshipping, you'd never buy another piece from them.
Yes, I do think that the temp is a little on the high side. I haven't had luck with Mike's SPS either, AND I got red bugs from him, even after dipping, so please be careful. (His store is Tropical Island Aquariums, btw). I've started to only trust private dealers, because the local stores have garbage lately when it comes to SPS. The problem with private dealers is that they usually have a lot of wattage on the tank, you need to match that, or acclimate properly or you're going to get bleaching.
Completely off topic, but just curious, do you still have the jellies? If not, how long did they last? Don't know if you heard, my Filefish died :-( I'm looking for another one, so keep your eye out!

 

[runn3rb3an]

ahhhhh effin aqua hut. I keep telling myself not to go there, cheap prices but almost everything dies! I just recently caved in and bought a kole tang from them that seems to be doing good but i'll let you know when it hits the one moth mark, thats when they start to go!
Same with the private dealers, I been getting awsome stuff at awsome prices. Im actually going to be buying a ton of stuff wholesale and going to be getting a tax id too so i can buy corals wholesale and sell them. Let me know if your looking for anything and I can definately hook you up for cheap.
I think your right with the lighting, I was so involved with the little things that i didnt step back and see the problem right in front of me! I feel so stupid haha. I increased my lighting to two more hours a day and lowered my t5s down all the way on top of the tank. Im going to fiddle with the hqi light also. hopefully this holds me over untill i order my stupid leds finally.
Haha the jellies lasted for about a 2 months if i remember correctly. they were so neat for a while I would definately get them again if I had the right setup haha. I dont mind though thats kind of my thing, I go with the odd things like octopus, seahorses, jellies, anything keep them for a few weeks then change haha. Im so sorry to hear about your filefish!! that really stinks. If you would like I can look for some at the wholesalers once i get a tax id or from another wholesaler for you. maybe i can get a few hopefully.

 

[runn3rb3an]

what are you dipping with btw? right now im just using revive. might try coral rx

 

[nikesb]

Originally Posted by Scott T
http:///forum/post/3291049
I am a Newbie here, but from what I have read on SPS Corals that most if not all of them need very "Strong Lighting" most everything I have read Recommend MH lighting. If you have Strong enough T5 lighting you can get away with having them in the top 1/3 of your tank. If you do not have the light source that these Corals need then they will start bleaching and will eventually die. Also, says they Need strong flow. I would say hope that you get your Lighting soon and hope that they are not to far gone to save. Good Luck and hope this helps a little bit.
Just my .02
t5 lighting can penetrate over 24" with the correct fixtures.

 

[nikesb]

from the looks of the pictures, looks like your corals are getting way too much light. Thats why theyre bleaching, if they werent getting enough light, theyd be turning brown. You need to lessen your photo period, not increase it. at only 8" of water with an HQI, you're probably getting over 500 par where these corals are now, they were probably under 400 before. your flow is also pretty weak for sps. as for maricultured being less reliable in surviving, ive never had any problems no matter where the sps came from. correct care should allow them to thrive just like aquacultured ones.

 

[btldreef]

The only reason I'm telling him these maricultured are not great is because I know the specific store that they're coming from and they're shipped like garbage. The store looses 90% of it's stock in the first three days when they order SPS.

 

[nikesb]

I understand that, the lfs probably doesn't have very good water conditions either haha. The corals still look well and alive from what I see. One more thing, how many fish are in the tank? I dont see any from the pictures and this probably also helped in lightening of the colors in the sps

 

[runn3rb3an]

Really? Too much light now? I thought that at the beginning but I'm not too sure what's going on now haha. I gues that's true as far as them turning brown in less light though. So I guess ill just run the hqi or something only?
I have two small percs and a kole tang in there now but I just added the kole a few days ago. I plan on adding a sixline and possibly something else also.

 

[nikesb]

how many hours are you doing now. at that height i would only do 4-5 hours of lighting form the hqi, you could do 2 extra hours from your t5-ho since glo fixtures dont put out alot of par

 

[ibew41]

what kind of lamps are you using by brand how old are they and what are your alk and cal readings by numbers

 

[runn3rb3an]

everything is definately getting worse i went down to like 5 hours. Im going back up now

 

[btldreef]

Originally Posted by runn3rb3an
http:///forum/post/3295377
everything is definately getting worse i went down to like 5 hours. Im going back up now
I really think it's lack of flow and light
What are your water parameters? and how old are the test kits? what brand kits?

 

[spanko]

I think it is too many changes. Light acclimation is important for SPS. You went form an HQI over a nano to T-5's and HQI over an 8" tall tank. I agree with Nike here, too much light causing the bleaching.
I found this.....
It is hard to identify SPS corals in aquariums because when they grow they do not necessarily take on the shapes we are accustomed to due to the type of lighting we use, the water motion and the proximity of other corals. As a result they are hard to ID correctly in many cases.
The fact that the corals are bright in color does not necessarily mean that they are healthy.
Acropora is very prone to bleaching or loss of Zooxanthellae. Certain species are more delicate. Get input from your dealer and buy only the hardier types if you do not have a lot of experience with SPS corals yet.
Rapid growth is a sign of good health.
Bleaching is the loss of Zooxanthellae and color. This does not mean the coral is dead though. All the polyp tissue is still there. The only thing that has happened is that the symbiotic algae and pigments are gone. These corals still survive but need more care.
Sometimes the bleaching can be reversed with good lighting, good water motion, and good feeding.
SPS corals, especially Acropora types, grow rapidly if well cared for.
The following factors can cause bleaching:
Stress during shipping.
Sudden rises in temperature to over 84 degrees F.
Light shock or the too rapid switch from one type of lighting to another without giving the coral enough tim to acclimate itself to this new lighting.
Not acclimating the coral for long enough
Stress due to wrong tank water quality.
Sudden over use of GAC for too long or in too large a quantity.
Placing a coral in a shaded area after it has been used to a high amount of light creates stress. So does the opposite. Such changes need to occur slowly.
There is a big difference between bleaching and rapid tissue necrosis. The latter is loss of tissue whereas in bleaching no tissue is lost.
In RTN the polyp tissue starts to disintegrate, often at the base of the coral, and sloughs off. If water it directed at it, the tissue detaches from the coral and floats around, the tissue is dead.
What helps in fighting RTN?
Large water changes (immediately upon noticing RTN or signs of it).
By large here we mean 30 percent or more at one time

 

[insane96]

i have done very well with sps and t5 is good enough if you have good individual reflectors although halides have worked good for me also make sure you are keeping up with your calcium and alkalinity dosing you will see the benefits if you are...

 

[goobe]

Im Pretty new into the SPS scene and im still messing around with tank.
But i found that the reason my SPS were losing colour wasnt from Flow or Lighting it was the Phosphates in the water.
bought a Phosban Reactor and the colour and polps started to come back.
 
worked for me . just my 2 cents