Apparently God has selective hearing...

2quills

2quills

Well-Known Member
You couldn't see an sarcastic barb if it slapped you in the face.  You're the epitome of someone who would've never been born if natural selection were the way this world decided what existed on this planet.
Tell us how you really feel.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bible_and_homosexuality
So where's the interpretation? All I see is a reference to references of interpretations. Your talk here holds no water. There is a hole in your cup.
 
aggiealum

aggiealum

Member
I wonder if Arizona's attitudes about "religious freedoms" will change when it starts hitting their pocket books and jobs:

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/big-business-arizona-gay-discrimination-bill-bad-economy-n37711

Kinda of reminds me when they tried to pass that law stating that Arizona wouldn't recognize MLK Day as a federal holiday, until the NFL said if they upheld the law, they'd be moving the Super Bowl being held there that year to another venue in another state. That law was immediately reversed.
 
aggiealum

aggiealum

Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2Quills http:///t/397209/apparently-god-has-selective-hearing/40#post_3539804
Tell us how you really feel.
So where's the interpretation? All I see is a reference to references of interpretations. Your talk here holds no water. There is a hole in your cup.
No, someone who believes every word written in the Bible has a huge hole in their cup. That entire book is subjective and up for interpretations. Most of the text comes third-hand, if not simply drummed up by some religious philosopher of that time period. The statements in that link prove that exact point. You can't even get different Christian religions to agree on some of the verses in that book. You take a few phrases out of context, interpret them for your own personal agenda, and all of a sudden, love between two individuals of the same sex is considered immoral and worthy of death in some nations in this world. That's the biggest flaw with religion, you base your entire judgment's of someone else on some book that has no verifiable origination of who exactly wrote it. Compare some of the story lines in the Bible, to some of the biggest movie box office hits you've ever seen that were fantasy or science fiction. You'd probably see some commonalities between the two. Whose to say the various Books in the Bible weren't actually originally written to be fables like those written by Aesop's?
 
darthtang aw

darthtang aw

Active Member
That's just the typical INTERPRETATION of that Psalm.  The discussion was about DIVORCE.  It had nothing to do with the sexual preference of the individuals who were married.  [/QUOTE] True, yet He clearly stated marriage was man and woman. He wasn't asked about that yet still commented on it.
Are you going to sit there and say that homosexuality never occurred during the time Jesus supposedly walked this Earth?
I didn't say this. Go read what I said again. And you question the interpretation I give of what was written in the bible? LMAO!
You're basing your entire theory on this one phrase - "Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female."  OK, the first words of that phrase are "Have ye not READ", as in reading Genesis.  So again, you're basing the entire argument of whether homosexuality is right or wrong on a verse that was essentially taken from a previous verse in the same book.  You're condemning an entire society and sector of population on this planet on the premise of words written in a book that has no FACTUAL basis to go by.  A book that some religious scholars rely on to say that this planet is only 6000 years old, and humans cohabitated with the dinosaurs.  Have God come down from the Heavens, or let the "second coming" of Jesus occur, and have one of the two state to all those currently living that homosexuality is an evil as vile as murdering another human being, then you will have a valid justification for your "tolerance" against those individuals.
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I am not condemning anyone. I am onlying pointing out that which was written. You attempted to use the bible to chastise Christians for their beliefs. I showed you where the bible states what the belief is. You can't use the bible in an argument then discount it as not factual afterwards. Either use the scripture against Christians or stick with disbelieving as your stance. You can not do both.
If you prefer, I can pull up quotes in the Bible that discuss "men loving men" and "women loving women".  Those have be dug up to support the facts that homosexuality was discussed in that little book.
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Please do, and include atleast several verses pror to the statement and after. As I will be rebuttaling in context. Oh, and try to use the oldest translation you can find yet still understand. Some really old translations are very hard to read.
And before you retort with me sounding like some holy roller southern hillybilly fire and brimstone..etc...etc...etc... I dont go to church, I haven't said a prayer in months, and I dont donate to churches or televangelists very often.
 
phixer

phixer

Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by AggieAlum http:///t/397209/apparently-god-has-selective-hearing/20#post_3539801
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phixer http:///t/397209/apparently-god-has-selective-hearing/20#post_3539793
This is your liberal agenda: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mjj5_f4m8Ik

Please explain your logic to support this statement "If we relied on natural selection, you never would've been born." According to that statement neither would you? Pls rationalize this: I was, therefore I am.

Fox News? who knows I dont waste time watching TV.

What Jesus taught? who knows? There exists a division of church and state for that reason.
You couldn't see an sarcastic barb if it slapped you in the face. You're the epitome of someone who would've never been born if natural selection were the way this world decided what existed on this planet.

