Catholics vs. Abortion vs. Obama's mandate...

[darthtang aw]

What argument am I changing?  You're nit picking about a couple thousand tax-free bucks that probably 90% of current individuals who have health insurance don't use.  It makes logical sense to contribute to HSA's and FSA's, but most people see that as more descretionary income taken out of their paycheck every week that they can't use for anything else besides medical care.  When people barely have enough money to pay their bills, they don't want to stick money into an acoount that they may or may not use during the year.  I've listened to friends and co-workers who complain they have to make this mad dash at the end of the year trying to find some medical procedure, or go to the doctor to get some prescription for a "mysterious ailment" so they can burn the cash that's remaining in their FSA or HSA account.
Try looking at the overall bill, and see some of the positives that have come out in it - children up to 26 are able to stay on their parebnts insurance, no denial to cover pre-existing conditions, insurance pools for small businesses, various cost savings benefits for Medicare recipients.  The list goes on...
Actually, I am not nit picking about one little tax increase. I am showing YOU all of them...Your argument was FSA and HSA accounts weren't affected. I showed you the IRS saying otherwise. Then you switch to "It is only a few thousand dollars. That is changing the debate. At first you claimed it didn't exist. Now it does and "isn't that big of a deal"
children up to 26 (you forgot the part as long as attending school) a good thing? Your ecstatic over a cost savings of a couple thousand bucks, on a service that probably 90% of the students do not use. Sound familiar?

 

[reefraff]

Quote:
Originally Posted by bionicarm http:///t/390368/catholics-vs-abortion-vs-obamas-mandate/280#post_3461158
What argument am I changing? You're nit picking about a couple thousand tax-free bucks that probably 90% of current individuals who have health insurance don't use. It makes logical sense to contribute to HSA's and FSA's, but most people see that as more descretionary income taken out of their paycheck every week that they can't use for anything else besides medical care. When people barely have enough money to pay their bills, they don't want to stick money into an acoount that they may or may not use during the year. I've listened to friends and co-workers who complain they have to make this mad dash at the end of the year trying to find some medical procedure, or go to the doctor to get some prescription for a "mysterious ailment" so they can burn the cash that's remaining in their FSA or HSA account.
Try looking at the overall bill, and see some of the positives that have come out in it - children up to 26 are able to stay on their parebnts insurance, no denial to cover pre-existing conditions, insurance pools for small businesses, various cost savings benefits for Medicare recipients. The list goes on...
The biggest problem with health care is the cost. What in your list will lower costs?

 

[bang guy]

Quote:
Originally Posted by reefraff http:///t/390368/catholics-vs-abortion-vs-obamas-mandate/300#post_3461181
The biggest problem with health care is the cost. What in your list will lower costs?
One huge issue is that most of the cost savings predicted are from lowering the fee schedule. That will severly reduce the number of health professionals as most of them do not want to operate at a loss.

 

[bionicarm]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darthtang AW http:///t/390368/catholics-vs-abortion-vs-obamas-mandate/300#post_3461176
Actually, I am not nit picking about one little tax increase. I am showing YOU all of them...Your argument was FSA and HSA accounts weren't affected. I showed you the IRS saying otherwise. Then you switch to "It is only a few thousand dollars. That is changing the debate. At first you claimed it didn't exist. Now it does and "isn't that big of a deal"
children up to 26 (you forgot the part as long as attending school) a good thing? Your ecstatic over a cost savings of a couple thousand bucks, on a service that probably 90% of the students do not use. Sound familiar?
Sorry, but that "90*% that don't use" is a ridiculously high number. My daughter has been to the doctor three times this year, one for a medical issue, the other two for checkups and blood work. She went at least three times last year, and had a visit to the ER on one of them. I have several friends and co-workers who have college kids that use their medical services all the time. My daughter has a couple of prescriptions meds she's required to take every day. If I had to pay retail on those scripts because she wasn't covered on my health plan, I'd have spent $2,000 in one year easy.

 

[darthtang aw]

Considering, only about 50% of kids go to college. I am betting my estimation is closer than you think when factoring in the total amount of kids in the age bracket. However, it was a tongue in cheek comment you failed to grasp. Keep changing the argument though.
Covering your child till 26...has that brought your cost down?

 

[reefraff]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bang Guy http:///t/390368/catholics-vs-abortion-vs-obamas-mandate/300#post_3461193
One huge issue is that most of the cost savings predicted are from lowering the fee schedule. That will severly reduce the number of health professionals as most of them do not want to operate at a loss.
Yep. My wife had to go for PT for her back a few years ago. Her PT was a surgeon who specialized in back surgery. He walked away because it just wasn't worth it and could make a lot more money doing the physical therapy.

 

[bang guy]

I guess I don't understand the concept of providing 8K - 12K of insurance so you don't have to pay 2K in prescription drugs.
Thank goodness for the insurance!

Most healthy people would be far better off with a major medical plan and paying most out of pocket, especially those under 30.

 

[beaslbob]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bang Guy http:///t/390368/catholics-vs-abortion-vs-obamas-mandate/300#post_3461193
One huge issue is that most of the cost savings predicted are from lowering the fee schedule. That will severly reduce the number of health professionals as most of them do not want to operate at a loss.
+1 and big time
Gee we all want to pay less for everything.
So just pass a law lowering prices.
But from economics 101 the law of supply and demand cannot be repealed.
So when you set prices below free market level you create shortages.
Whether it is gas back in '73 or health care now.

