concerns about new tank design (need your help)

dirk_brijs

dirk_brijs

Member
Whatsup all,
A new tank design I came up with and want to know from all of you what would be the main concerns I will have to be dealing with or elliminate before I start building the design.
I know for now no overflows etc installed in the design due to reasons before want to wait all of your advise before starting to add all those things.
Idea would be both large tanks connected with an underpass which will not be lighted at all. (reason would be flashlight fish)
Both large tanks will be stocked with mixed corals but especially softies and anemones. Lighting will be delivered by 10 AI LED modules total (5 each tank)
Anyway all advise and critices are welcome
what thickness of glass would be recommended for example? I thought 1/2" would be ok?
thanks guys.

 
acrylic51

acrylic51

Active Member
I think it's doable.....Curious as to what method you plan to connect them? My only concern would be if the glass is cut and your sealing them with silicone. I'd probably opt for uniseals (large diameter) hidden behind the scene to connect the tanks?
What is your plan for overflows if any? I could possibly see center overflows on both tanks hidden in the center of the tank. Not necessarily your traditional overflow box build though.....
 
dirk_brijs

dirk_brijs

Member
i added the overflow boxes like this?

both outlets will run into different parts of the back of the house setup. One will run into a large fuge and the other will run straight into a sump
will add more drawings as it get more and more complicated lol
 
snakeblitz33

snakeblitz33

Well-Known Member
Yeah, yeah, I know my diagrams aren't as good as Google sketch or Autocad, so whatever. lol. I'll learn to use one of those carnfounded programs one of these days.

Just throwing out some ideas. You could really hide those overflows in the center if you didn't have that cabinet there. You could use that black acrylic stuff to make the middle unlit portion of the tank's underpass. My diagram probably isn't the proportions you are looking for, but you get the idea. The middle overflow could have two drains and three returns. You could also fill that overflow with live rock or base rock and use Durso standpipes or even use standpipes with Maggie mufflers. For a system like this, I would highly recommend looking into a closed loop system. Perhaps using two pumps, one for each side. It would keep the tank looking clean and (equipment) clutter free. This design would also allow more water volume...
I color coded the sides of the overflow box so you could get a better idea...
I have no idea if you are going to like this design or not, I'm just throwing it out there...
 
dirk_brijs

dirk_brijs

Member
waw thats allot of good ideas in one blow there.
Thing is though that this is a scaled down setup from an original large tank (1piece setup) split up to help in cost cutting.
The reason of my cutting water volume and making 2 completely seperate tanks is the glass used mainly. With the current setup I would be able to use 1/2" glass due to the lower water volume as in the one large piece tank I would have to go for 1 or even 2" glass and that is a huge cost differential.
anyway as for the closed loop that was planned and had some drawings made just now.
Closed loop will be pushed by one pump and a Oceans Motions in between.
Closed loop in green, Return in yellow
Return will be pushed by a reeflo Barracuda and the closed loop by a brand new "I dont know yet" pump (any suggestions please)
I had the question pending in my previous thread with the original plan of one tank still open.
 
acrylic51

acrylic51

Active Member
If I'm looking correctly at your diagram, For good effective flow from a good source you would want to move your return spray bar to the back of the tank up top back by the overflows. You would leave your CL nozzles on the bottom where they are, but you'd want to aim them back towards the overflow boxes. The spray bar would need valves other than the 1 you have shown to equal the flow out the spray bar. All the water would want to exit the first outlet and the ends wouldn't get anything.
Again on your pump selection doesn't look bad, but honestly for the CL pump I'd get in contact with Paul at OceansMotions, and talk to him, but I'm quite sure a Hybrid Dart/Snapper or worse a Barracuda driving the CL would be more than adequate.......
 
dirk_brijs

dirk_brijs

Member
thanks about the sprau nozzles valve idea will adjust that.
Thought though that the spray bar on that side would push the water towards the overflowbox better? What would be the reason for putting it on the same said as the overflowboxes?
For the closed loop pump I am currently doing some research on seevral different pumps so more advise and idea are sure welcome.
 
acrylic51

acrylic51

Active Member
Dirk_brijs when I was saying about your nozzles, I was talking about the ones on the bottom of the tank......It would be more beneficial if those nozzles where more towards the back wall of the tank forcing/directing water more towards the front bottom panel of the glass; which in effect would roll the flow/detritus upward toward the surface, where the spray bar you have mounted on the top front of the tank would push it towards the overflow.
Again I keep reiterating you might want to actually contact Paul from OM's......He is a wealth of information, and this is what he specializes in. I spent a good portion of Saturday morning on the phone with him.....Talk about customer service. You won't find to many that will call you on a Saturday morning to work out details on a tank layout. This is an area where most if not all of us skimp when it comes to setting up our tanks. We normally just pump water back from the sump to the tank, with no real logic or theory on how we should use the flow efficiently to achieve what we are after.
The design you have shown correctly illustrates proper use of flow.....Meaning most of us figure, that if we can see water entering the overflow box are system is running correctly or it's working efficiently. Which in theory it's probably not efficient or working correctly. You want to see the surface moving, and you want to force/direct water to that overflow, not just let it meander haphazardly to the overflow which so many of us do.......
 