You should start watching it more often. The majority of the words you use to support your arguments on any topic discussed here come straight from the Hannity or Fox At Five playbook. That, or you read Glenn Beck books for bedtime stories.

And that division of church and state is exactly why the new law in Arizona is unconstitutional. We have anti-discrimination laws in place for that very reason. You can't pull the "religion card" out every time you want to deny an individual their right to liberty in this country, just like you can't pull the "race card" for the very same reason we abolished those atrocities in the 50's in 60's. What's the difference between a sign that reads "White's Water Fountain Only", "White Bathroom/Black Bathroom", "No Blacks Allowed To Eat In This Establishment", and replacing the word "Black" with "Homosexual"? Just because of some ridiculous interpretation of some words in a book, that gives these people the right to discriminate against the same people who pay the same bill as someone who isn't homosexual? I'm also curious, how exactly do businesses determine whether a couple is homosexual that enters their establishment? Do Arizona homosexual couples now have to wear "LGBT Rainbow" armbands or shirts to designate their sexual preference when living there? A couple of guys that work together decide to go have lunch or drinks after work, they have to prove their manhood by kissing one of the women workers before being allowed into the establishment? Oh wait, I forgot. It's EASY to tell when a man is gay. Is there also a "lesbian radar" that goes off when two women enter a business at the same time? You want to practice your religious freedoms? Do it in your home or church. Your business is supported by the ENTIRE community, including what you pay in taxes to run that business. Southern Baptist believe drinking alcohol is a sin, and can provide Bible versus to prove it is. Wonder if any of these restaurant owners who depend on their liquor licenses and sales to survive would give them up for the sake of their "religious freedoms"? Oh wait, I guess all Arizona restaurants are owned by liquor-guzzling Catholics. I imagine Catholic business owners allow pedophiles in their establishments, since they turn a blind eye to all their priests who have an eye for the little boys.
Thanks Aggie, but like I said I dont normally watch TV or the shows you mentioned when I do. I do remember when Reginald Dwight was married, turned gay, got divorced and later became Elton John.
Or the comedy of Chaz Bono trying to figure out being a woman looking like a man or being a man looking like a woman.


Is this what your talking about: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4r7wHMg5Yjg
Personally I could care less about homosexuals or organized religion, or racism or slavery or discrimination or the mating habits of the yellow bellied sap sucker. I do find homosexuality good for one thing. It's funny as hell so I give it the same respect as Liberace polka dancing in goat skin chaps. Although I do wonder why they have so many parades?
Are you familiar with Russia and Uganda's new laws?
 
aggiealum

aggiealum

Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darthtang AW http:///t/397209/apparently-god-has-selective-hearing/40#post_3539809
True, yet He clearly stated marriage was man and woman. He wasn't asked about that yet still commented on it.
I didn't say this. Go read what I said again. And you question the interpretation I give of what was written in the bible? LMAO!
Why wouldn't he make the statement that it was a man and woman that was married? Who knows how they treated homosexuality back then. It's the 21st Century, and we're just now recognizing homosexual marriages. My entire point is your basing Christian beliefs about homosexuality on the context of a phrase in a book that was written second and third-hand. Just because this verse stated a man and woman was married, that automatically defaults that only men and women can get married until the end of this world as we know it? Let's say the Bible quoted that it was OK to murder anyone who committed adultery. Would that mean that it would be standard practice to allow murdering your cheating spouse simply because it was printed in that book?
I am not condemning anyone. I am onlying pointing out that which was written. You attempted to use the bible to chastise Christians for their beliefs. I showed you where the bible states what the belief is. You can't use the bible in an argument then discount it as not factual afterwards. Either use the scripture against Christians or stick with disbelieving as your stance. You can not do both.
And the problem with that premise is anyone and everyone is expected to believe and follow the edicts written in that book whether they believe in it or not. Christians use the Bible to chastise my beliefs, how is that any different? Sure I can use the Bible to discredit any belief that is based on words in that book. Christians base their beliefs in what's written in it, yet they only cherry-pick the phrases that support whatever argument they're trying to make, but ignore the phrases that contradict those same beliefs.
Please do, and include atleast several verses pror to the statement and after. As I will be rebuttaling in context. Oh, and try to use the oldest translation you can find yet still understand. Some really old translations are very hard to read.
And before you retort with me sounding like some holy roller southern hillybilly fire and brimstone..etc...etc...etc... I dont go to church, I haven't said a prayer in months, and I dont donate to churches or televangelists very often.
No, you just like to pick fights and argue against anything I say or believe in because we are complete opposites. I imagine you could care less whether Arizona passes this ignorant law or not, because it doesn't affect you in the least. But if you can agitate me by taking the opposition in the discussion, then it makes your day.
 