 

[bionicarm]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darthtang AW http:///t/390368/catholics-vs-abortion-vs-obamas-mandate/300#post_3461310
Considering, only about 50% of kids go to college. I am betting my estimation is closer than you think when factoring in the total amount of kids in the age bracket. However, it was a tongue in cheek comment you failed to grasp. Keep changing the argument though.
Covering your child till 26...has that brought your cost down?
Yes it has. We'd pay the same monthly premium if it were just my wife, me, and my 17 year old daughter. Adding my 20 year old college daughter to the mix doesn't increase my premiums a penny. If she wasn't on my insurance last year, her ER visit would've been around $8K. I forget what the age limit was before Obamacare when your child could no longer be covered on your plan, but right now I have the peace of mind knowing she doesn't have to worry about taking out a loan to pay for some medical procedure she may have for at least another 4 years (she's a sophomore now, but she's going for her teaching degree and certificate.)

 

[darthtang aw]

Yes it has.  We'd pay the same monthly premium if it were just my wife, me, and my 17 year old daughter.  Adding my 20 year old college daughter to the mix doesn't increase my premiums a penny.  If she wasn't on my insurance last year, her ER visit would've been around $8K.  I forget what the age limit was before Obamacare when your child could no longer be covered on your plan, but right now I have the peace of mind knowing she doesn't have to worry about taking out a loan to pay for some medical procedure she may have for at least another 4 years (she's a sophomore now, but she's going for her teaching degree and certificate.)
So your insurance hasn't increased in cost since the passing of heathcare? It didn't increase a higher percentage than it did in the past? You have stated otherwise.
The previous age was 19. There is an exception to insurance rule though. If a college student is working where insurance is available while going to school...The child can not remain on their parents insurance plan. This exception expires in 2014. Does your daughter work at all?

 

[reefraff]

I do believe it was 23 if the kid was a student. The difference is now everyone gets to pay higher premiums for covering kids longer. Everyone gets to pay higher premiums to cover pre existings and everyone gets to pay higher premiums for covering free diagnostic exams

 

[darthtang aw]

I do believe it was 23 if the kid was a student. The difference is now everyone gets to pay higher premiums for covering kids longer. Everyone gets to pay higher premiums to cover pre existings and everyone gets to pay higher premiums for covering free diagnostic exams
I think 23 was a plan to plan thing.

 

[beaslbob]

Quote:
Originally Posted by reefraff http:///t/390368/catholics-vs-abortion-vs-obamas-mandate/300#post_3461381
I do believe it was 23 if the kid was a student. The difference is now everyone gets to pay higher premiums for covering kids longer. Everyone gets to pay higher premiums to cover pre existings and everyone gets to pay higher premiums for covering free diagnostic exams
Gee wonder what will happen when gals can have babies paid for from daddy's heath care up until age 26 and then receive child support/welfare to boot.
No need to get an education, job, husband, and all the hard to do stuff.

 

[darthtang aw]

 
Gee wonder what will happen when gals can have babies paid for from daddy's heath care up until age 26 and then receive child support/welfare to boot.
No need to get an education, job, husband, and all the hard to do stuff.
Umm...under the law, dads are only required to pay child support and provide health insurance until the child is 18. I don't see your point.

 

[bionicarm]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darthtang AW http:///t/390368/catholics-vs-abortion-vs-obamas-mandate/300#post_3461371
So your insurance hasn't increased in cost since the passing of heathcare? It didn't increase a higher percentage than it did in the past? You have stated otherwise.
The previous age was 19. There is an exception to insurance rule though. If a college student is working where insurance is available while going to school...The child can not remain on their parents insurance plan. This exception expires in 2014. Does your daughter work at all?
My insurance premiums going up had nothing to do with keeping my daughter on the policy.
She works part-time at Six Flags. They don't offer any health coverage for their part-time employees. She's looking at a job with the YMCA teaching daycare. They don't offer insurance either.

 

[bionicarm]

Quote:
Originally Posted by reefraff http:///t/390368/catholics-vs-abortion-vs-obamas-mandate/300#post_3461381
I do believe it was 23 if the kid was a student. The difference is now everyone gets to pay higher premiums for covering kids longer. Everyone gets to pay higher premiums to cover pre existings and everyone gets to pay higher premiums for covering free diagnostic exams
You sound like you work for an insurance company. My premiums have consistently gone up 3% - 5% every year for the past 10 years. This was WAY before Obamacare. Since the insurance companies are vehemently against this law, they will use every excuse they can to raise premiums on the guise of "Well we had to raise rates because of Obamacare". I guarantee you if they repealed that law today, you're premiums would go up yet again next year.

 

[darthtang aw]

You sound like you work for an insurance company.  My premiums have consistently gone up 3% - 5% every year for the past 10 years.  This was WAY before Obamacare.  Since the insurance companies are vehemently against this law, they will use every excuse they can to raise premiums on the guise of "Well we had to raise rates because of Obamacare".  I guarantee you if they repealed that law today, you're premiums would go up yet again next year.
This is how we know you make up numbers to support your own argument. In this very thread you stated your insurance premiums have increased 40% over the last 5-7 years. So which is it? the average 3-5% increase each year that is in line with cost of living increases, or the monstrous 40% over the last 5 years you were previously complaining about.
You have changed your argument yet again. First you were complaining about the rising costs of insurance premiums. Now you are arguing the increase is not that much even after the passage of Obamacare. So which is it? A ridiculous cost increase or not that much?

 

[darthtang aw]

wrong thread.
Post deleted.

 

[bigarn]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darthtang AW http:///t/390368/catholics-vs-abortion-vs-obamas-mandate/300#post_3461586
wrong thread.
Post deleted.
Oh no you don't ... I am the guardian of deleted posts and you didn't ask permission!
big (it's a job) arn

 

[darthtang aw]

Oh no you don't ... I am the guardian of deleted posts and you didn't ask permission!
big (it's a job) arn
Actually, I sent you a request form in triplicate. Signed and Notarized. If you would stop looking at P0RN long enough to do you job you would have seen this.
Darth (worthless Union employee) Tang