broomer5, and all expierenced DIY

[danrw84]

broomer...i could really use your expertese!
or anyone for that matter!
anyway..., i have a 29 gal reef. I want to set up a refugium. I can get the hang on CPR for 83 bucks, I ordered it, but now im wondering if i should do something differnt.
What would be involved for me to put a little 3 gallon glass tank which i already have, under my reef tank, in the cabient...and use that as a refugium. that way the 24/7 13 watt PC light wont shine into my tank, and into my room when its bed time!
what would i need to do? I have no overflows, and no clue where to begin.
Which would you recomend i do? In the 3 gal i wanted to put like a 1 inch sand bed, unless more is better, and some LR rubble, and some calerpa and other algaes.
How would i do a steady DOWNFLOW into the 3 gallon, then BACK up to the 29 gallon. I want pods and such to grow as well.
so, with no overflow, what would i do. How much would i have to spend?
Thanks in advance. let me know, or email me at danrw84@cox.net
anyone else with info please, let me have it!

 

[cap'n pete]

If you want it under the tank you will have to get an overflow and a return pump. This would cost around the same as the hang-on, perhaps a bit more. Benefits would include being able to light it 24/7 and maybe even being able to move the heater down there. The problem would be getting a low enough flow rate through the refugium. You could get a smaller Sterilite container and a larger one. Have the small container on top and have some of the water pour into it, the rest into the larger container. Have the top container overflow into the bottom. See picture.

 

[danrw84]

ok so go ahead get the hang on CPR...and later down the road set up a sump and put the CPR on the sump ..etc?
id do a 10 gallon sump i suppose. id move my heater, and skimmer down there if it would fit?
what do you think?
So, how much is an overflow? and what powerhead to pump water BACK UP
what piping do i need to run it down to the sump tank...and back up of course. thanks!

 

[cap'n pete]

Putting the CPR on the sump may cause a problem. The CPR is designed to take water from the top of the tank, a sump's water level is usually very low compared to a tank. It may be able to be modified, I'm not sure. I'll look at the CPR and let you know.

 

[danrw84]

how benificial would it be for me to add a 10 gallon sump? i need to learn all about these things. any premade ones? or instructions on what to get/ how to do it?
thanks

 

[cap'n pete]

$83 is a great price for that CPR. I did a search and the cheapest I found was $113. I can see how exactly it's plumbed though. I would think it would look pretty ugly on a 29G though. How are you going to light it?

 

[danrw84]

already ordered it. dont tell me that!!
a little 13 watt PC ....
but i dont want to see the light all the time
so...what are my alternatives? i want a refuge, and now i want a sump

 

[cap'n pete]

Dan, read this.
overflows and sumps

 

[danrw84]

capt, youve got mail

 

[broomer5]

Dan,
If you're leaning towards going with a sump - then just return the CPR hang on fuge for credit. Don't even open the box - just email the store or call them - tell them you don't need it now.
Take the $83.00 bucks and apply this towards doing a sump/fuge with external overflow/return pump.
Ditch the whole idea of using this 3 gallon tank you have. I know it's fun to use stuff we already have around the house - but 3 gallons just isn't big enough to be effective IMO.
An estimated budget number for sump/fuge/overflow/pump/plumbing-parts for a 29 gallon tank would be in the neighborhood of $150.00 to do it right.
You can cut some corners if you want - but I wouldn't recommend it.
You have the lighting - that's cool.
1) Is this budget number okay ?
2) How much physical room do you have under your tank in the stand ?
Measure height. width, depth of open area under tank, include measurements of doors and braces.
3) Post back your dimensions -and if you are still interested in doing this project. Then we can go from there.
It's not hard to do - but you'll need a shopping list of parts to start getting. We can help as a group here - and get you going.
I'm not going to reply to the other threads - this one should sum it up from my point of view - okay ?
Later

 

[oceanjumper]

