110 Gallon FOWLR (updated 9/2/11) ITS UP!

Hey guys im putting up my new tank. It will consist of a 100gal with a 55 gal sump. The sump is an old acrylic that I had lying around, and want to get some insight as to if im on the right track or not. Here is my idea for what I want to do. Would anyone do anything different? I have heard good and not so good things about socks, also was thinking of doing a wet/dry setup. What ya think??
 

al&burke

Active Member
I think you are on the right track - I would possibly consider a skimmer in the section where you have live rock, put the live rock in the fuge section. In the fuge section you don't really need the baffle furthest to the right (as you look at your sketch) but I guess it is already there. What size pump where you thinking of running. Maybe put a bypass on the discharge side of the pump to control your flow to the DT - if your pump is over sized a bit too much, but you could always run a phos reactor or algae scrubber on the extra flow. I would stay away from the wet/dry set up I think have lots of live rock and a fuge will give you excellent results. JMHO others will chime in.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Al&Burke http:///t/387552/sump-design-on-my-fowlr-tank#post_3410876
I think you are on the right track - I would possibly consider a skimmer in the section where you have live rock, put the live rock in the fuge section. In the fuge section you don't really need the baffle furthest to the right (as you look at your sketch) but I guess it is already there. What size pump where you thinking of running. Maybe put a bypass on the discharge side of the pump to control your flow to the DT - if your pump is over sized a bit too much, but you could always run a phos reactor or algae scrubber on the extra flow. I would stay away from the wet/dry set up I think have lots of live rock and a fuge will give you excellent results. JMHO others will chime in.
The sump is baffless right now. I let it run for about an hour and the pump and returns seem to work great together. I wanted to make sure it was on the right track. I am using a dual cpr skimmer in with the lr on the left. So should I use lr and cheato instead of sand and cheato? Also should I do cheato on both sides with lr? Also I dont need the baffles on each end or can it just flow right into my fuge/sump? Sorry about the abundance of questions. This is my first sump
 

al&burke

Active Member
No problem - I don't have LR in my sump area - I have the live rock and cheato and about an inch of sand on the fuge side. You probably want to keep the cheato away from the skimmer it will get everywhere and cause problems. You don't need baffle going into the fuge. The baffle on the inlet side of the skimmer section is not a bad idea as sometimes there are bubbles produced from the drain lines, however baffles are needed after the skimmer to remove micro bubbles produced from your skimmer. Hope this helps
 

snakeblitz33

Well-Known Member
Here is a really good sump design that I know works and works well.

Description: Water from the overflow comes in on the left side of the tank. The protein skimmer can skim as much as it can and then the Under Over Under design eliminates most microbubbles, not the over under over design that you have in your sump. The water then flows to your return pump bubble free. The union (the orange thing) will let you take off your return pump to do maintenance or allow you to replace it if necessary. At the top of the pipe, you will see a red diagonal line, this is a ball valve. It may be needed to control your return pumps flow rate. It's not entirely necessary at all, but I go valve crazy when I set up new systems because I like mass customization. Anyways, the split off your main return line plumbing feeds a "relief valve" that puts some of the return pumps water back into the fuge section of your sump. Doing it this way will keep a constant water level in your fuge, and nothing will dry out if you don't add top off for a few days. The water then flows from the fuge, over the rim of the glass and into another Under Over Under baffle design that will eliminates any microbubbles from entering your return pump. This is also a very quiet sump design, where you can add blue and white filter floss between the fuge glass and the first baffle to eliminate algae from getting sucked into your return pump.
This sump also allows you to have some pretty good customization because that return pump relief valve that controls the flow in the refugium can be turned into an algae scrubber at a later time or even able to power a few other pieces of equipment (with the right size return pump of course!)
Anyways, I hope this helps. This is the way I would do it if I were you.
 

snakeblitz33

Well-Known Member
You can adjust the height of the water by increasing the baffles height toward the top of the tank. I suggest possibly doing so, since you will have more water in the return pump chamber between top offs. Then again, in a 55g sump, you have A LOT of room to do all kinds of things. Just make sure the return pump chamber is big enough so you don't have to top it off but every five to seven days. 5 gallons will last you about 5 days or less. You could go ahead and add in some egg crate in the return pump chamber for a float valve for an ATO system.
LOL! The possibilities are endless...
 

