B.S.opinions about Bio-wheels IME,Show me proof please

bang guy

Moderator
Originally Posted by mande51334
i used some regular pink fiji sand? in a bag, then i added it with a product called "bio activ? live sand but it doesnt look like its doing much
THat's not going to do it. There's a huge difference between a deep sand bed and a live sand bed. Deep sand bed will not reduce nitrates and may infact become a "nitrate factory".
For a sand bed to reduce nitrate small amounts of oxygen depleted, nitrate rich water needs to be slowly puched through the lower levels of the sand. This doesn't happen on its own; it happens from the actions of small, nearly microscopic animals living in the sand bed.
If you with to continue with a deep sand bed my suggestion is to purchase a box of premium live sand from this site, or trade for sand from an established tank with live sand.
Just for understanding live sand beds:
1 - Water containing Ammonia is dragged into the sand from the actions of sand bed critters going up & down their burrows or between sand grains.
2 - Nitrifying bacteria use the oxygen in the water to convert the Ammonia to Nitrite and then the Nitrite to Nitrate resumlting in poorly oxygenated water laden with Nitrate.
3 - This water is then dragged deeper into the sand, again by the bugs & worms.
4 - Denitrifying bacteria consume the Nitrate producing Oxygen and Nitrogen gas.
5 - The oxygen is redissolved into the water and the Nitrogen gas collects to form bubbles.
6 - The further action of the sand bed critters pulls the water up and allows the Nitrogen gas bubbles to slowly work their way to the surface of the sand bed where they float up and are released into the air.
A you can see, the sand bed infauna are needed at all of the important steps. Without them you just have a lot of dead sand where Nitrifying bacteria can live only at the surface converting Ammonia to Nitrate but no further.
 

mande51334

Member
thanks for clearing that up for me!! can a sand bed be too deep? i'm already at 4" will adding more sand be ok? so, to get this straight, i should buy some live sand from here and just add it to what i've already got? should i mix it in or just leave it on top of the sand i already have?
 

farmboy

Active Member
Hey Bang,
Can the little critters be seen with the

[hr]
eye?
I seeded my yardright with a bag of live sand. I've noticed "tracks" like an ant farm in the sand below the surface. I also have nassarius snails that burrow. I can't catch either making the burrows against the glass - so how do I know?
 

mande51334

Member
will 20lbs. of live sand from this site be enough?
how long should it take to establish and see a drop in nitrates?
any other things i am forgetting that you all can think of would be helpful, thanks again.
 

irishsalt

Member
Well,
I read the Entire thread twice and I'd have to say Awesome Info from BangGuy and others. I don't make assumptions based on POst count but BangGuy obvioulsy have some great Knowledge.
Bio-WHeels work great IME with Marine, IF your doing Regular Waterchanges to Export/dilture the Nitrate as BangGUy has pointed out....period.
My 29 gallong tank no longer has a BIo-wheel and my levels are awesome. I have a nice LS bed and LOTS of gorgeous LR.
Peace
 

farmboy

Active Member
I don't want to beat a dead horse, but let me get this straight.
IF you use bio-wheels/bio-balls and more frequent water changes = OK nitrates.
IF LR and DSB(properly seeded) and less frequent water changes = OK nitrates.
Bio wheels are counterproductive to LR & DSB(for nitrate processing) because you want the bacteria that nitrifies amonia in proximity to the anaerobic conditions for NITRATE processing and not on the BIO-wheel/bio-balls?
My head hurts. . . .
 

ophiura

Active Member
This is actually a pretty complex question that IMO can't be narrowed down so simply. Nitrate levels depend on a variety of things - feeding, stocking, types of fish, maintenance, other export (refugium), LR, DSB, etc. Every tank is different. There are plenty of people who run these types of filters without nitrate problems at all. There are people with DSB/LR who might very well have nitrate issues. For me each case is different and I don't like to make basic "thumbs up/thumbs down" type decision on them.
Tanks can be run successfully, IMO, with either type of filtration, or some combination of it. Because I am the paranoid type, I would rather have a nitrate "problem" than an ammonia problem...so I have my LR and basically a wet dry. It gives me a certain degree of confidence but it is not the way to go for everyone. I do my water changes. I now think I made a big mistake adding a third fish to my 45g tank. I think it is now overstocked. :( But not everyone is like that. For new hobbyists who are drawn to lots of fish, fast, and tend to overfeed (standard practice) then I like the extra security of biowheels/bioballs. As they gain experience and maybe trim down stocking, improve maintenance, etc...then they can be removed. But I do not believe they are inherently a problem. In some cases they are, and some cases they are life saving.
 
Top