A question for mboswell1982

locoyo386

locoyo386

Member
Hi there mboswell1982,
I was reading a thread that is tittled "Would this be good to start with??" You posted a comment on this thread, it was number #3 post. You typed "a bio wheel is crap for saltwater, its a huge nitrate trap"
Would you be kind and elavorate more on this concept. Not sure I understand that idea. I would appreciate your responce, thanks.
P.S. If any one else has a comment, please feel free to post.
 
1990jpyj

1990jpyj

Member
im not 100% sure on what it does but after i took my bio-wheel off my tanks nirate droped by 5, bringing me back down to zero. i didnt change anything else other then removing the wheel. so it is true
 
stanlalee

stanlalee

Active Member
well thats what a biowheel is designed to do (host aerobic bacteria that break down ammonia to nitrate). its not a nitrate "trap". a nitrate "trap" is something that accumulates detritus like mechanical fitration pads. nitrate traps dont process ammonia. like a wet dry filter the high surface area (from bioballs, biowheel whatever) exposed to air colonizes aerobic bacteria. this is very effective at breaking down ammonia. nitrates are the last phase of the nitrogen cycle unless you have something that utilizes it (algae, anaerobic bacteria deep within large peices of liverock or deep sand bed). this is perfectly fine in a fish only aquarium and actually the most effective means of breaking down ammonia quickly (read allows for a higher bioload). its bad in a reef tank because you dont want nitrates (hence one usually tries to keep a low to moderate bioload and utilize lots of liverock, macro algae or deep sand beds to utilize the nitrates produced)
 
U

usirchchris

Guest
Guess it would depend on the application...as in a FOWLR vs REEF tank, but going from 0-5 would hardly be classified as a nitrate factroy if you are talking fish only. In a reef I suppose it would (which I am sure the above poster has), but in fish only applications 5 is nothing and nitrates are not much to worry about. Just wanted to differentiate the two.
Biowheels are not crap for saltwater. I have had them on many a tank, and use them when starting new tanks...take a wheel from an established tank to speed up bacteria colonization in the new tank.
 
stdreb27

stdreb27

Active Member
The statement stems from the idea that the wheel will collect waste from the water column. And that waste will decompose.
 
mboswell1982

mboswell1982

Active Member
aye, im working now woot lol and just spending more time with jess than on here LOL that an workin with the dogs, tryin to get lined up with this lady to get my 20 long an what not, she's throwing in an old, but working, aqua clear 70 with the tank, so its pretty cool
 
trouble93

trouble93

Member
Originally Posted by mboswell1982
http:///forum/post/2879155
aye, im working now woot lol and just spending more time with jess than on here LOL that an workin with the dogs, tryin to get lined up with this lady to get my 20 long an what not, she's throwing in an old, but working, aqua clear 70 with the tank, so its pretty cool
Just want to hear an answer on the question at hand...IMO hence the name in itself bio wheel would mean it's there to help aid in the filter function I used a hob filter to cycle my first 3 small tanks and never has a problem.
 
rotarymagic

rotarymagic

Active Member
The fact that biowheels have an absorbent surface to them means that they will trap waste in them which overtime will create the nitrate trap. If the biowheel was a nonabsorbent yet porous surface it would probably not be a bad idea as it can host aerobic bacteria. All the biowheels I've seen look like paper or cotton gauze lol... definitely great for longterm troubles.
 
locoyo386

locoyo386

Member
Originally Posted by stdreb27
http:///forum/post/2879124
The statement stems from the idea that the wheel will collect from the water column on the wheel. And that waste will decompose.
Hi there,
Let me see if I understand this better.
"the wheel will collect from the water column on the wheel"
Does this statement mean the following;
The waste from the fish will be sucked into the filter. As water flows through the biowheel, this waste will collect on it? If this is not correct can you explain in more detail. I also do not know what is a "water column"
If it is true, than the waste will collect in the biowheel and decompose. If so than what is the purpose of the filter pad before the water reaches the biowheel?
I appreciate all your comments as I am trying to understand this hobby more in detail.
 
W

westwind77

Member
I ran 2 330gph bio-wheel filters on my 75g years ago and had 0 nitrates everytime I tested. They seemed to work for me, I have since upgraded and they are in my basement, but I never had an issue with them.
 
stdreb27

stdreb27

Active Member
Originally Posted by locoyo386
http:///forum/post/2879530
Hi there,
Let me see if I understand this better.
"the wheel will collect from the water column on the wheel"
Does this statement mean the following;
The waste from the fish will be sucked into the filter. As water flows through the biowheel, this waste will collect on it? If this is not correct can you explain in more detail. I also do not know what is a "water column"
If it is true, than the waste will collect in the biowheel and decompose. If so than what is the purpose of the filter pad before the water reaches the biowheel?
I appreciate all your comments as I am trying to understand this hobby more in detail.

I fixed it, yeah that is the idea, waste will collect on the bio-wheel. And decay. That is the same reason you'll hear people say bioballs and canister filters are no3 factories.
I don't really buy into bio wheels as nitrate factories. Because I don't think that bio-wheels will collect that much waste.
I do however think they are useless, I can't imagine there being enough biological filtration in the wheel to justify the costs. That is what the lr and refugiums are for.
 
florida joe

florida joe

Well-Known Member
My thoughts but then again what do I know, the bio-wheel is a multi pleated media hence more area for the colonization of nitrifying bacteria. . The ammonia introduced into our tanks is present in the water column the water is pumped though the mechanical filter material taking out large uneaten particles. The ammonia from the breakdown is past over the bio-wheel feeding the newly formed nitrifying bacteria eventual all the water passes over the wheel making it a constant area for the bacteria to feed its Is the same principal reason you get algae around your effluent pipes in your tank the constant passing of nutrients feed the algae, now the area of most colonization is going to give you the most concentration of the end product of nitrification with is nitrates the nitrates then enter the water collumn were if you have good di-nitrification they are eleminated. dont blame the bio-whell for doing a good job blame your Lack of Anaerobic bacteria, nitrate assimilating algae ,substraight husbandry, or chemical filtration for elimination the nitrates or lack of
but as usual this is just IMO
oh and sorry mboswell1982 i know the question was posted to you
 
hammerhed7

hammerhed7

Active Member
another reason bio wheels and bio balls are considered "nitrate factories" is the due to the fact the there is such a high concentration of oxygen that huge numbers of bacteria can colonize a smaller are. This bacteria will process waste at an incredibly fast rate, they will also produce the end product of the process (nitrate) just as fast. These types of filters are fine for fresh water and fowlr, but I would not use them in a reef. A good skimmer will also help as it will remove organics before they need to be processed by the filter. These filters are not the unspeakable evil alot of people make them out to be, bacteria colonies will only produce what is there, and most nitrate problems can be traced to overfeeding rather than the filtration method.
 
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