20+ dead at Virginia Tech...what the??

[beth]

This individual was seriously mentally disturbed, and out of touch with reality due to mental illness. It is amazing that this kid had not been removed from school just for some of the behaviors he exhibited. Being removed from school, however, would not have changed anything. This guy would have melted down anywhere, in school, or in the community.
Strength and perseverance to his victims' families.

 

[lovethesea]

The story of this seems to get worse as the survivors tell their story. Even if guns were off the streets, this still would have happened. He had DVD's and books on explosives. He was out to kill and go out in a blaze of "glory". That is why I wish the newspapers and news agencies would STOP playing the video of him.
With that said.....the main thing that is stuck in my brain is, who in this persons family was helping him? Its obvious from school/police/dorm records that he has been mentally failing for more than 2 years. WHY was he not taken out of school?? My cousins son became very depressed and started to have a "break down" in his sophmore year of college. The college became involved and my cousin and her husband jumped on this situation ASAP. They took him out of school and got him the help he needed. He was back in school the next year and everything was fine.
I am completely aware that you cannot comit someone, but ultimately this was not the schools responsibility. They tried.......even a teacher would walk him to his counceling sessions.
I don't know the answer, but I do know that families are the responsible parties for their children. This extreme mental state did not just pop up, he had a history of it in high school.
Its all very sad indeed.

 

[sepulatian]

Originally Posted by lovethesea
The story of this seems to get worse as the survivors tell their story. Even if guns were off the streets, this still would have happened. He had DVD's and books on explosives. He was out to kill and go out in a blaze of "glory". That is why I wish the newspapers and news agencies would STOP playing the video of him.
With that said.....the main thing that is stuck in my brain is, who in this persons family was helping him? Its obvious from school/police/dorm records that he has been mentally failing for more than 2 years. WHY was he not taken out of school?? My cousins son became very depressed and started to have a "break down" in his sophmore year of college. The college became involved and my cousin and her husband jumped on this situation ASAP. They took him out of school and got him the help he needed. He was back in school the next year and everything was fine.
I am completely aware that you cannot comit someone, but ultimately this was not the schools responsibility. They tried.......even a teacher would walk him to his counceling sessions.
I don't know the answer, but I do know that families are the responsible parties for their children. This extreme mental state did not just pop up, he had a history of it in high school.
Its all very sad indeed.
It was in the paper today again, depicting how much he adored and tributed the boys that shot up Collumbine. He thought they had the right idea. This is exactly the reason that quotes, and details should not be publicized. Reading the article today, I was thinking that this is just going to inspire more people to handle their lack of acceptance in this manner. That is exactly the legend the Collumbine shooters wanted. We cannot realy blame college security any more than we can blame international security for 911. Hindsight is always 20/20. Sure there were clues that something might happen, but who would have actually expected it? My heart goes out to all of the victims and their families.

 

[alyssia]

I agree with Sep and Lovethesea. The media glorifies (is that a word?) these nut jobs and that is exactly what they want.

 

[shogun323]

Originally Posted by alyssia
I agree with Sep and Lovethesea. The media glorifies (is that a word?) these nut jobs and that is exactly what they want.
Me too. I agree. I feel that the media enables these kids to leave a legacy and "raise the bar."
Tragically, I believe the next time it happens the person will be saying to themselves, "32 victims... I can beat that."

 

[sepulatian]

Originally Posted by shogun323
Me too. I agree. I feel that the media enables these kids to leave a legacy and "raise the bar."
Tragically, I believe the next time it happens the person will be saying to themselves, "32 victims... I can beat that."
Yes, wasn't columbine 30 victims, then the two who shot themselves? Now this kid did 32 then himself, the count is now 33 for the largest school massacre (including himself). In the paper today, people are publicly speakng about stopping the video he left behind from being shown for these reasons. People that knew him say that he was a loner and kept to himself. In the vidio he is depicted as a warrior out to destroy those who "kept him down" . He was a huge follower of the columbine boys. They stated in the paper that the media is doing exactly what he wanted. They are showing him as a "hero" of sorts to the kids that have issues, instead of showing him as the loner that he was. They are portraying him in an image that can be construed as a hero, when he was actually (according to those that knew him) a coward that always hid from problems.

 

[tx reef]

The shooting at Luby's in Killeen, Texas (20 miles to the west of where I live) held the national record with 24 killed including the suicide of the shooter.
As far as just schools, the guy that shot all those students out of the tower at the University of Texas in Austin (60 miles south of where I live) held the record...until Virginia Tech.
Everything bad happens in Texas......

 

[alyssia]

Originally Posted by sepulatian
Yes, wasn't columbine 30 victims, then the two who shot themselves? Now this kid did 32 then himself, the count is now 33 for the largest school massacre (including himself). In the paper today, people are publicly speakng about stopping the video he left behind from being shown for these reasons. People that knew him say that he was a loner and kept to himself. In the vidio he is depicted as a warrior out to destroy those who "kept him down" . He was a huge follower of the columbine boys. They stated in the paper that the media is doing exactly what he wanted. They are showing him as a "hero" of sorts to the kids that have issues, instead of showing him as the loner that he was. They are portraying him in an image that can be construed as a hero, when he was actually (according to those that knew him) a coward that always hid from problems.

Hi, Sep! Columbine was actually around 13 victims. I agree with everything else you said though. We need to stop making these killers out to be heros!

 

[seasalt101]

Originally Posted by alyssia
Hi, Sep! Columbine was actually around 13 victims. I agree with everything else you said though. We need to stop making these killers out to be heros!
agreed i think glorifying any of these mass killings need to be addressed by the press something like tragedy struck (fill in the blank) whatever the victim count and then in other news, the press also doesn't need to tell the world about what are military is doing let them do there job then after that mission is complete then tell us what happened, not what we are going to do next, they tell us and the enemy, freedom of the press goes to far in alot of situations sadly just for the ratings jmo...tobin

 

[1journeyman]

Originally Posted by windmill
...... It's easier that way because real people will judge and criticize and reject you and make fun of you if you don't conform to their standards.....
Kids can be cruel, no doubt. Having said that, I've yet been to a college campus where students couldn't find a crowd to belong to. We're talking about college.
Self esteem issues can lead to social disfunction, but you can't blame society for this. You can either conform to society, set yourself apart and show your value to society, or grow a thick skin and deal with it. Shooting up the world and blaming folks for not accepting you is just evil. Beth said it right, this guy was sick.
I'm all for the underdog. I'm all for teaching tolerance and acceptance. What I am not for, however, is teaching people it's perfectly ok to choose to act like a goofball and be "accepted". If you choose a lifestyle that makes you different than the "norm" you've got to be willing to accept the consequences.
Using your cell phone to take pictures up girls' skirts in class doesn't help your chances of being accepted in society...

 

[lovethesea]

and remember this person did not just have self esteem issues. He had serious mental issues that I am guessing were glossed over by his family and festered for many years.
A comment by a Korean family member stated that he had "problems" for many years even before he left S. Korea. Kids from high school to college tried to reach out to him, but his "mute" ways and grunting, staring and general demeanor I am guessing scared people.

 

[beth]

While everyone knows all the clicks that develop in high school from cheerleaders and jocks, to Goths and freaks, and even nerds and brainers, in college the atmosphere is different. There is a live and led live attitude with young adults on campus, especially for those living in dorms. I know, I went to a few colleges in my day, and resided in dorms as well. I don't think we can look for the same kind of trigger in VT shooting as we found in Columbine. Cho was deranged, IMO, and while the Columbine kids were obviously emotionally disturbed and irrationally enraged, I'm not sure they were delusional.