2quills

2quills

Well-Known Member
No, someone who believes every word written in the Bible has a huge hole in their cup.  That entire book is subjective and up for interpretations.  Most of the text comes third-hand, if not simply drummed up by some religious philosopher of that time period.  The statements in that link prove that exact point.  You can't even get different Christian religions to agree on some of the verses in that book.  You take a few phrases out of context, interpret them for your own personal agenda, and all of a sudden, love between two individuals of the same sex is considered immoral and worthy of death in some nations in this world.  That's the biggest flaw with religion, you base your entire judgment's of someone else on some book that has no verifiable origination of who exactly wrote it.  Compare some of the story lines in the Bible, to some of the biggest movie box office hits you've ever seen that were fantasy or science fiction.  You'd probably see some commonalities between the two.  Whose to say the various Books in the Bible weren't actually originally written to be fables like those written by Aesop's?
I'm sure many of them were. Religion was just a tool used to keep the masses in check and on the same page back in the day. What happened was a few dudes got together and decided they needed a new type of religion for the new age to fool the masses with and they called it government.
Way to dodge another direct question. I guess you have such a problem with most religions because none of them support your lifestyle. Once you do find one (if ever) that says it's ok then I'm sure you'll end up happy happy happy to be born again.
 
theclemsonkid

theclemsonkid

Member
Umm, so someone apparently hacked into my account and changed my picture to an avocado?!? I have to say, that's a first. And apparently deleted all my previous posts in this thread.

Thanks mysterious vegetable lover.
 
2quills

2quills

Well-Known Member
God heard about your little thread here and disagrees with your logic. He thinks you'd be better suited as veggie dip. HAHAHA
 
2quills

2quills

Well-Known Member
Yep, Heaven doesn't just have pearly gates and streets of gold. They have some really great dip up there as well.
 
beth

beth

Administrator
Staff member
There is a difference between Black/White water fountain and the religious objections to homosexuality. Christians fear that acceptance of homosexuality as natural will result in impositions placed on their belief system. Such as Catholic priests being required to marry same sex couples. If you believe that the Word of God tells you to believe otherwise, then such prospects will and does result in major push-back. Either way, one party or the other are not going be able to exercise their freedom; but in our constitution, freedom of religion is one of the basic foundations of our society.
 
theclemsonkid

theclemsonkid

Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beth http:///t/397209/apparently-god-has-selective-hearing/40#post_3539842
There is a difference between Black/White water fountain and the religious objections to homosexuality. Christians fear that acceptance of homosexuality as natural will result in impositions placed on their belief system. Such as Catholic priests being required to marry same sex couples. If you believe that the Word of God tells you to believe otherwise, then such prospects will and does result in major push-back. Either way, one party or the other are not going be able to exercise their freedom; but in our constitution, freedom of religion is one of the basic foundations of our society.

Why is there such a visceral reaction to homosexuality specifically is something I have always wondered.
For example, I personally could really care less what two consenting adults do in their own life. It doesn't effect me one way or the other. Alcoholism on the other hand, is something that generally effects everyone. Throughout your life, you'll probably come across someone who will either be killed or injured by a drunk driver, or killed or injured by a domestic dispute involving alcohol. It's a serious issue. You could say the same thing about drugs. You could even say the same thing about pornography addiction, or addictions in general. I would even say that cigarettes and fast food pose a much greater danger than homosexuals.

So, why is it that you don't see the religious right spending all their money, sending their politicians, their congregations, their power, etc. to stop these other things which most sane people would consider a much larger threat to your life than two guys shacking up?

Why does the thought of two men lying in a bed together get some people more fired up than a drunk who puts his fist through his wife's face? I'm genuinely curious what the psychological reasons are behind "homosexuality is the worst thing in the world" are.