Dan~
To visualize what Pete & Broomer have written, see my setup on the picture. It is identical to Pete's drawing.
At the right bottom you see my sump. Because space was the limiting factor I could only place a 15 gl tank there. One advantage for me, because I also had/have a hang-on skimmer, 15 gl tanks get the increased volume being taller compared to 10 gl tanks (20 gl tanks are wider). This allowed me to raise the sump's water level so I still skim the surface water (you might be able to see it in the picture).
You also see the refugium on the (top)left. It is a 5 gl Kritter Keeper (purchased online). 5 gl might be on the small side for a refuge but, again, this was all I could fit in.
The container on the bottom left is for automatic top-off water.
I feed the refugium via a T on the return pump that is located in the sump (it's on the left side and is not visible in the picture). I have a picture of the T as well to give you an idea
With the help of the two other gentlemen in this thread I was able to construct it in a few days.
Total cost:
-Overflow box plus flexible hose: $75
-15 gl glass tank: $30
- Return pump (CAP 2200): $65
- XL Kritter Keeper: $20
- 27W PC: $30
- 1' Bulkhead: $8
- 3/4' Bulbhead: $3
- some Acrylic plates: $10
- Plumbing stuff (a.o. for the T with ball valve): $25
- LS plus LR : $35
- Macroalgae: Free....

 

[broomer5]

You know what OceanJumper,
Your set up turned out really nice under there.
Clean and good use of available space.
I also like teeing off the return pump, instead of tapping into the overflow drains. Although both will work equally as well.
I like it nice work !

 

[oceanjumper]

Thanks Broomer. But know it, right? Your contribution in this has been more than significant.
I just took some more pic's. I wasn't completely satisfied with the original wiring. I also attached a picture to show how I have fixed the valve. Otherwise it was a pain to open/close it.
Cheers

 

[oceanjumper]

Overflow & T

 

[danrw84]

i dont know if i can cancel the CPR ordr..
i spend the 83 already basically...
why did you rule that out?
here is what my cabinent looks like.
and i want to do a 10 gal sump
the cpr is already set up and ready to go, so that makes it easier on me, right?
keep me posted
$150 is okay, if i didnt get the CPR hangon.
what type of fuge are you thinking about?

 

[broomer5]

Okay - Plan B
If you can use a sump for a true sump - have your return pump in it and heater,etc, then that leaves us with a way to incorporate this CPR hang on refugium
Two ways to do this that I can see.
1) Get another vessel, either a tank or rubbermaid box to use as a tank to HANG this refugium onto.
You may not have enough room to do this.
If you do - you'll have to drill a hole in the vessel, up near the top, on the side facing the sump. You install a bulkhead in this hole and plumb to the sump.
This vessel will be full or tankwater - up to the level this hole and bulkhead is located.
Then hang the CPR on the side of this vessel.
The CPR must have it's own pump IN THE WATER all the time.
So if it hangs on a tank or box of water - that tank or box must be full.
2) Otherwise you have to extend the CPR pump down into the sump so it's always under water. You may be able to do this with vinyl tubing. The CPR would hang on your 10 gallon sump, with the CPR pump on the bottom - forcing water up to the fuge, where it would discharge back to the sump.

 

[danrw84]

yeah, i would have to extend it. are you sure this can be done? i want to put the cpr on the sump.
whats my alternative if i dont use the cpr. how difficult is it to make my own?
what pump should i use for the sump return?
and how would iu set up the overflow and. this whole thing
thanks

 

[danrw84]

got the 10 gal sump
going to get an over flow now...
what size/gph should i get?
also got a seaclone 100 skimmer by marine land..it supposed to be an in sump model...is this a better skimmer than my prizm?
hang on refug will be here in like a week.
what parts do i need?

 

[oceanjumper]

Dearest Dan....
Can you do me a favor? Please don't order equipment and ask questions later.... Trust me, in the long run it is much more desirable to ask questions first, and than place the orders....

 

[danrw84]

yeah. im sorry. i just want to get it right
did you send it yet?
thanks