dirk_brijs

dirk_brijs

Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by acrylic51 http:///t/388194/concerns-about-new-tank-design-need-your-help#post_3422492
Dirk_brijs when I was saying about your nozzles, I was talking about the ones on the bottom of the tank......It would be more beneficial if those nozzles where more towards the back wall of the tank forcing/directing water more towards the front bottom panel of the glass; which in effect would roll the flow/detritus upward toward the surface, where the spray bar you have mounted on the top front of the tank would push it towards the overflow.
Again I keep reiterating you might want to actually contact Paul from OM's......He is a wealth of information, and this is what he specializes in. I spent a good portion of Saturday morning on the phone with him.....Talk about customer service. You won't find to many that will call you on a Saturday morning to work out details on a tank layout. This is an area where most if not all of us skimp when it comes to setting up our tanks. We normally just pump water back from the sump to the tank, with no real logic or theory on how we should use the flow efficiently to achieve what we are after.
The design you have shown correctly illustrates proper use of flow.....Meaning most of us figure, that if we can see water entering the overflow box are system is running correctly or it's working efficiently. Which in theory it's probably not efficient or working correctly. You want to see the surface moving, and you want to force/direct water to that overflow, not just let it meander haphazardly to the overflow which so many of us do.......
OK thanks for that
so made a set of drawings again with my original idea first and after your suggestion as I think you forwarded them I hope?
first set was my original plan of making outlet nozzles

second set is how I think you proposed? You still think it would be better or anyone else have any comments or other suggestions?
 
acrylic51

acrylic51

Active Member
I think the 2nd set is better for the mere fact your tank will have a rolling "barrel" effect. This pattern is very good at moving large volumes of water, but more importantly keeping crud suspended in the water column where it can be picked up by the overflow and removed from the DT......
Anyone?????
 
dirk_brijs

dirk_brijs

Member
Maybe I should go to a split outlet?
so 2 outlets per pipe?
One at the glass one towards the middle?
My concern at just at the glass will be rock work stopping the flow no?
What you think about this drawing?
 
acrylic51

acrylic51

Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by dirk_brijs http:///t/388194/concerns-about-new-tank-design-need-your-help#post_3422878
Maybe I should go to a split outlet?
so 2 outlets per pipe?
One at the glass one towards the middle?
My concern at just at the glass will be rock work stopping the flow no?
What you think about this drawing?

The drawing your showing now is again workable......Several things come into play though.....By you splitting the line that comes into the bottom your going to have to use valves to regulate how much flow to the back nozzle vs flow going to the front nozzle. Honestly I don't think it's possible unless the plumbing comes up through the bottom vs how it's shown here......Basically if we look at the tank from back to front. Where the single nozzle is in the rear; technically the valve would have to be placed after the nozzle to regulate flow to that nozzle and it would dictate how much flow to the front nozzles. It would be easier if the front and back were fed by separate lines IMO......
The nozzles you have shown located in the back of the tank would actually fire/push along the bottom of the tank, vs blowing against the back of possibly your rock work......The nozzles on the bottom front of the tank again you would want them blowing at a 45 degree angle towards the water surface.....This position along with the back nozzles blowing under your rock work, would push water towards the front panel, and in theory turn the water on a upward movement rolling off the front glass, where the front mounted nozzles will continue the roll/push of that water back up to the surface towards the overflow......The nozzles you have pictured along the top rim of the tank again will continue that roll ensuring that the water is moved/forced towards the overflow......
If I remember correctly you had talked about using SCWD's or OceansMotions in another thread.....I think your more in the same boat as I am with my build. I'm going to running 2 separate CL systems on mine. Again my goal is to let nothing settle in the bottom. I think you'll find your going to have to run theoretically 8 bulkheads/lines. Separate lines vs splitting lines to achieve good flow......
 
dirk_brijs

dirk_brijs

Member
ok will have to read up more in detail on what you just wrote though now
every individual nozzle can be easily be regulated though when using loc-line nozzles.

Nex question I have now is though what pump to use??
Was looking at the Reeflo Hybrid dart/Snapper? but are they available in 230V models???
What reeflo pumps beside the high presured ones are available in 230V models???
 
acrylic51

acrylic51

Active Member

This is an effective way of directing flow inside your DT and your firing the water back towards your overflow............
 
dirk_brijs

dirk_brijs

Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by acrylic51 http:///t/388194/concerns-about-new-tank-design-need-your-help#post_3423054

This is an effective way of directing flow inside your DT and your firing the water back towards your overflow............
Yes I understand the concept.
Issue though (forgot to mention too??) and maybe reason why I try to keep pushing the 2 sides flow is that it will be an open see through tank so the rock will be set up in islands in the middle of the tank more then on one side of the tank.
What you think?
 
acrylic51

acrylic51

Active Member
Your nozzles could be placed under your rock islands instead of in front as shown, but fire them towards the front glass to push water from back of tank and up front panel and your spray nozzles along front panel top will force water to over flow.
No real need for a big pressure pump. After conversation with OM on head loss issue the loss you would see would be your fittings!!!!:flame:
 
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