I mean even the computer or phone you're typing on, was probably made through slave labor. The shirt you're wearing was more than likely made by an 8 year old somewhere in Asia. The same 8 year old who in a few years will be sent into human trafficking. Why do all these other miserable things in the world take a back seat to the fact you don't want to see same sex marriages?
 
darthtang aw

darthtang aw

Active Member
Christians base their beliefs in what's written in it, yet they only cherry-pick the phrases that support whatever argument they're trying to make, but ignore the phrases that contradict those same beliefs.
I am still waiting for you to post these contradictions in the bible. You said you could but have yet to do so,
No, you just like to pick fights and argue against anything I say or believe in because we are complete opposites. I imagine you could care less whether Arizona passes this ignorant law or not, because it doesn't affect you in the least. But if you can agitate me by taking the opposition in the discussion, then it makes your day.
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If Arizona passes the law it will be overturned by the supreme court. So no, I don't care, as it is an unconstitutional law as has been ruled upon in various fashions. I typically post before you so my opposition is clearly stated before you state yours.
 
darthtang aw

darthtang aw

Active Member

]Why is there such a visceral reaction to homosexuality specifically is something I have always wondered. 
There are many things that have an equally visceral reaction. I can point to your original posting concerning prayer and aggie's reaction to the bible. Those reaction are no less inflamatory than any reaction you have seen posted here on homosexuality.
For example, I personally could really care less what two consenting adults do in their own life. It doesn't effect me one way or the other.
Yet you cared about people sending prayers, which is bothering no one and not affecting your life. See my point?..
 
Alcoholism on the other hand, is something that generally effects everyone.  Throughout your life, you'll probably come across someone who will either be killed or injured by a drunk driver, or killed or injured by a domestic dispute involving alcohol.  It's a serious issue.  You could say the same thing about drugs.  You could even say the same thing about pornography addiction, or addictions in general.  I would even say that cigarettes and fast food pose a much greater danger than homosexuals.
I agree with this completely. Yet you are not old enough to remember the churches of the 70's and 80's. Historically churches have preached against many of these things. Prohibition was rooted in religious reasoning. But as society has evolved and continued forward through time each generation has become more tolerant of such things. In fact churches are gradually becoming more accepting of homosexuality.
So, why is it that you don't see the religious right spending all their money, sending their politicians, their congregations, their power, etc. to stop these other things which most sane people would consider a much larger threat to your life than two guys shacking up? 
You did.
Why does the thought of two men lying in a bed together get some people more fired up than a drunk who puts his fist through his wife's face? 
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I have never known anyone to feel this way.
I'm genuinely curious what the psychological reasons are behind "homosexuality is the worst thing in the world" are.
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can you elaborate on this question. I wish to be sure of what exactly you are asking so I do not explain something you werent wanting explained.
I mean even the computer or phone you're typing on, was probably made through slave labor.  The shirt you're wearing was more than likely made by an 8 year old somewhere in Asia.  The same 8 year old who in a few years will be sent into human trafficking.  Why do all these other miserable things in the world take a back seat to the fact you don't want to see same sex marriages?   
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they don't as far as I am concerned. This is an assumption on your part with no basis. However, If a company is known to use slave labor we can not purchase their products. If a church is against homosexual marriage, would you require them to marry homosexuals? This is the "fear" within the church. A prime example is the ACA initially forcing religious institutions to pay for and provide services they do not support. As it is against their religious views. You might not see as much of a push back if the law were written that it would exclude religious institutions from marrying homosexual people if the so desired. The problem is our constitution affords certain rights. As has been shown, these rights can be trumped by other percieved rights. When in fact all rights should be perceived as equal. But we do not perceive these rights equally in this country.
 
darthtang aw

darthtang aw

Active Member
Clemson, whoever hacked your account should be banned.The avatar is funny, but the removal of your posts unless done by a moderator for inflammatory comments is unacceptable. I highly doubt any mods edited your posts, however.
 
beth

beth

Administrator
Staff member
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheClemsonKid http:///t/397209/apparently-god-has-selective-hearing/40#post_3539845
Why do all these other miserable things in the world take a back seat to the fact you don't want to see same sex marriages?
Just to be clear, I pointed out the problem that some religious communities have. I did not say that I had those same feelings.

To me the issue is a catch 22. On the one side, you have a minority group of people who wish to excersise the same freedoms and rights that their hetro counterparts have. On the other side, you have thousand of yrs invested in a belief system (or mulitiple belief systems) where billions of people feel that homosexuality is not God's plan for relationships between humans. In the USA, many of those religious people would agree that what people do in the bedroom is not something they need to get involved in, but when advocacy for same sex marriages (in traditional churches) are thrown into the equation, then there is going to be a good deal of resentment, pushback, and yes even an uptick of bigotry.

Personally, I empathize with both positions because both have a right to their position. I would probably endorse laws that allowed for same freedoms for homosexuals that did not impose on rights of religious institutions. Its complicated....right down to the baker that doesn't want to make a same-sex wedding cake because of his personal religious convictions. Is that person a moronic cretin? No. He is a person with religious convictions that is engrained in to his soul. Just because you do have the same convictions, does make you right and the other person a Neanderthal.
 
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