florida joe

Well-Known Member
I don’t see how this is correct. The water level in our Sump is predicated on evaporation in our DT. Now we restrict the flow back into our DT by the valve on the return which is equivalent to going with a lesser GPH pump. The slower the pump puts water back into our DT the less volume of water going back into our sump. The gph of our return is at a constant so the level of our sump must go down with evaporation and what exactly does thre valve on the return to the dt do
Quote:
Anyways, the split off your main return line plumbing feeds a "relief valve" that puts some of the return pumps water back into the fuge section of your sump. Doing it this way will keep a constant water level in your fuge, and nothing will dry out if you don't add top off for a few days
 

al&burke

Active Member
I think the OP has two separate drains lines from his DT - I would run one in the fuge and the other on the skimmer side. raising the baffles will only help to a certain extent the level will be dependent on the baffles on the skimmer side which are sized accordinly to the skimmer specs. And of course the level in the return will drop with evaporation
Joe I think if the pump was oversized a bit it would allow for some fine tuning, in this case the OP has two returns - I would put the bypass back into the skimmer side of the sump. I think he would only need one ball vave on the bypass side of the return. Typically you would want 60% of your total flow to the skimmer side and about 40% to the fuge. JMHO
 

snakeblitz33

Well-Known Member
The relief valve that is split off the main return feeds water into the refugium. The refugiums water level is kept constant because that one baffle is high enough. The OP's original diagram did not account for evaporation, because the water level in his sump diagram would not cover the algae in his refugium. You could use a drain line into the refugium in my diagram, however I recommend a spit off of the return plumbing so that you can control the flow rate.
Joe - The ball/gate valve on the return pump in my diagram would allow customization of the water flow. I've used bigger than necessary pumps in the past to power other equipment off of the main line and have had to throttle it back some to push water into the relief valve. I admit that the ball valve on the return line should actually be ABOVE the relief valve, not before it. It's NOT necessary by any means, as stated in the description that I posted with the diagram. Also, of course the return pump housing/chamber would have evaporation. That's a given.
 
OK! SO! Sorry My sump design in paint does not accurately show my sump design. The baffles are taller than shown for higher water levels and I do have a union to remove the pump. I guess im on the right track. It sounds like either way the sump is going to sump
. Snake thanks for the all the great ideas. I will switch around my baffles to rid as many of the micro bubbles as possible. I will take some pictures of the back of the tank because there is 2 more holes drilled that I have capped off. I have no clue what this people were doing! There is 5 holes big enough for returns and 1 feed.. Al thank you as well. I think Im going to do my fuge without the baffle, but I might run the loop with the valve to control flow. So many options! Well it gets finished today and you guys have helped out in a HUGE way! Thanks again. Ill load some pictures in a bit. SUMP SUMP SUMP
 

florida joe

Well-Known Member
I understand what you are saying about the refuge not running low but in that situation he runs a huge risk of the water level in the compartment with the return pump falling to low if he has a false sense of security about not checking for a top off for a few days
Quote:
Originally Posted by SnakeBlitz33 http:///t/387552/sump-design-on-my-fowlr-tank#post_3410951
The relief valve that is split off the main return feeds water into the refugium. The refugiums water level is kept constant because that one baffle is high enough. The OP's original diagram did not account for evaporation, because the water level in his sump diagram would not cover the algae in his refugium. You could use a drain line into the refugium in my diagram, however I recommend a spit off of the return plumbing so that you can control the flow rate.
Joe - The ball/gate valve on the return pump in my diagram would allow customization of the water flow. I've used bigger than necessary pumps in the past to power other equipment off of the main line and have had to throttle it back some to push water into the relief valve. I admit that the ball valve on the return line should actually be ABOVE the relief valve, not before it. It's NOT necessary by any means, as stated in the description that I posted with the diagram. Also, of course the return pump housing/chamber would have evaporation. That's a given.
 

florida joe

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by sviellvoicae http:///t/387552/sump-design-on-my-fowlr-tank#post_3410978
I top off daily but dont want something that will self destruct if I forget it for a couple of days
Good because Something else you need to consider is that the water height in your sump dramatically impacts the performance of your skimmer. Once you have established the safe and optimal water height in your system I would check daily and top off to this level as soon as possible
 

snakeblitz33

Well-Known Member
It's also recommended that when you start your system, you find your minimum and maximum amounts of water that you can fill your sump. :D Just wanted to have the last word. lol!!!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by SnakeBlitz33 http:///t/387552/sump-design-on-my-fowlr-tank#post_3411010
It's also recommended that when you start your system, you find your minimum and maximum amounts of water that you can fill your sump. :D Just wanted to have the last word. lol!!!

hahahahahahaha Yes I plan on doing this and marking it in some way so that I know. Im still re-finishing the tank but having a rough time getting it clear and not foggy. Any tips?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by florida joe http:///t/387552/sump-design-on-my-fowlr-tank#post_3411049
Do you know how to establish the optimum water volume in your system
All I did as set it up in the garage first and tested it by filling it up to where I wanted it and unplug the power. I still have about 3" of room for water left in my sump after my tank overflows into the sump without a pump for return and my return is higher than my overflow so it doesnt drain more after the overflows are done. Is this accurate? I dont see how any more water can flow into the sump.
 

snakeblitz33

Well-Known Member
Did you drill a couple of holes in the rainbow locline to stop the water siphon right at the water line of your display tank?
 
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